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Two-Player Games for Mixed Skill Level Players?

Posted by Cliff on Thu Mar 16, 2006 06:55 PM
from the an-semi-level-playing-field dept.
koreth asks: "What are some good two-player games that a newbie can successfully play with a more seasoned gamer? I want to find a good console or PC game I can play with my girlfriend, who has only recently started gaming. Something cooperative would be great, but head-to-head is fine too. All the games we've tried are made for players of roughly the same skill level -- so either I end up dumbing my gameplay way down (no fun for me) or blowing her out of the water without much effort (no fun for her). Is there any game out there that gives two players tasks of varying difficulty to keep both of them engrossed, at the same time?"
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[+] Best 2+ Player Video Games? 279 comments
Twinbee asks: "I was wondering what you lot would consider the best 2+ player games of all time. Apart from games for mixed skill players, this has never been asked on Slashdot before, so it would be interesting to see. From my own experience and research, it looks as though a top 50 would include games such as Streetfighter 2, World of Warcraft, Speedball 2, Super Mario Kart, SWIV, Ikaruga, Stunt Car Racer, Super Monkey Ball, Puzzle Fighter, and Mario Party. Whether they are competitive or cooperative, Slippery slope or Perpetual comeback, 2-player or multiplayer, retro or cutting edge, I want to hear them! I would prefer MMOG games not to be included, unless there is a good deal of interaction between the people in the 'same house' (e.g. perhaps they can team up and play against the world)."
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  • Coop all the way (Score:5, Insightful)

    by toleraen (831634) on Thursday March 16 2006, @06:56PM (#14937904)
    You're probably best off going coop games. If you're going PC games, any MMOG would probably do the trick. There's a decently steep learning curve, but you can help each other out quite effectively. WoW is a really easy game to teach newbies: as a very casual gamer, my wife picked up on it pretty quickly.

    If you're not limiting yourself to PC, a Gamecube would be a good place to go. There are plenty of games for the veteran and the hardcore alike. Of course all I can think of is the NES days with coop games like Guerrilla War, the Double Dragon series, TMNT games, etc etc. Classic NES games are hard to beat. Easy to learn, but still a whole lot of fun! When I game with my wife, the NES probably gets used the most.
    • by JeffSh (71237) <[jeffslashdot] [at] [m0m0.org]> on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:29PM (#14938090)
      MMOG's are terrible for coop playing. anytime ive tried playing an MMOG with friends (starting at the same time) one of us would always have a little bit more time, so their character would end up advancing past the others in the game (both in level and "place" in the game).

      • by toleraen (831634)
        Well, since the submitter specifically asked about games to play with his significant other, I wouldn't worry about it too much. If my wife outleveled me in WoW, I dont think I'd be terribly upset =P You are right about MMOGs with other friends though...that's downright impossible to keep together!
      • City of Heroes has a very nice system that basically makes it nearly impossible for you to not be able to team with one other person.
        And it is so genre relevant that it isn't funny.
        After all, what would Batman be without his Robin or Batgirl? A sidekick is your friend indeed! ;)
    • by Morgaine (4316) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:38PM (#14938144)
      Guild Wars can give you the best of both online and offline gaming. Just you and your GF (plus AI henchmen) as you don't want other players to intrude on the two of you, no subscription fees, and none of the griefing you get in other MMOGs.

      Plus, a huge and wonderfully detailed world for the two of you to explore and to battle against, with no xp grinding, nor any of the other traditional MMOG timesinks that make some other popular worlds so tedious. The time saved can then be used ... on other things. :P

      Recommended.
      • by ReverendLoki (663861) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:48PM (#14938193)
        I second this recommendation. Most standard MMOGs have a lot of grind forming a huge timesink, and if you are restricting it to times when you both can play, advancement will be even slower. Guildwars has a lot less grind to it, and you can make real progress in the time you play it, really conveying a sense of achievement. Plus, each account currently has slots for 4 characters, so you can also create another ton to play solo with. It's also decently easy to pick up and become good at (it's becoming great at it which is difficult... reminds me of those old Othello commercials).
    • Re:Coop all the way (Score:4, Interesting)

      by cgenman (325138) on Friday March 17 2006, @12:46AM (#14939767) Homepage
      The nice thing about sports games is that they all support co-op play. The bad thing about sports games is that she has to like some team sport, and so do you. This could be soccer, hockey, college basketball, or the rarer polo / lacrosse, etc.

      Rhythm music games are also a good choice, as A: most of them support independent difficulty levels and B: they're very easy to pick up. Dance Dance Revolution is a good starting point. Karaoke Revolution is a good one too. When Beatmania comes out in the west later this year, if she has any inclination I'd recommend it as well.

      Guitar Hero unfortunately doesn't have independent difficulty settings (Sorry!) but it's still worth picking up if I do say so myself.

      Another one that can be fun are RTS games. Yes, RTS games. If you're better / geekier than she is, just start her out on a map with a thousand strong horde of hideously beweaponed Orcish disembowlers, and take for yourself one small pikeman on a donkey. Most RTS games allow for this large degree of balancing, so find a theme that both of you can appreciate (or, let's be honest, she can appreciate), and run with it.

      You do get some nice dynamics in Shoot-em-ups where you can wind up protecting the lesser player, or they can valliantly die trying to save you. If both of you actually like the masochistic shooter formula then you could do much worse than Ikaruga [wikipedia.org]. Any game that lets player 2 take lives from player 1 is good.

      And as other posters pointed out, Guild Wars is a winner, fighting games have a large degree of balancing, MMORPG's are great but keep your characters at a similar level, etc.

      • Re:Coop all the way (Score:3, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward
        Gamecube, thirded, especially the first-party titles:

        - Mario Kart: Double Dash has a coop mode where one person drives and the other chucks stuff and creates sparks for acceleration. You can switch positions at any time.

        - Mario Power Tennis: Play doubles vs the computer. Lots of fun. The Chain Chomp game is one of the best mini-games I've ever seen.

        - Super Monkey Ball (2): I think there are 12 little mini-games, a LOT of fun for two or more people. Maybe 6 are great, the rest are alright but get old qui
  • by Anonymous Coward on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:01PM (#14937922)
    Your task will be killing her and her tasks will be running away, struggling with the keyboard and dying.
    • I've had to deal with a similar situation with a friend, except slightly modified where we were both 'hardcore' gamers. There was a time when our skill was rougly equal, with me winning more often than not. Then something kicked in and he got amazingly good. (as an aside, I don't "just suck". Other than he, I'm still arguably the best UT99 or UT2k4 player I know, and I go to an engineering school and live with 7 other guys, all of whom play the game)

      He liked to play 1on1 deathmatch, and our 1on1 rounds

      • I used to play Q1 with some guys who were completely inept. Eventually I just started what I termed the choo-choo train, where I'd run laps on dm6 with the grenade launcher, with the firebutton held in. They never succeeded in killing me, and I had a hilarious time just seeing their faces as they were trying to get each other with the shot gun only to see me running through the room with a hail of explosions following.
  • by Vaevictis666 (680137) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:05PM (#14937944)
    Most fighting games have a handicap system that essentially alters the damage dealt. Turn your damage way down, and hers way up, and then tweak them as she learns the system. I can particularly recommend Super Smash Brothers Melee for this, as it even has an auto-handicap system.
  • Girlfriend? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by jollyroger1210 (933226) <jollyroger1210@g ... .com minus berry> on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:09PM (#14937974) Homepage Journal
    Theres this game I play with my girlfriend, but it's not a video game.... try it
  • by Jumbo Jimbo (828571) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:10PM (#14937977)
    Something less than complex is probably the way to go. My girlfriend doesn't enjoy playing PC games with me, but does enjoy playing Super Mario Kart on the gamecube - I know it's console but maybe that accounts for the easier learning curve, which is good as she's a relative novice at gaming.

    Another one, though I haven't played for years, that I would suggest would be Super Bomber Man or a sequel - easy to pick up and fun.

    And the person above who suggested a MMO has an excellent point, though depends how casual you want the gaming to be as they generally require a large investment of time.

  • Super Monkey Ball (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Swimmin' Pants (911939) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:12PM (#14937993)
    I can't stress enough the sheer multiplayer bliss that can be found in the first Super Monkey Ball. It's a game that gets played a lot whenever my family gets together.

    Particularly the minigame "Monkey Target." No matter your skill level, you can have loads of fun; the game is competitive, but in a way that doesn't make it less fun if you get completely obliterated by your opponent. The sounds, colors, and animations make it easy to laugh about doing poorly, to the point where you don't even care who wins or loses. It's a lot of fun, either way.

    Plus, the cute graphics will probably make it easy for your girlfriend to get into.
  • by RingDev (879105) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:14PM (#14938008) Homepage Journal
    My wife and I are currently playing Dungeon Siege together. It is simple enough that any one with point and click experience and basic math skills can excel at it, but entertaining enough to keep you clicking forward.

    -Rick
  • by ynohoo (234463) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:14PM (#14938010) Homepage Journal
    the ancient oriental game of Go [google.com] has has an excellent handicap system that keeps the game interesting, no matter how wide the skill difference.
  • by BertieBaggio (944287) * on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:16PM (#14938021) Homepage

    'Cause if it does, I feel I should quote C-3P0:

    I suggest a new strategy, R2: let the wookie win.

    Seriously though, if you are up for 'lets work together', and don't mind sharing the controller/keyboard, I would recommend something more puzzle & adventure oriented. Could be a point 'n click, but it doesn't have to be. I mean, some of the older Tomb Raiders were good in this respect (puzzles); just remember to look at other parts of the screen once in a while or your plan may backfire. Let's face it, FPS' are more reaction time and fine motor control -- which can be fun -- but I have a sneaking suspicion your better half will appreciate something more cerebral.

    If you really do want a truly 2 player game, I would recommend something coop. If you have Half Life and more than one computer (and what self-respecting geek doesn't?), then give Sven Co-op [svencoop.com] a try. Play through Half Life co-operatively. There is also a huge map pack avaliable with decent maps; not all of which are quick-blast-everything-that-moves. Other choices include other coop games, such as Halo 2. I'm sure you can think of others without too much effort; eg sports games, racing games usually have > 1 player mode built-in, at least for consoles.

    Personally, I'd go for the one that gets you the most thanks-for-thinking-of-me-honey... points.

  • DDR/Stepmania (Score:3, Informative)

    by merreborn (853723) * on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:23PM (#14938052) Homepage Journal
    DDR lets each player select their own difficulty level.

    There's a open source knock off called step mania that's more feature-rich. Thousands of songs for step mania are available on the net, and you can add your own.
  • LEGO Star Wars, WC3 (Score:5, Informative)

    by Kaimelar (121741) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:25PM (#14938067) Homepage
    LEGO Star Wars is a very fun co-op game . . . it even allows you to drop in/out at any point, which is great if the phone rings, the oven timer goes off, etc. It's not terribly long, but the sequel will be out soon. :-)

    On the PC side, WarCraft III might be a good idea -- you can play against AI opponants, and select various handicaps for each player if desired.

    Puzzle games are a lot of fun to play together, too -- my wife and I have played Bookworm together and had quite the good time.
  • by smaerd (954708) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:28PM (#14938080)
    ...beating each other with live cats.

    It's a little tricky setting up a game, but if you put about three ounces of rum in waterdish, they're easy to catch. That said, it's more fun to do it with sober cats... their claws have a higher chance of being extended at any given point in time.

    Now, if you start to get the knack of the game before she does, just drug her cat more. Her cat won't be as painful, but she'll be able to swing it harder without it trying to claw her eyes out.

    After a few rounds, you'll both be laughing, exhausted, and covered in each others' blood.

    Oh, and if you're both knocked unconcious, the cats will eat you. They'll start with with your tongues, btw.
  • Mario Party (Score:5, Informative)

    by Cy Sperling (960158) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:31PM (#14938103)
    My wife and I play a lot of Mario Party together. It has some tweakable handicapping anda pretty short learning curve. We usually play against 2 other computer controlled players. That sets up a nice dynamic where we can be competitive with each other but cooperative in screwing over the computer controlled players.

    Another great Japanese game is "Ribbit King"- http://www.ribbitking.com/about.htm [ribbitking.com] sort of a weird golf game where you launch frogs off of a catapult to ultimately get the frog into the hole. You score points for getting teh frog to cover larger distances and interact with the dense kooky environment. It has a lot of charm goofiness and just the right amount of skill to be fun and never frustrating.
  • doom II? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by way2trivial (601132) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:37PM (#14938141) Homepage Journal
    deathmatch or Coop- I think it's great for this..

    if you REALLY KNOW YOUR MAPS, find some custom ones,

    if you really need to, restrict yourself to weapons BELOW 5, give here whataver she can locate to use...

    my wife really warmed up to it kinda quickly....

  • by egomaniac (105476) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:49PM (#14938201) Homepage
    World of Warcraft is a remarkably good couples' game. My wife and I play it whenever we get a chance and she's just as addicted to it as I am. I know a bunch of female WoWers -- it seems to appeal to women (even ones that don't like computer games) far more than most games.

    On top of that, it's a cooperative game which requires no particular amount of skill.
  • by *BBC*PipTigger (160189) on Thursday March 16 2006, @07:52PM (#14938220) Journal
    Look no further than:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puzzle_Fighter [wikipedia.org]

    This game strikes an amazing balance by being both compelling for serious competition and entertaining for casual play. David Sirlin has a relevant article (http://sirlin.net/archive/slippery-slope-and-perp etual-comeback/ [sirlin.net]) describing "perpetual comeback" as it pertains to Puzzle Fighter and why it makes that game so very fun.

    Are you still looking further?

    Well then...

    Another example of perpetual comeback is the fighting system in Battle Arena Toshinden (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_Arena_Toshind en [wikipedia.org]) where each character has usually two special moves (in addition to their normal repertoire) that they can only perform once their health gets very low (i.e., they are about to be knocked-out). These moves (sometimes referred to as "desperation moves") usually do a great deal of damage and can easily turn the tide of a round or just win the round outright so they add cool intensity to the conclusion of many matches (even when one player is notably superior because they need to be extra careful to avoid getting hit by one or more of these "come-back" moves). These moves can be difficult to perform for those uninitiated to the common fireball and yoga-flame joystick movements they typically require but they totally have the best risk-vs.-reward benefit when a player is learning the game. I'd recommend studying and practicing the execution of those moves first to new players. Additionally, some characters have very easy ones like (if I remember correctly) Ellis and Sophia only need to press back, forward, back, forward + Triangle to do theirs. Choose an easy and fast character to start with until you learn enough to venture out.

    Of course there are some fun cooperative experiences (like Halo or MMOs) but if your partner shows an affinity for, and appreciation of, games requiring increasing reflexive (a.k.a. "twitch") skill, I would highly recommend the plethora of http://shmups.com/ [shmups.com] out there. Ikaruga (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ikaruga [wikipedia.org]) must be mentioned as one of the greatest here. All threatening bullets and beams are either white (with blue highlights) or black (with red highlights). Similarly, each players' ship can flip over to alternate between those colors as well. When you're the same color as bullets, you absorb them into your shield and they store in a meter which can be unleashed as homing shots. When you are the opposite color of enemy ships, your shots do double-damage (but you're vulnerable to their bullets because they are the same color as them). It makes for awesome tension because the whole screen can be completely covered in bullets but at least half of it is always survivable space if you're the same color as the bullets occupying that space. Check out "bullet-eater" mode too. You can beat lots of levels without firing a shot (i.e., by just alternating to the right colors and dodging terrain features).

    Another great one is Raiden Project (http://gamespot.com/ps/action/raidenproject/index .html [gamespot.com]) if you can find it for the old original PlayStation. That game had very interesting cooperative properties where certain shots would change characteristics and trajectory if they hit your friend's ship so sometimes it would be strategic to try to stay vertically aligned together (or overlay each other) to benefit from these special shots.

    There are lots of great cooperative Shmups but the only directly competitive one I have yet encountered is astonishingly fun. It is called Twinkle Star Sprites (http://en.wiki [wikipedia.org]
  • Lego Star Wars (Score:4, Informative)

    by Kredal (566494) on Thursday March 16 2006, @08:01PM (#14938259) Homepage Journal
    It's got a great co-op mode, doesn't rely on both players being skilled, but has some parts that need you to work together and communicate on...

    It's available for consoles and the PC, and is a really fun game. (:
  • Mario Party (Score:3, Informative)

    by Dixie_Flatline (5077) <`jan' `at' `ea.com'> on Thursday March 16 2006, @08:07PM (#14938279) Homepage
    Any of the Mario Party series is ideal, since a lot of the games just rely on bashing on the buttons or doing something that dosen't necessarily take the hand-eye coordination of an experienced gamer. And if you find that you're kicking the crap out of her anyway, you can play it co-op.

    WarioWare is also good, because the games are so random that even an experienced gamer doesn't have a huge advantage.
  • Tekken... (Score:3, Informative)

    by ikarys (865465) on Thursday March 16 2006, @08:11PM (#14938296)
    It's great :) Any version of Tekken. You can learn all the moves, and get uber good at it, and have really high end matches that feel intellectual and thought out ... and then still get ur ass whipped by an unpredictable button masher.
  • a few games (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Polo (30659) * on Thursday March 16 2006, @08:18PM (#14938341) Homepage
    You know, there's really NO POINT to play a game that pits you against
    your girlfriend. Really, relationships are about cooperation, and there's
    a lot to benefit from an adrenaline experience if you're both on the
    same side. Show her things and help her up, stay away from
    the smack-down.

    Anyway, a few games from different genres...

    Katamari Damacy 1 is a really fun off-kilter game, but the 2-player mode is
    not that fun. I don't know about We Love Katamari (the 2nd in the series), but
    I think they fixed the multiplayer. It's quirky, simple to pick up and addictive.

    I think Dungeon Siege & DS2 are pretty good cooperative games for RPG-type
    games. Fighting is relatively easy and you can help each other. It's an
    attractive game too. Go out of your way to share the loot.

    For shooter games, Serious Sam and Serious Sam 2 are really
    fun cooperative games. They might be more guy games. I've
    had lots of fun attacking 300-foot-tall monsters with my friends.
    It doesn't matter about skill, because the better players just help protect
    the beginners and there is plenty of work to go around. Weapons
    and ammo that appear always have multiple copies, so there's no
    fighting over stuff.

    It's too bad that cooperative games are not as popular as they should
    be. I think it's because it requires extra effort and tweaking that most
    publishers don't bother with.

    Maybe if review sites put "cooperative play" or "family play" on their
    checklists, it might help with the situation.
  • by dextromulous (627459) on Thursday March 16 2006, @09:02PM (#14938601) Homepage

    Why not play a card or board game or something else altogether?

    It is very easy to "mod" a RL game so that you can even the playing field. Examples follow:

    • "Risk" like games: Different distribution levels of armies.
    • "Go" like games: One player starts with more pieces on the board.
    • "Monopoly" like games: Start one player with a few properties.
    I could go on, but you get the point (I hope.)

    There are also some games that lend themselves better to n00bs like Cribbage... I can't count the number of times I've been beaten by people who just started playing, and I've been playing it for almost 20 years.

  • sex (Score:3, Funny)

    by papasui (567265) on Thursday March 16 2006, @09:36PM (#14938787)
    I believe the 2 player game you are looking for is sex. Try not to blow her out of the water (unless she's still into that, haven't seen her in a while).
  • by NitsujTPU (19263) on Thursday March 16 2006, @09:49PM (#14938878)
    I want to find a good console or PC game I can play with my girlfriend, who has only recently started gaming.

    Lots of people on Slashdot play this game where they have girlfriends. It's fun to pretend!
  • by ThousandStars (556222) on Thursday March 16 2006, @10:17PM (#14939051) Homepage
    In my experience, most computer games that aren't built on some kind of card or board game and such require an intense level of dedication to build skill. That's much of their appeal to the obsessive Slashdot crowd. Unfortunately, they often don't have any mechanism for leveling the skill playing field. Some, like the MMO's that other posters recommend, may be even worse because they demand time instead of skill.

    I think you might want to reconsider your premise: your girlfriend, if she is unwilling to immerse herself in the games, might just not be that interested in video games. You may also ask yourself whether your girlfriend really wants to play, or if she is just acquiescing to your hobbies. If the latter is the case, you might find that her ardor wears off and the games become a burden on your relationship. Finding activities that are genuinely, mutually enjoyable would be a better bet if this is the case. Note that I'm not saying it is: you're the one in the relationship and you must trust your own judgment.

    As another alternative, you could try something like Go [wikipedia.org], a board game with a natural way of leveling the skill barrier by giving one side a handicap. Otherwise, I you could be on a quest for something that doesn't exist.

  • Worms! (Score:5, Informative)

    by xchino (591175) on Friday March 17 2006, @01:56AM (#14939977)
    All of my friends, ecen the non gamers play Worms World Party, it's easy to learn, a blast to play multiplayer, and only requires one PC and will run on very old hardware (100MHZ, 32MB). Being turn based makes it a bit easier on noobs who can't compete with your highly trained reaction times as a gamer. Chicks especially love Worms for the cute factor. It's also playable by people of all ages, so it's something you can play with your kids.
    • by Hannah E. Davis (870669) on Thursday March 16 2006, @08:07PM (#14938278) Journal
      "You don't want to frag your significant other, you want to frag the NPC that layed a hand on her."

      Speak for yourself :) If I'd managed to get my Horde rogue to 60 while I was still with my last boyfriend, his Alliance priest would have been going down.

      I've ganked/fragged previous boyfriends in online games too, and been ganked/fragged by them too -- I find it more fun than cooperating, actually, because I get to show off, be as vicious as I want, and ideally become a better player while I'm at it.
    • by The Famous Brett Wat (12688) on Thursday March 16 2006, @10:28PM (#14939110) Homepage Journal
      Yeah, the title says a lot, but I wish you'd elaborated a little. I would have modded you up instead of replying. Let that be a lesson to you.

      Anyhow, I also vote for "Dance Dance Revolution" and its ilk (see StepMania [stepmania.com] if your platform is a computer, not a console). If you haven't played before, then it's a toss-up as to whether you or your GF is going to be the better player, so the whole skill disparity thing may not be an issue. Even if you're a relatively experienced player, it's possible for two to play at widely different skill levels. And then, ultimately, it doesn't matter who wins: you mostly play to beat your personal best.

      On top of all that, it's a great way to get exercise. Be entertained and get fit at the same time. Get experienced enough that the soft mats don't cut it for you anymore, and upgrade to the hard platforms. Get good enough that you can go for half an hour on the hardest levels and work up such a drenching sweat that you both need to shower afterwards.

      DDR: a healthy addiction.