How to Deal With an Aging Brain?

An anonymous reader writes "I'm sure this is something all older Slashdotters are aware of: as I get older my once-sharp brain is, well, getting worse. In particular, I'm not able to remember things as well as I once did. As a geek my capacity in this area was always what defined me as a geek. Nowadays things seem to go in OK, but then leak out. A few weeks later I've mostly forgotten. So, I ask Slashdot: how do you cope with your mind getting older? What's your trick? Fish-oil? Brain Training on the DS? Exercise? Or just trying harder to remember things?"

Or..

[by Anonymous Coward]

Simply take yourself out of situations where it matters ;p

Seriously though.. where I work a lot of the "older guy's" tend to migrate into roles where they don't need to keep mountains of info bouncing around their head all the time. Roles where people come to them for guidance and advice.. but don't expect them to know the ins and outs of the systems. Let the young guys be the walking encyclopedias while you chill-ax into retirement.

Re:Or..

[weave (48069)]

Yeah, that's called management -- and it makes things worse if you really care. You get out of doing the fun stuff day to day and spend it all in meetings and dealing with personnel issues. It quickly speeds up the brain rot. :-(

Who should manage then?

[jotaeleemeese (303437)]

Something younger technical people forget is that managing a group of people requires more skills than knowing how to obfuscate a perl script.

If technical people are great problem solvers they could apply the skills, allegedly learned doing "fun" stuff, to the problem of implementing productive teams of techies.

This nonsense about management being a dead end for techies needs to be put to rest frankly, a good manager will enable technical people to do their job by isolating them from all the bullshit that comes from higher hierarchical levels while at the same time setting realistic objectives for all the parties involved. Having being a techie should be a great plus for somebody managing other techies, not an artificial hindrance.

Re:Or..

[Anrego (830717)]

I like to think you need a combination of old stubborn guys deeply set in their way.. and new young go-getters fresh out of academia with all sorts of "agile methodologies".

What you said is true.. if your entire management thinks CS died with COBOL .. then you're in trouble..

On the other hand if your entire management is young go-getters with little experience in the realities of software.. all sorts of bad things happen (*cough* executable uml)

The constant struggle between the new guys to get some of the neat stuff they saw in uni into the mix and the old guys who think it's all a bunch of nonsense will in the right balance lead to a happy medium.

Depends on how much money you want to put into it

[Hojima (1228978)]

You can try neurofeedback which is a direct way to train the brain. Research this since there is a lot information out there, both for the expert and layman.

Another way.

[MustBeOriginal (1412933)]

One trick is to tell them stories that don't go anywhere.

Like that time I took the ferry over to Shelbyville; I needed a new heel for my shoe. So, I decided to go to Morganville, which is what they called Shelbyville in those days. So I tied an onion to my belt, which was the style at the time. Now, to take the ferry cost a nickel, and in those days, nickels had pictures of bumblebees on them. 'Give me five bees for a quarter,' you'd say.

Now where were we?

Oh yeah, the important thing was that I had an onion on my belt, which was the style at the time.

Re:Or..

[theaveng (1243528)]

+1

And I'll add a little quote from Albert Einstein: "Why bother to meoorize that which you can look up in a book?" The ability to DO the problem and solve the equations is more important than to remember how many megabits a PCI Express can carry.

Re:Or..

[weave (48069)]

plus you now have someone who is inflexible and deeply entrenched in their ways managing

You're absolutely right, which is why I do my best to NOT manage like that. I have some very talented staff who are doing amazing things. All I do anymore is sit back in my chair and say "make it so" and die a little more inside.

Maybe improve your diet and exercise?

[dzelenka (630044)]

I bet this suggestion gets ignored completely! This IS Slashdot after all!

Re:Maybe improve your diet and exercise?

[yog (19073)]

There is evidence [mayoclinic.com] that physical exercise helps to improve memory. It's not known exactly why, but one can speculate that enhanced circulation will bring more oxygen and nutrients to the brain, keeping neurons well fed.

Also, using the brain is strongly correlated with intellectual acuity:

Do calculations in your head. E.g. add up grocery prices at the store.

Use mnemonics. E.g., your friend introduces his two sons Sam and Bill. Bi l l is the o l der one.

Read books. Unlike the single-screen attention span required for web reading, books require a longer span. Think about the book and discuss it with friends afterwards.

Get off google. Looking things up that you "used to know" encourages mental laziness. Make yourself really think back and reconstruct (i.e., refresh old neural pathways) and you will be surprised at how much you can remember.

Meditation, prayer, yoga, hypnosis. These are activities that turn off the mental chatter and help improve concentration.

Challenge your mind. My mother-in-law, in her 70s, does a sudoku puzzle every day. There is evidence that such exercises contribute to improved acuity. Sudoku, crosswords, other puzzles all can be helpful.

Review. First thing in the morning, look at your schedule, look over the specs, study the code, whatever info you might find helpful to recall later that day, instead of reading the Times or the sports news.

Get off drugs. Reduce coffee and alcohol intake and detox your brain. Especially, alcohol and recreational drugs have a numbing effect on the mind and destroy memory capacity.

Herbal supplements. This is controversial at this time. Some claim positive effects from gingko and other herbal extracts, and others claim no effects have been found. It may help you.

Good luck! The brain does change over time, but it's possible to youthen your brain through conscious effort. Ultimately you can enjoy the advantages of the wisdom born of age and a strong intellect and clear memory.

I use gun.

[by Anonymous Coward]

I keep a gun at work. My manager is aware of the weapon.

At the last performance evaluation, he told me that the quality of my work was borderline due to the fact that I simply could not remember things. We worked out a plan that if I "qualify" for termination in the next layoff, then I will simply pull out the gun and blow my brains out.

If I cannot survive in the competitive American market place, then I should not live. Most Americans support the concept that a nation is a free-market place. If you cannot compete, then you deserve to die. Hence, America does not have national health insurance: losers should die.

Since I choose to live in America, I (and my manager) accept the rules of the free market.

Re:I use gun.

[MillionthMonkey (240664)]

I keep a gun at work. My manager is aware of the weapon.

Not my manager. Sweetness is hiding in my desk waiting for her big day.

Re:I use gun.

[Hal_Porter (817932)]

Keep in mind, that psychosis tends to diminish your effective mental ability. If you actually want to keep your job and perform well, the first thing you'd do is try to drop this irrational suicide-complex. (After that, you might want to consider that you don't actually care that much about your performance, and that you are living an act of collectivist desperation.)

Something you might want to consider is that you are engaging in the oldest and most inefficient form of collectivism: self-debasement to a figure of power, wrapped up in a mystical sheath of righteousness and "power".

Get psychological help while you're still drawing breath and a salary.

WHO ARE YOU CALLING A PSYCHO?!

Re:Or..

[couchslug (175151)]

"a lot of the "older guy's" tend to migrate into roles where they don't need to keep mountains of info bouncing around their head all the time."

Hello! Welcome to Wal-Mart.

Re:Growing up, not older.

[lysergic.acid (845423)]

is that why you're always misplacing your keys and finding the phone in the fridge?

people become senile as they get older because the brain, like the rest of your body, deteriorates with age. how much it deteriorates depends on how you live. unfortunately, as many people get older they become less and less active, and it becomes a vicious cycle.

if you learn to place chess when you're young, and you never stop playing chess, you'll still be able to play quite well even in your old age. you won't be as fast as you were in your mid-20's, but you'll probably still be fast in your mid 80's as you were in your mid-to-late-30's. as long as you keep your brain active, the areas that you use regularly will not degrade very much. so yes, in theory if everyone remained active in their golden years, their brain will still function quite well in all the ways "that matter." but that's not how things are in reality.

in reality people become less active, both physically and mentally, as they age. they don't push themselves as hard mentally, and they also stop stretching their mind/creativity. senior citizens also tend to be less socially active, and a lack of regular social interaction/stimulation can also lead to mental decline.

it's got nothing to do with performing menial work for others. neurological degradation is not the same as becoming wiser. nor is becoming more and more useless the same as becoming sager.

Re:Growing up, not older.

[cbiltcliffe (186293)]

I could not imagine not pushing myself mentally, regardless of how old I get.
Sitting around doing nothing would bore the crap out of me after a few days, and I'd have to go fix something.

Re:Growing up, not older.

[puto (533470)]

Really most studies show that mans brain power peaks at age 39, and I can say as someone approaching that age, I have never been more mentally capable as I was in my mid to late 30s. And I am 39 next month. Mylein peaks and then degenerates after 39, in recent studies, so mid 20s is out the window. I learned spanish fluently at age 31. Granted I was in Colombia and that was all I could speak. My father went to lawchool at 46, graduated at 52, top of his class, and, three years later had a phd in philosophy, again top of his class. Your mid 20's is nothing but hormonal and easy to get over hangover age. I did not come into my own physically and mentally until I passed 30.

I feel my mind going.......

[Vinegar Joe (998110)]

I think I'll take over the spaceship and kill all the astronauts.

Newer Version Available

[cob666 (656740)]

Isn't there a firmware upgrade that fixes this yet?

Re:Newer Version Available

[nog_lorp (896553)]

No, when you get older it is called "software" instead of firmware.

Testosterone

[Sybert42 (1309493)]

I had an elective castration, and am on testosterone replacement after I found myself not remembering as well as I did before. Really helped in that area. Check your levels to see if they warrant some replacement.

First thing, Ouch...

[Rachel Lucid (964267)]

Secondly, I wonder if this testosterone effect is the same / similar in women. (I'm pretty sharp, but I'm also suffering from excessive testosterone... well, for a chick anyway.)

Re:First thing, Ouch...

[Rachel Lucid (964267)]

... Aside from the body hair, do you really see this as a problem? ;)

Re:Testosterone

[dr_dank (472072)]

I had an elective castration

Congratulations on your recent marriage.

Re:Testosterone

[K. S. Kyosuke (729550)]

No, he is just a Eunuchs user, like many of us.

Re:Testosterone

[The Mighty Buzzard (878441)]

Ye flipping gods! I've never been so glad GNU is Not Unix.

Help me out here...

[ettlz (639203)]

Why did I click "Read More" again? Back I go, retrace the steps...

Your choices are not complete

[zappepcs (820751)]

Choose 'all of the above' and anything else that keeps your mind active. Brain health is a topic with a huge volume of data on the Internet. Recent additions to the pile of info is that cannabis (THC) may help retard onset of senility. There are many things you can do. Your wetware is chemically based, and so any particular concoction that works wonders for anyone else many not work at all for you. The goal would be to match physical traits of yourself to those that benefit most from various remedies. If you are overweight, look for brain health options that seem to work for diabetics etc.

That's what I'm doing. Find best matches and experiment. So far so good. I think.

Piracetam & Other Nootropics

[slifox (605302)]

I recommend Piracetam: the first Nootropic ("smart drug").

It is extremely safe, and is widely used in Europe to help reverse the effects of aging and to help against the deterioration of memory, among other things (note: I am not a doctor).

There are numerous forums and communities on nootropics, both for anti-aging and productivity-boosting needs. However, make sure you take the advice from those places with the appropriately-sized grain of salt, and always double-check everything with a proper medical resource (i.e. peer-reviewed studies).

I won't get into the details here, because I already did that in an older post (related to stimulants, but it is nonetheless relevant here too). Yes, I guess this qualifies as karma whoring ;)

My previous post on Piracetam: http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=562684&cid=23523554 [slashdot.org]

Wikipedia on Piracetam: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piracetam [wikipedia.org]

Erowid on Nootropics: http://www.erowid.org/smarts/ [erowid.org]

The Racetam Nootropics

[EmotionToilet (1083453)]

Actually, there is an entire class of racetams that can be used and each of them act a little different. Piracetam is considered the weakest of them all, and Pramiracetam is considered the strongest. I use Aniracetam and find that it helps quite a bit. When you stack them (Piracetam + Aniracetam) they work synergistically and you get an even stronger effect. Because they tend to use up your brains acetylcholine faster, people usually have to take a choline supplement with them a few times a week. The best form that I've found is alpha-GPC. It is the most bioavailable of choline supplements. The best part about these is that there are no side effects, even at high doses. Wiki - Racetam Class [wikipedia.org]

Re:The Racetam Nootropics

[gardyloo (512791)]

When you stack them (Piracetam + Aniracetam) they work synergistically and you get an even stronger effect.

The use of "synergistically" in a serious manner automatically disqualifies everything else one says.

Re:Piracetam & Other Nootropics

[MillionthMonkey (240664)]

I'm not sure but I think Piracetam has been asociated with anxiety and irritability, although it's generally considered to have minor side effects.

I took another one of the racetams (Levetiracetam, trade name Keppra) for epileptic seizures. Besides being an anti-epileptic drug, Levetiracetam is considered a nootropic, and I do remember feeling that it made me a little sharper. It's structurally similar to piracetam- it has an extra ethyl group. But I can't imagine anyone wanting to take this stuff to get more intelligence. The psychological side effects are just too nasty.

Not everyone reacts to it the way I did. Some people experience no side effects at all, and really like it. But for me this was an amazing drug. I would take it, note the time, and brace for it. After 20 minutes, thoughts would start to fill my head- first reflective thoughts, then bittersweet thoughts, becoming morose ones, and an hour later it was a full blown depression. It felt like I was being crushed by a little pill, if that makes any sense.

I actually was able to focus well on this drug, but I was really pissed the whole time. I was angry that I had to do whatever I was doing, even if I could do it well. I did more chores and resented every minute of it. At work I would snap at people and have to apologize an hour later. That got old really fast. I gave things to my wife and asked her to hide them from me, because I would get overwhelmed by sudden impulses to smash whatever I was holding against the floor. It changed the importance I attributed to things- so that I would get incredibly annoyed by the stupidest little stuff. If something was even a little annoying without Keppra, it became intolerable under its influence. This is a well-known symptom; it even has a name: "Kepp-rage". I caused a lot of trouble.

After months of this my emotions sort of dulled out and faded away, except for occasional hostile impulses that I was able to recognize as the drug. It was a little helpful with the seizures. But then I went to my next doctor appointment and as soon as he saw me he took me off of it. "I can see you have a flattened affect." No kidding, it was flatter than Kansas.

Supplements

[Midnight Ryder (116189)]

One of my solutions to the problem is a good set of vitamins. I tend to shy away from stuff like Centrum, and use multi-vitamin packs with a little more "kick" to them (and are a heck of a lot more soluable in the digestive system), and B12 sublingual drops.

If I have to ask myself the question "how long was it since I took my vitamins?" then the answer is probably about three days - that's how long it take for them to wear off on me.

As with a lot of processes in our bodies, good nutritian helps the brain considerably. Eat right, exersize, and take a good multi vitamin, and you'll probably see a lot of the memory issues go away. It works for me anyway - as with any random commenter on /., YMMV :-)

Re:Supplements

[nixman99 (518480)]

Either your diet is *terrible*, or you're taking pills you DO NOT need. Don't believe me? Do some minimal research.

I suggest you do some minimal research on vitamin absorption and aging. (hint - it doesn't get better). You are correct that most under 30's don't need vitamins, but by the time you hit 40, B12, C, and D aren't absorbed as well. For mental functioning, B12 is the big one. You can Google "vitamin absorption aging" and your favorite vitamin, or read a few of these:
B12 [oregonstate.edu]
B12 [nytimes.com]
C [oregonstate.edu]
D [nih.gov]

Replace memorization with wisdom and intelligence

[xzvf (924443)]

Can't say more than that. I've seen many young hotshots that can run rings around me as day to day sysadmins. What I've became good at, as a sysadmin, is fixing something once and then automating the fix. I forget pretty quickly how I fixed the problem before, but I can always read the comments in the script I wrote to make sure it doesn't happen again.

let the computer remember stuff

[Punto (100573)]

The notion that memory == intelligence is just wrong. Just get over it, and let a computer do all the memory for you. Use your brain for what it's uniquely qualified to do.

Brain Workshop

[De Lemming (227104)]

This recent Slashdot thread [slashdot.org] (and the accomplishing article [timesonline.co.uk]) discussed the effectiveness of brain training games.

In that thread, I pointed to Brain Workshop [sourceforge.net], an open source version of the game used in this [pnas.org] study by Susanne Jaeggi, a psychologist at the University of Michigan. The study deals with improving "fluid intelligence" - the part of your mind that deals directly with the raw newness of experience or, as defined by Jaeggi, "the ability to reason and to solve new problems independently of previously acquired knowledge."

Others pointed out there's also a Javascipt version [dual-n-back.com] that's much more light-weight.

Other way around for me...

[aztektum (170569)]

I use to be very anal about remembering every detail. As I've gotten older I'm less concerned with this. I use technology (Outlook calendar/tasks, smartphone, Google Calendar for personal) to remember less and remind me when needed. I only concern myself with concepts and only sweat the details when it comes to actually doing the job.

I feel far less stressed out than I did when I'd try to remember every little ol' thing simply because I thought I needed to be a pedantic nerd. As a bonus I'm realizing there is more to living contently and I feel I have more time to spend on other things.

On top of it all I also make sure to leave the damn things at home when I'm going to do something and don't want distractions. Work can pay me 24/7 if they want me to be available 24/7. Otherwise when I'm not at the office I don't really care.

I do still take the time to know the important things: Birthdays, anniversaries, etc..

I'm 47

[acvh (120205)]

and I've started making efforts to use external memory as much as possible: calendars, phonebooks, todo lists. All the things I didn't need 10 years ago.

i've been told that a good diet and exercise can help, but it's not THAT bad yet.

i forget people's names right after they introduce themselves. i lose my car keys every morning.

my daughter (8) is taking advantage of this; "daddy, remember you told me you'd take me to a movie." shit, maybe I did.

Try Memory Training

[cervo (626632)]

Seriously there are a ton of books out there on memory training and it works. Back in college I read quite a few of them and tried out some of the mnemonic techniques and they worked wonders, I can still recall some of the nonsense lists almost 10 years later. Ultimately to get really good requires a lot of time an effort which I was not willing to put into it.

Some Books

• Your Memory. How it works and how to improve it. -- Kenneth L Higbee -- One of the best books available on how the memory works as well as the mnemonic techniques
• The Memory Book -- Harry Lorayne and Jerry Lucas -- pretty good book with a bunch of different techniques
• Master Your Memory with Dr. Amazing: How not to Forget -- M Teitelbaum -- great book with many techniques not discussed in typical intro books on memory techniques

But as far as forgetting stuff, I noticed that I was forgetting left and right when I turned 23. The difference is that instead of just focusing on college or something else, I had a lot of shit going on in my life and was constantly distracted and that hurt my memory. Now it is even worse. I think as you get older and you have more of a life, you just are more distracted and a lot of stuff you just won't pay as much attention to to remember as much. I'll bet if you throw in kids forget it....

It's Google that causes it ...

[Lazy Jones (8403)]

Seriously, not having to remember things while you are sitting in front of your PC because you can always google for it is very bad for your memory ...

Technology replacement

[pwizard2 (920421)]

In my case, I simply use technology.

I'm 25, and I have a neurological condition called Dyspraxia which causes short-term memory problems, among other things. (My long term memory works fine, and you wouldn't notice anything unusual just by looking at me) On any given day, I can usually remember only one or two pieces of information at a time in my short term memory, and I used to constantly forget about assignments, appointments, things I was told to do five minutes ago, etc. Over the years, I've had to adapt to this problem by devising workarounds.

I used to write things down in a planner book and keep it with me, but I kept losing it or forgetting to bring it with me. To solve this problem once and for all, I began using a tool called Taskfreak [taskfreak.com] after a former co-worker told me about it. I have Taskfreak running on my server, and since it's a web app, I can check it from pretty much any location and at any time, unlike other software planners I tried in the past. Plus, its impossible to "lose" Taskfreak since it's never really in my possession to begin with. This tool has practically replaced my short-term memory, since the only thing I have to remember is to check it often. (The browser start pages on all my computers point to my taskfreak installation, so I see it every time I start Firefox or any other browser)

Why did this not happen until I'm old?

[rasper99 (247555)]

I started on a very, very cool tech R&D project in April at the age of 50. It's one of those things that is so involved that when anyone starts working there their brain swells up for the first month as it is filled up.

I have said many times why couldn't I be like 30 or 40 when my brain worked better and come across something like this?

I make up for the slowly decreasing short term storage by making a lot of notes. Make short term notes for what you are doing now. Then after the rush is over take a few minutes to flesh them out a little in case you have to do it again in a month and have forgotten what you did. It's not unmanly to make notes if it helps you kick the young whippersnapper's butts.

Don't multi-task as many things at once. This helps even the young. I used to work on six systems at a time. Now I do like two and get them right. If you're going to do things over and over take the time to script and automate if there is a ROI. Share the scripts, etc. with others to help save everyone time.

I draw on my 29 years of professional technical experience. I use the professional maturity gained over the years to spend an appropriate amount of time carefully crafting an important email or document. It ends up saving time in the long run.

Over the years you learn what works in business and what doesn't. Tech knowledge is important but learning how people and business works is important too.

I use my 29 years of IT experience in so many different things to my advantage. Last week I reduced a problem down to system tuning. I used those old skills and made a lot of people happy. In the old days system tuning was a way of life. Younger people who haven't dealt with low horsepower and don't do know things like that.

Use your experience with people and maturity gained over the years. I've got a deck of punch cards of assembly code on my desk to remind me how good I've been over the years. Today people can hardly imagine using assembly much less reading a dump. Might just have to do some of assembly in the future to get stuff to run faster.

Wrong problem

[mike_sucks (55259)]

Remembering stuff isn't what makes you a geek - remembering stuff is what your hard drive and the Internet is for. Being a geek is all about applying your one-eyed devotion to [hardware|software|cameras|games|knitting|etc] to the fullest extent and doing nifty things with it.

It's pretty well known that young people are better at raw ability where older people are better at anything that requires experience. So don't worry about forgetting stuff too much, concentrate on kicking arse with your experience.

If you are forgetting stuff, write it down. But keep on being a geek and stay fit, because mental and physical activity are two primary factors in retaining cognitive ability in old age.

/Mike

PS: wear sunscreen

Re:re Pay attention

[cjfs (1253208)]

Stop using M$ crap ... I'm 47

:-) [penny-arcade.com]

Re:perspective

[techno-vampire (666512)]

I'm 59. I can still remember things just as well as I did when I was half my age. Sometimes. Sometimes, I can't remember things I need, but I can still remember things I no longer have any use for, if I ever did. That's the way memory works. A few weeks ago, Jerry Pournelle [jerrypournelle.com] talked about how his memory is working. (Scroll up, slightly, into the previous day.) Not as good in some ways as it had been, but still good enough for every day use.

Don't worry, though, there's hope for us all yet. Just a few days ago, my mother (88) told me how she'd met General Patton while she was taking a walk in April '45, a story I'd never heard before.

Re:perspective

[zrq (794138)]

Just a few days ago, my mother (88) told me how she'd met General Patton while she was taking a walk in April '45, a story I'd never heard before.

Or ... has she told you the same story before, but you had forgotten about it.

Re:perspective

[luder (923306)]

There's the solution! Turn whatever you want to remember into a really lame song et voila.

Re:Learn new things

[tomhudson (43916)]

Learn new things. That's how you "exercise" your brain. Things that are tough and cause "brain pain" are generally best for you.

Use it or lose it. No magic pills will help. Same for body, as for mind.

Absolutely! I'd add:

1. Read books. Exercise for the brain, (visualization, following the plot) as opposed to passively watching TV
2. Do crossword puzzles, sudoku, whatever else makes you "figure things out". Computer games that exercise your mind (eg: sim city) are a lot better than shot-em-ups
3. Play board games with others - gets you to interact with others, as opposed to being a "loner" - and this exercises other parts of the brain. Trivial pursuit, cranium, pictionary, risk, monopoly, etc.
4. Exercise your curiosity. Try to figure out "why" something is the way it is, or :how" something does what it does, without just "looking it up on the innertubss". Sharpen your powers of observation.
5. Lead a healthy lifestyle. Walk a few klicks every day outdoors, rain or shine, sleet or hail (in other words, get a dog that has to be walked). Don't smoke, don't drink to excess but don't be a teetotaler either (moderate alcohol use does NOT kill brain cells, contrary to the old story about "every drink costs you 100,000 brain cells". NO hang-over, no damage, and the other health benefits are worth it).

Do this for 40 years, and you'll be just as sharp at 50 as you were at 20. In other words, if you didn't get into the habit of doing this as a kid, you're probably fscked.

Re:By working it

[Joebert (946227)]

Something about using memory training software that the author forgot to update doesn't sit right with me.