Fujitsu SPARC64-GP vs. Sun UltraSPARC II? 19
AtariDatacenter asks: "I've noticed that Fujitsu is starting to market their
Primepower line of Sun compatible servers, based on the
SPARC64-GP processor. Their Primepower 2000, with 128 processors running at 563mhz, would seem to be a killer of the Sun E10000, which is based on the UltraSPARC II processor. And their server beats the Sun E10k in the top ten TPC-C performance results for non-clustered systems. What do Slashdot readers have to say about the Primepower line of servers?"
HAL Computer Systems? (Score:1)
Re:HAL Computer Systems? (Score:1)
TPC-C? You've got to be kidding!!! (Score:1)
No I'm not kidding--I'm just real-world oriented. (Score:1)
I do admit that TPC-C is better than nothing. It's better than Towers of Hanoi or computing primes or timing straight disk I/O.
Fujitsu J822s SuperServer (Score:1)
Does anyone know about the Fujitsu J822s SuperServer? I inherited one with DRS/NX (ICL Unix) installed but I would like to run Linux or a *BSD on it. However, I also don't want to ruin the current installation by blindly experimenting.
OpenSourcerers [opensourcerers.com]
Not without an OS... (Score:2)
You might think that, but you'd probably be wrong. In order to make use of 128 CPUs, they need an OS suitable for the purpose. It's a fair bet that Sun haven't put huge amounts of resources into optimizing Solaris for more than 64 CPUs (sure, they're bound to have played with it in the labs, but it's unlikely to be production ready). Unless you can get something that approximates linear scalability, those extra 64 CPUs are going to be sitting around doing nothing. All this really lets you do is have more domains on a single physical box than an E10K will give you. If they price it right, that alone may make it a success in the crowded machine rooms of the corporate world, but it's not the wonder that it first appears to be. If you want an OS that supports a single OS image across more than 64 CPUs, you can try SGI or DG.
Disclaimer: the above assumes that they're running Solaris, based on the claims of 100% Sun compatibility and 12000 applications that they make on their web site. I guess they could be running a version of SINIX or Reliant Unix that they've optimized for large numbers of processors.
Re:Not without an OS... (Score:1)
1. Solaris 8 will run with upto 1000x processors. Yes it's built in, no special kernel. No they don't make a box that big, and yes it's type of clustering. Read the Docs, 8 has been tested on boxes with over 100cpus. Where are those boxes? they are going to be announced March 21. E10K replacement will house upto 112 cpus.
2. I've talked to fujitsu, and they want our business. But even they don't sell the 128 box to be used as one 128 way system. They want you to domain the thing into smaller systems.
3. yeah DG, I've seen some good stuff about them lately. Ever run NUMA? It scales like crap compared to an SMP for normal non scientific use. I'm talking database and application server. SGI, I respect them, but if a company lived past their prime, it's SGI.
4. Fujitsu's manufacturing is in Japan. The sales rep didn't even have any loaners. The boxes are built in japan, and flown to US, and then tested in Calif. So you think you'll get a system in a timely manner?
I'm all for competition, and I think it's good, but there's a lot of stuff that Sun is coming out with that will blow your mind. Yeah they have problems. Whatelse you going to run for large environments? Linux get real.
Fujitsu doesn't play stupid games like Sun ... (Score:2)
One thing I can honestly say about Fujitsu, they don't play stupid "100% Sun" games like Sun does -- E.g.,
My local (Orlando, FL) Sun sales/support office is right across the hallway from my company (yes, a whole 20 feet!). I made the grave mistake of going over and asking for a SunSolve CD once. They started asking me for Host IDs, and said that since I had clones (alongside separate, 100% Sun hardware) in the same office, they could not give me one. And what really ticked me in the end was the sales rep trying to sell me a new box! Geez, I just wanted to ask for a SunSolve CD so I would have to avoid downloading a lot of the patches (our Internet bandwidth was limited at the time) and I got my head bit off! Imagine if I really had an issue?!
Fujitsu sells some excellent, re-designed SPARC modules and boxes. In fact, I would argue that if eBay would have gone Fujitsu instead of true Sun, they probably wouldn't have had their "oopses" awhile back with Sun's inadequate airflow causing the ECC cache memories to fail. Their systems are of much better designs, industrial quality and usually cheaper in the end. And, again, their support doesn't bog you down with "100% Fujitsu" questions -- they get right to the problem and help you resolve it.
As such, I'll almost always buy Fujitsu over Sun. And they can (and did) quote me on it (see page 2). [fujitsu-technology.com] Yes, I also support and use x86/Linux, and we are slowly moving away from Solaris as more and more EDA tools are ported to it, but I still need to buy SPARCs on occassion. Fujitsu will continue to get the bill for SPARC.
-- Bryan "TheBS" Smith
Re:Not without an OS... (Score:1)
Speaking as a DG/UX admin with a MAJOR app at a big telco, I have to say I like the current crop (AV25000) of servers. The AV20k melted down on us during the testing phase(speaking of scale issues) and the 5900's we had just weren't juicy enuff (4x200 PPro vs AV25k's 8x550 P3). We went from 100% utilized boxen to a load == 1 machine set. Quite a difference, really. Of course, the
Disappointment. (Score:2)
The SPARC64-GP is significantly faster than the UltraSPARC II at the same clock rates. Yes, the particular web site referencing the SPARC64-GP is old, but the architectual improvements over the USII are the same, and the clock rates have increased.
Of course, the answer is that "UltraSPARC III" is just around the corner. But Fujitsu isn't standing still, and is working on processors and platforms of their own. What I *hope* we're looking at is an Intel/AMD leapfrog kind of competition where we've got some real competition on performance and price.
One area that I've been told that Fujitsu isn't all that hot on (but they are working on the issue) is support/service. They're not quite at the helpdesk level. But I know locally that AMDAHL has been training people to support their new Sun hardware.
Personally, I invited Fujitsu to give our site a presentation next week. I'm anxious to see what kind of things they have to offer. Its apparent that they CURRENTLY have something that can compete with the Sun line in price and performance... from the E220 to the E10k level. I have heard good things about the stability of the solutions that they offer.
I think it is important that Fujitsu starts marketing themselves to Sun shops and giving them an idea of where they are going. I want to see the concentrating on the support side harder. I think I'd be a little scared to run a 64-way box (with domains) connected to EMC via Jaycor fiber cards, and running an Oracle database. If they had a hardcore service division, I wouldn't be so scared.
Who Cares? (Score:1)
and if you anyway go plan on carving up domains, go with a n-class or a couple of 5500s - cheaper and faster...
Re:Who Cares? (Score:1)
(and btw, if you tell others to check facts, please check your reading skills first
Re:Fujitsu doesn't play stupid games like Sun ... (Score:2)
Danger, Will Robinson! Plug! Plug! Plug!
Yeah, CRA is pretty good. In the same vein is ourTRS division [trsonesource.com].
Re:E10k next generation (Score:2)
Re:Who Cares? (Score:1)
Re:I say (Score:1)
E10k next generation (Score:1)
I say (Score:1)
I would get the Sun though, because who know how long Fujitsu will stick around in the server market?
Re:Fujitsu doesn't play stupid games like Sun ... (Score:1)
As for Fujitsu, I am reminded of the time that Fujitsu called me wanting to convince me to go with Fujitsu switches/routers. My comment "When you think routers, you think Fujitsu?!" That was the end of the call. SUN, like Cisco, has problems, most big companies do. But there are some things you DON'T do when building a company, one is buy one-off equipment. If you have issues with the SUNs prices or service, check out off-lease resellers such as CRA [cit.com] where you can get slightly used SUN, Cisco, Compaq, etc. equipment at 40%-80% of list. They're actually much more knowledgable and easier to work with than SUN.
--
He had come like a thief in the night,