Slashdot in Politics? 422
Michael "Codetalker" Obersnel asks: "I was wondering if anyone out there had any ideas on how to turn all that passionate talk on Slashdot (how I love it) into a political force that people will pay attention to. Like a lobby group or something similar. It seems that people tolerate the DMCA and spam enough to complain about it but not really do anything about. I think we could change that with some organization and a cohesive front. I'm not suggesting that Slashdot itself be responsible, only that the community take part. Like a micro-payment system to hire lawyers for topics we are interested in or some sort of petitioning system. I know I'd pay a buck to overturn the DMCA, free Dimitri, outlaw spam, protest license problems, protect the GPL etc."
Lobbying Congresspeople (Score:5, Insightful)
geeks are to lazy to be very political in general (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:There already is such an organization (Score:5, Insightful)
This is the sort of thing that some of those loudmouthed leaders of the open-source community should really be doing, instead of running around trying to demonize Microsoft and other software companies, making the entire movement look like a bunch of cheap wackos.
Re:There already is such an organization (Score:3, Insightful)
The EFF is important, but there seems to be a void on the grassroots lobbying side...
Because no one here exerts any effort.. (Score:5, Insightful)
I suggested when the Dimitri issue broke that if 100,000 slashdotters typed out a letter to their Congressional representatives (quick - who is the house member from your district?) and mailed it in, then Congress would begin to pay attention to the debate.
The typical response was "I don't know where a manual typewriter exists {hint - your public library} and if I can't e-mail my letter I won't bother. And send in $50??? You have to be joking!".
So exactly why would you expect any politician to take anything said here seriously?
sPh
Slashdot is not real life (Score:3, Insightful)
I've seen what happens when a geek becomes a political activist, and it's called "Richard Stallman". Keep your priorities straight.
Ok, a political movement... (Score:4, Insightful)
A non-political, issue-focused lobbying group, on the other hand, could be workable. On the other hand, EFF fills that role quite well already.
/Janne
Re:There already is such an organization (Score:3, Insightful)
Perhaps this is not an EFF focus, but EFF should consider adding this type of lobbying to their list of activities, at least with regards to stupid laws like the DMCA and such. Since they are the ones busy trying to defend people who have been violated by these laws, they are probably also the ones with the most knowledge to lobby on them. Why invent a new group?
"Passionate" does not mean "intelligent." (Score:3, Insightful)
The problem with most Slashdot discussion is that it comes from people with tremendous lack of experience. Language battles and API wars are fought by college students defending and regurgitating what they learned last semester or what they read in John Carmack's
On Slashdot, you find people who not only stick to the extremes, but they stick to the extremes for extreme ideological reasons. A typical example is someone arguing the superiority of Linux over Windows XP without ever having used the latter. Because the former is Open Source, so it goes, it must be better. You won't get far outside of geek circles with these kind of hard-liner views. A geek in politics is like Jerry Falwell running for president.
My own personal problem... (Score:5, Insightful)
Remember when Microsoft sent out letters to people and told them to sign and send them to their representatives? Well, trying to force that on people was obviously silly, but the general idea was good. If I had a letter in my hand that said exactly what I wanted to express, and all I had to do was sign it and drop it in the mail, I'd have no reason to procrastinate.
Suppose we form a web site where good writers can put together coherent, intelligent letters on various issues. Concerned citizens can go to the site, browse the letters for one they like, and download it in a printer-friendly form. On the same site, they can also look up the address and fax numbers of their representatives, so all they have to do is sign it and mail it in.
Yes, I know the EFF has some of these features. However, it would be useful if the community could contribute sample letters, and if the process was even easier than it is now. Remember, the target audience is me, the lazy, disorganized procrastinator.
Laziness (Score:5, Insightful)
There's still a good chunk of people out there that believe in some mystical entity controlling our lives without any proof of such thoughts. Yet these are the same people that say "that's impossible" when they see what science is capable of. Like it or not, these people have more political influence than we do. They have more power because they are unified, with leadership and there's a lot of history behind them.
There's a lot of programmers here, and I'm sure they're all used to trying to see the big picture and chart all the variables. This is one of those BIG projects in mapping all the variables and figuring out their relationship. The major points are: there's little history in computer technology right now; t's still new and strange to a majority of people; pogrammers work long hours, and the pay is decreasing, leaving less time for political movements; and there is no single "leader" that represents us, which is very important towards political advancement. You can't expect politicians to summarize the demands of many individuals, all with different points of view. They're more likely to listen to an individual with well thought ideas and the backing of a large community.
What we have been proposing on
Re:Because no one here exerts any effort.. (Score:2, Insightful)
Even if they did receive a large # of letters, chances are that a staff assistant or legislative correspondent would draft some sort of stock letter to be sent in response (if you remembered to ask for a response, because you won't automatically get one). Then they would ask an LA to come up with a position on the issue, so that the rep. can defend his or her position in public.
If you really want something done, find out what your rep's appearance schedule will be when they're back home. Show up and ask questions. Call your local media outlet, and suggest they do a story on the issue.
My Humble Suggestion (Score:5, Insightful)
My feeling is that although PACs command some attention, sincere letters from constituents weigh far more heavily.
My humble suggestion is to create a place on Slashdot where members can readily find the names/addresses/email adresses/phone numbers of the Representatives and Senators in Congreess who vote on these issues. Of course, key members on the right committees (like Technology) should be prominently displayed.
A well-categorized list of these elected officials with the ability to fire off an email while surfing (a/k/a a mailto: link) would promote discourse directly with those to whom we have given the decision-making ability.
Re:Lobbying Congresspeople (Score:3, Insightful)
So it would be nice if more of us, in the USA, would write out a personal letter to our Congressman and Senators when legislation that is contrary to our beliefs come before them. Not a form letter, but one written by you. Keep it short, to the point and very clear how you want them to vote.
Re:Ok, a political movement... (Score:3, Insightful)
Let's form an open source economy.... with open source media... and an open source polity.
This is an example of what I mean. Yes, we all pretty much agree on Open Source/Free software. I doubt, though, that everybody will want to extend this concept as far as you do. A lot of people view OSS simply as a good way to develop and distribute software, and would not have anything to do with a comprehensive overhaul of the current society. See the OSS/Free debate as a good example.
Slashdot has managed to steer clear of political standpoints by focusing on narrowly defined issues. Trying to make it a political (in the classical sense) community will fracture it. The best way we have of influencing the world around us is precisely by _not_ becoming political; people will listen to us because we don't have a further political agenda. If the community satarts taking a political stance, we will lose a lot of our voice, as we will be viewed as partisan.
/Janne
Re:Because no one here exerts any effort.. (Score:3, Insightful)
But that's just the point -- people generally don't know these things off the top of their head. And even if you did, can you recite the postal address by heart? That's much less likely.
Perhaps one of the things that we need is an accessible list of reps (both Senate and House) and the mailing addresses -- for each state. Combine that with the sample letters that EFF provides, and suddenly you have something that just needs to be printed, signed and stamped. Put it all in one place and you have one stop shopping for letters to Congress.
Then all we have to do is get people away from their monitors long enough to go buy a stamp...
Re:Lobbying Congresspeople (Score:4, Insightful)
Because the "other side" has money and is getting paid to do what they do. Here there is only enough incentive to bitch and moan, not to actually do anything. So what the submitter is proposing is a way to contribute to a fund to lobby (bribe) congressman into doing our bidding.
Nice idea, won't work (Score:3, Insightful)
If anyone here wants to prove me wrong, go for it! Slashdot has more readers than most States have regular voters. From a platform like that, it should be almost trivial to become at least a US Senator at the Federal level, or an Independent MP in the UK.
I'm sure that people will be happy to pick apart my arguments, but if those same people aren't willing to be living proof of their counter-arguments, then what kind of counter is it?
Re:There already is such an organization (Score:2, Insightful)
Which is, of course, how we ended up with Osama bin Laden and the Taliban. Those who do not learn from history are condemned to repeat it.
One thing you can do.... (Score:2, Insightful)
http://www.aclu.org/action/liberty107.html [aclu.org]
and enter your zip code. You have a choice of email, fax, or letter to your state reps regarding the recent issues with our rights being trampled on.
----
As a result of what happened in NY, DC, and PA, Congress has begin passing all
sorts of crazy legislation. Most of these bills are being labeled as
"Anti-terrorism" bills, when in actuality, they are mostly anti-American.
Included in their changes are:
- Allowing for wiretaps to be without a search warrants. This includes
listening in on your phone conversations and scanning your email he use of
certain words. For example, it will be legal to begin reading your email and
monitoring your website usage if attention was brought to you because you
used suspicious words in your communication. If your thinking "Isn't that
un-Constitutional?", your right, it WAS.
- Requiring giving the encryption keys to any encryption scheme to be
given to the government. Basically, your privacy would non-existent to any
non-ethical person in the government that wanted to use them. In short,
there would be NO (legal) WAY to communicate via email or internet that the
government couldn't monitor. Law abiding Americans would the only people
they could monitor, while those breaking the law would continue to use their
own encryption schemes, meaning that we would only monitor those NOT
breaking the law. Sound like fun?
- "Hacking" a computer would now to an "Act of Terrorism." Meaning that changing a website without permission could be punished with life in a federal prison. I'm not going to defend hacking a computer, but I think that
fits under the cruel and usual punishment scenario. Once we give the
government power to punish people to this extent, how long until we begin
executing people for misdemeanors?
The list goes on and on, and it scares me. I urge everyone to visit the
site: http://www.aclu.org/action/liberty107.html. Go to the bottom, enter
your zip code, and hit go. This will bring you to a page that will allow you
to fax your congressmen while only spending about 10 seconds. It will send a
fax that is basically a generic letter the ACLU has drafted. For those not
sure how to do anything about our world, this would be a simple way to
finally do something.
Congress will likely be voting on this bill within the next week, so time is
of great importance. I sincerely hope many of you will spend the 30 seconds
needed to do something that could effect our lives for years to come.
Re:Start with OpenSourceLobby.org (Score:2, Insightful)
The open source movement has already achieved so mch that was once thought impossible. Now, with lobbying, we only need to achieve the very difficult: getting congress to listen and care. Enough persistent voices can accomplish this.
Re:Laziness (Score:2, Insightful)
In America, we are the wardens. I am talking about the comfortable white collar "middle-class" of which most people who read slashdot are members. Things are kept comfortable for us so we won't decide that the prison system is unfair.
Because things are so good for the middle-class, the middle-class doesn't get political. We don't propose legislation, we complain about changes to the system that has kept us so fat and happy.
Slashdotters probably think of themselves as rebels for hating the DMCA, heck, some probably even think they are the prisoners in the analogy laid out above. But it's all sound and fury--we want our Audis and Playstations and that's more important to us than the rights (or lives) of the prisoners.
Re:One Minor Issue... (Score:2, Insightful)
They will pay attention, if you make it clear to them that there are an appreciable number of voters who pay attention to how they vote on these issues and who will boot them out if they screw up.
The last thing we need is defeatist nay-saying. Action can make a difference. Excuses for inaction can only be detrimental.
Re:Lobbying Congresspeople (Score:2, Insightful)
Be very consise but specific about what bill you are writing about.
Tell whether you are for or against this bill.
List what reasons you have for being against it.
Knowing this crowd you will also need to be very clear and non-technical as much as is possible as it will be a political staffer reading the mail not a techy.
Be polite and non-confrontational and you will receive the best response.
I would suggest that you also limit your letters to your local congressman, your 2 state senators, and possibly the leadership of each party in both the house and the senate as out of state/district letters will usually go to the bottom of the pile.
Take the time to mail a physical letter as it will receive more notice than an e-mail. Also check out this site [learn2.com] as it is a very good reference on how to write your letter.
Well this got a little long but hopefully it will help some of you who want to get involved to have a gameplan.
Charles McKnight