Donating Time To Goodwill Projects? 179
jukal asks: "I am in the process of writing a proposal for co-operation between Openchallenge and UNITeS (United Nations Information Technology Service) which is 'creating a global volunteer programme aimed at bridging the digital divide between industrialized and developing countries'. Currently & traditionally contributing as a volunteer means relocating yourself to the developing country to take part as a project developer/manager/specialist. My proposal to UNITeS is, in short, will be that people could participate in such software projects via Openchallenge - while staying in their home country, on their spare-time and while keeping their jobs. The local team in the developing country would, after defining and creating requirements specifications post sub-projects as tasks to Openchallenge. All the contributions submitted to Openchallenge are published under an open source license. My question is: would you for example consider donating some hours to help a goodwill project - if you could do that from home. This is of interest to me, as I would like to be sure that the time we put into building co-operating with a big organization like UNITeS and others in the future. Is not wasted. There is this thread about 'Volunteer Work Abroad' - which is good reading related to the subject. But it did not quite provide me with the answer."
Good idea (Score:1, Interesting)
Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:5, Interesting)
This situation brought itself to bear a few years ago, when I learned that a friend of mine was donating not only his time, but also hard $$$ for server space for his favorite charity. What, if anything would he be able to write-off? He uses the server for other projects, so not 100% is for the charity.
Any accountant-geeks out there?
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WWJD? JWRTFM!
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:4, Informative)
Don't know about the USA, but not in Canada. In Canada if you want to count the deduction, you have to sell the software to your church (counting the selling price as income), then donate the equivalent amount of money to the church to pay for it. You don't end up with any tax break because of it; you may even have to pay taxes (because you might be taxed at a higher rate than the charitable deduction).
Duncan Murdoch
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:5, Informative)
As for hard $$$, that's definitely deductible as long as it's a legal charity, as far as I know.
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:2, Insightful)
I'm also not an attorney, but... if that's the case maybe you could donate your time on behalf of the company you work for, and they could take the tax break since they're paying for your time/services. ....?
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:2)
Mr. Spey
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:2)
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:5, Insightful)
Pardon me but why must there be a value placed on the time that one donates? Call me conservative or what ever but I think the whole beauty of Donating time to help 3rd world countries is just the humanity of doing it. I mean that is why they are 3rd/underdeveloped right, because they can't do it them selves?
How does it sound "I would love to help your country to be on par with the worlds supper power, but I can't write it off on my taxes, so stay poor."
Besides donating to a church should not be looked at as a tax write off. Isn't the whole Open Source about giving to the better of the community? So now we have people indirectly asking money before the produce any code?
Deduction not the reason for volunteering (Score:2, Insightful)
I volunteer my time (and, in some cases, money) with the Boy Scouts, a local aviation for kids program, and a few other charities and good causes. I do it because I like it, because I think it's important, and because I appreciate the fact that people volunteered time for me when I was a Scout, et al. I have no aspirations of financial gain, nor do I receive any (including tax deductions: I don't itemize).
That said, there's nothing wrong with taking a writeoff if you're entitled to same. If you're volunteering specifically for the deduction, you need to examine your motives (and your methods: writeoffs are a poor way to "make" money), but there's nothing wrong with taking the benefit of it. Indeed, many people (myself included) have strong objections to the government, and feel that anything which (legally) keeps money out of Washington is a good thing. Would you say that accepting lunch while on a project site is verboten, because you derive gain from it? Certainly people who refuse to help because they can't profit from it need to do a little soul-searching, but if you're going to do it anyway (for presumably the right reasons), there's nothing wrong with availing yourself of long-provided benefits.
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:2, Informative)
We recognize the value of any donation--cash, goods, or services. Cash is cash, goods and services, if the kind of thing that we would have to pay for in our ordinary course of business, are recognized at what we would have to pay for them.
AFAIK, for tax purposes any donation you make, cash or noncash, is treated as a cash gift. I.e., they assume that you are paid for the good, and that you donate your payment back to them.
Morally, you shouldn't have to actually pay anything tax-wise for volunteering, but you shouldn't necessarily gain any tax benefits from it, either.
This situation brought itself to bear a few years ago, when I learned that a friend of mine was donating not only his time, but also hard $$$ for server space for his favorite charity. What, if anything would he be able to write-off? He uses the server for other projects, so not 100% is for the charity.
Any accountant-geeks out there?
IANAA-G, but if the server is set up to regulary handle other accounts, he could probably get by with marking the cost of a server account as a donation, as well as what someone would pay him for to do the same job for them.
Just document everything, talk to your accountant, and be honest. You're paying the bloke to save you money so as to justify their fee, so let them worry about it.
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:2)
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:1)
I'm not an accountant but I think you could probably deduct a fraction of the money spent on the server that corresponds to the fraction of the server dedicated to the charity.
In other words, if the charity uses 30% of the server's disk, bandwidth and CPU time then you could write off 30% of the cost.
That's how it works when you split expenses that are part personal and part business (like a computer you use for work and for gaming). So maybe it works for charities.
Michael
Re:Tax write offs for time donation...? (Score:1)
In the U.S., you can NOT deduct the value of time donated to a charitable organization.
Donated Services (Score:2, Insightful)
(S)pecialized skills are required and possessed by the donor.
(O)therwise needed by the orgnization
(M)easurable
(E)asily
You can remember this by the mnemonic "Some." (Directly out of the Becker Conviser CPA exam review).
Assuming the orgization you donate to is "qualified," you must also observe the "charitable contributions limitation" under the tax code:
Overall limit = 50% Adjusted Gross Income (AGI)
1) Cash - may be all 50%
2) Property - is limited to the lessor of:
a) 30% of AGI
b) The remaining amount to reach 50% after cash contributions
Notice this says nothing of "donated service." I guess you could treat the FMV of the service as "Property." However, I think you would have to go through old tax court cases to see how you should really go about deducting donated services.
Disclaimer: I am in no way an accountant . . . yet.
Work with local Economic Development Councils (Score:3, Informative)
We have found that the various city, county, and private organizations are willing to bend over backwards to work with us. Bear in mind, I am not talking about a purely altruistic venture on my own firm's part, but rather a joint venture between a private company and the community, with profits being used to further develop technology-specific public works in the region.
Re:Work with local Economic Development Councils (Score:1, Funny)
> While the technology in this county is not quite as outdated as that in, say, Gambia, it isn't *that* far behind.
oh, c'mon it's not that bad in Canada...
Sure. (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Sure. (Score:2)
Yes, think of it as donating your brain cycles, instead of CPU ones :)
Perhaps I'm crazy... (Score:5, Interesting)
Besides, wouldn't one have to focus on developing the infrstructure to run said software anyway. Last time I checked, running software needs computers. Computers need power, connectivity, and even sometimes access to this Internet thingy. If I wanted to lead a project to help developing nations, I'd be much more interested in building telecommunications and electrical infrastrucutre then writing software they probably can't run or use for much good yet anyway.
While your idea is noble, I think perhaps it is a little too soon to be really globaly useful?
Re:Perhaps I'm crazy... (Score:4, Insightful)
What would be more useful/worthwhile would be "lay the roads" or "build the bridges" drives that make it possible for all other kind of aid to reach those who need it.
Re:Perhaps I'm crazy... (Score:1)
In Africa, for example, the biggest problems are political, not logistical. Starving areas are controlled by armies led by psychopaths (which is why much of the starvation is happening). The armies steal most of the food to support themselves and use the rest to exert control over the hungry villagers under their control.
Why they fail... (Score:2, Insightful)
Riiiggght.. (Score:2)
Oh wait. THAT'S EXACTLY what they're trying to do.
They have little resources other than human resources, like a lot of third world countries (not all of India can be considered 3rd world, but most of it can). They are not alone in this idea. If you consider that the world itself is a national economy, and that human resources are also resources (just as an infrastructure is) then you can see that this can help 3rd world countries. If they don't have the infrastructure they need, that can be imported (or the people can be temporarily exported) to deal with that problem.
Re:Riiiggght.. (Score:2)
As far as human resources are concerned, given that IIRC India has roughly 1 billion people, and China is the only other nation of that size, I'd hardly say that other 3rd world nations have lots of human resources.
actually I believe that's what the problem is (Score:2)
Unfortunately, what happens is that the very top people there end up leaving India and coming to the US, where the work is. That country produces some of the greatest technological minds in the world (law of averages suggests this; their population is 4 times the size of the U.S.), yet can't hold onto them.
Infrastructure investment should most likely come first...
Re:actually I believe that's what the problem is (Score:2)
Re:Perhaps I'm crazy... (Score:5, Funny)
Starving, Dying Poor to Get Much-Needed Net Access
Okinawa, Japan (SatireWire.com [satirewire.com]) The world's poorest nations reacted with elation yesterday after learning the G-8 economic powers have pledged to bring them into the digital economy by wiring their countries. "With access to stock quotes, entertainment news, and streaming video pornography, I will finally be able to feed my family," said Jamil Jurawa, who lives near a contaminated well in a small east Gambian village. "This is a great day and I hope not to die of dysentery before it ends."
In late July, the Group of 8 authorized a Digital Opportunity Taskforce, or "Dot Force,'' to investigate how to wire the Third World and help bridge the rich-poor technology gap. Relief agencies denounced the plan as absurd, insisting that food and medicine are needed first. But the Dot Force argued that information is also critical, and to prove its point, it provided computers and Internet access to Jamil Jurawa and his brother Tamar, who lives in a neighboring Gambian village. The two exchanged instant messages that, said Dot Force members, exemplify the knowledge-sharing power of the Internet:
"Tamar, I have no food. Do you have food?"
"Jamil, I also have no food. But tonight Britney is to chat at E-Online!"
"Good one! I am ROFLDM (Rolling On The Floor Laughing and Dying of Malnutrition)."
"OK! CTFN! (Contracting Typhoid Fever Now)."
Re:Perhaps I'm crazy... (Score:1)
What you are trying to say is exactly as Holywood etc. would like you to believe all the internet is for. Entertainment is a disease.
This project is exactly as I have been advocating in the past. Excellent. And if I had the coding ability I'd contribute myself.
Re:Perhaps I'm crazy... (Score:3, Interesting)
What happens when you give IT to a pre-industrial society? We don't know. It'd be interesting to find out.
One more consideration (Score:2, Insightful)
MIT Tech Review Article on Ghana (Score:5, Informative)
Making a telephone call here requires persistence. Roughly half don't go through because of system failures, but that's only the start of Ghana's telephone woes. The country has a mere 240,000 phone lines--for a population of 20 million spread across an area the size of Britain. Moreover, telephone bills are inaccurate, overcharges common, and the installation of a new line can cost a business more than $1,000, the rough equivalent of the annual office rent. Lines are frequently stolen, sometimes with the connivance of employees of Ghana Telecom, the national carrier. Phones go dead, and remain unrepaired, for months. Some businesses hire staff for the chief purpose of dialing numbers until calls go through.
Moreover, even those fortunate enough to have access to the internet find themselves distraught by the knowledge of the incredibly poor conditions in which they must live. One internet cafe owner stated that the majority of users were online in his cafe trying to figure out a way out their country.
The upshot is that much more effort needs to be devoted towards basic infrastructure -- sanitary, transportation, and information -- before an idea like that of the poster's would make much sense.
Bob
Re:Perhaps I'm crazy... (Score:2, Insightful)
They don't have the money to waste on absurdities like 1 gig drives, 486 CPU's, video cards with more than 128K of RAM, or all of the much more excessive crap the first world uses to do absurdly simple, basic, tasks, like send messages or analyze information.
That doesn't mean, however, that effective tools, that can benefit impoverished and starving peoples, don't need to be written and then run on simple (cheap) computers in the few places where power and electricity do exist, or that alternate infrastructure technologies (solar power, cheap radio transmission, etc) can't be deployed. They don't need "lickable", they don't need 3D, they'll do just fine with monochrome characters on 2 VT100's hooked into a 386 if it saves and improves lives.
Some Examples: :-)
1. Route planning software for food/medicine deliveries in countries with unreliable transportation systems.
2. Accounting software to reduce the amount of graft and corruption involved in monetary aid. (If bribes are required, as least they can be tracked, budgeted for in the future, and properly expensed.)
3. Weather prediction software to help in crop planning.
4. Water management software to help prevent over-usage, which creates (artificial) droughts.
5. Simple communications hardware/software to relay information over low-tech, low-bandwidth, links. You don't need an email client->TCP/IP->DSL to send "Tornado coming, evacuate", you can do just fine with anything that does 300 (or even less) baud, like shortwave radio to a TTY, or, with human operators, 'net weather service->voice->shortwave radios work, too.
6. Inventory management software for food supplies, medical supplies.
7. Simple message aggregation systems (remember why UUCP batched email was a good thing?) to speed up communications... (Village 197 needs penicillin brought in by jeep. Village 123 road out, needs 'dozer or shovels). Much faster than human messenger systems, and without the absurd overhead of the current crap we use.
8. Water testing/sanitation issues/road building/disease statistics/famine information/etc. aggregation systems, so the minimal resources available can be focused on the neediest areas.
9. Software to enable translation (and working translators) into *many* more languages than the computer world currently supports.
I'm surprised by the cynicism in many of the posts, which smack of first world arrogance. "Oh yeah, we'll send them our current technology, and they can't use it, because they lack our current infrastructure..." They need the computing ideas and technology of the 40's to 80's, not 2002's. Right now, many places are trying to survive on the same level of technology (or worse) than the US had in the late 1700's.
Come to think of it, the CPU cycles we *waste* on lickable interfaces, skinnable GUIs, looking for aliens, ripping crappy joke songs, or adding transparency to everything, could be better applied to *many* issues greater than the ones the first world faces.... with the CPU I use on a single protien fold sim, I could probably calculate *all* possible routes for a single food shipment to a village in Ghana.
Apple had a campaign centered around a current desktop being equivalent to what used to be a "supercomputer". If every third world country could now afford a 70's era supercomputer, they could be doing many of the basic tasks we all take for granted now. For only 10 grand, *any* nation in the world can afford the equivalent of two Cray-1's, and accomplish *all* of the computing tasks outlined above, with only two power cords, and one phone line. It's not about the infrastructure to send colored IM text to the next village, it's about extremely simple needs to help solve issues too complex to be done on paper.
It doesn't take a computer on every villager's "desktop", it takes computing power in the very few places that can benefit from it. Why would it need to be deployed in the same way? We already learned these lessons in the 60's, the first computing power to help the public was shared by very few people. It didn't look "pretty", it wasn't "fun", but that wasn't the point.
Addressing another point, those same Apple machines cannot be shipped to some countries, because they're considered powerful enough to be weapons. Again, we *also* learned this lesson in the 60's: The military wants first crack at all of the available CPU cycles, and will use them. Despots will use them t enrich their power... that's a side-effect, side problem, but as long as the CPU power is kept low enough, it'd still be legal.
-Bop
Re:Perhaps I'm crazy... (Score:2)
Yes, I know that I cannot fix the hunger problem by this approach. Also, I am too much a sissy to take real action of going in there to help. One excuse is that I want to stay safely at home with the kids :) Anyway, if we with openchallenge [openchallenge.org] can give any contribution - it enables the local time to concentrate on other matters. Also, it might be possible to complete projects that were impossible before. Also, if you would make a contribution safely from your home, doing what you can do best (coding) - maybe the step of actually going there gets smaller when you are already more familiar with the work done there. Also, keep in mind that to fix the hunger problem, something needs to be fundamentally changed. Shipping in food and other resources is crucial but it only fixes the instant problem.
Gates Foundation (Score:2)
Bill Gates was faced with this same dillema when he first set up his foundation [gatesfoundation.org]. He went to conferences, heard pitches for thriod world EMAIL, web access, broadband, etc. Finally, he realized the same thing you have - that there was little humanitarian benefit to pushing high tech solutions where they didn't fit naturally. Instead, he got solidly behind vaccine development [gatesfoundation.org].
Say what you will about Bill, but he knows how to leverage his money to the task at hand.
PS - And, please, no flames on "he only donates a tiny fraction of his money, so he's still evil incarnate..." I was just using the guy as an example.
My favorite oddtodd line (Score:3, Funny)
My favorite odd todd line. [oddtodd.com]
And the fact that I seriously considered volunteering, made me feel better
about not..volunteering.
Yes I think so.. (Score:1)
I tend to work on things for other people much more attentively then stuff I do just for the hell of it.
Along those lines... (Score:4, Informative)
Misdirected (Score:1, Insightful)
It's arguably a noble notion, donating your time to those who have less. But how many of these have-not people and groups are in countries with backward or malevolent political and economic systems? Why should we all join a project to help [INSERT DICTATORIAL REGIME HERE]?
I'd much rather give 5 USD to a local charity or even a street person, than to donate time to helping [INSERT PUBLIC "SERVICE" GROUP HERE] in another country. Where's the benefit in that, compared to helping out with local problems?
Or is this another one of those Soviet-era things - "at least everyone is equally shabby" ?
Re:Misdirected (Score:2, Insightful)
How about, "Because the need there isn't generally as great"?
Anyway, even if this software is bespoke, it's going to be available under the GPL, so anybody who has a use for it (and can get the source) can benefit from it.
Re:Tech Volunteering Locally. (Score:2, Informative)
Although techie volunteer programs abroad are wonderful experiences (i've been fortunate to do community technology work in S. Africa and China), you don't have to travel thousands of miles away to do some tech good.
Re:Misdirected (Score:2)
> It's arguably a noble notion, donating your time
> to those who have less. But how many of these
> have-not people and groups are in countries with
> backward or malevolent political and economic
> systems? Why should we all join a project to help
> [INSERT DICTATORIAL REGIME HERE]?
Those dictatorships succeed by keeping their people poor and ignorant. A child with a computer and internet access can be exposed to new ideas and learn skills that can get them better jobs than their parents. Eventually the people become less poor and less ignorant and kick the nasty old dictators out of there.
> I'd much rather give 5 USD to a local charity or
> even a street person, than to donate time to
> helping [INSERT PUBLIC "SERVICE" GROUP HERE] in
> another country. Where's the benefit in that,
> compared to helping out with local problems?
Giving to a local charity is good, and you should help your less fortunate neighbors. But $5 USD, alone, is a drop in the bucket even for local problems. Regardless of whether the problem is local or in the third world, the better solution is always one that builds a brighter future where people can become proud and independent, rather than one that just fills today's hunger (or tries to fill it, only to have the grain carted off by the local bully).
> Or is this another one of those Soviet-era
> things - "at least everyone is equally shabby" ?
Yuck! That's a disgusting philosophy. I prefer peace and happiness myself.
"The path of peace is yours to discover for eternity."
Japanese version of "Mothra" (1961)
Priorities? (Score:1, Funny)
http://www.blowthedotoutyourass.com [blowthedotoutyourass.com]
A great way to donate time... (Score:4, Interesting)
Go to your local library or school or community college and offer to teach free courses or help with the IT infrastructure. Be a guru for some programmer-to-be!
I used to teach at an adult education centre which was free to students (though I did get paid, so I don't claim to be a humanitarian of unequal pedigree here). It was extremely rewarding and I learned a lot as well.
Comments (Score:4, Interesting)
1: Basic Needs (Food, Clothing, Shelter)
2: Self Sufficency (Ability to make\get you own Food, Clothing, and shelter. Watch the Movie Soilent Green, or read the book why this is imporant)
3: Advancement of Society Standard (Literacy, Freedom, Education)
4: Wants, Computers, Cars, Leather Jackets and Blue Jeans.
Emergine nations need to have a solid foundation and bridging the Digital Divide seems pretty damn low on the ilst of priorities if I am starving and have polluted water to drink. I think we can hold of on donating the limited dollars there are to charity and set more, I wouldn't say appropriate goal (I like the idea of briding the digital divide), but more pressing needs. It would be far better for the natives of these emergine nations to be able to afford buying a computer versus getting one for free. Even better yet to have an industry where they can make and compete in computer production.
I think that UNITES needs to focus more on developing industies, markets, and agricultural areas before worrying about poor people having email. The idea that they want to Bridge the Digital Divide seems oddly out of place when you apply it to nations that have people starving and dying of terrible diseases. There are limited charity dollars in the world and we need to take a hard look at where they go and how they are spent and I just don't see this as a project that needs the money. The Peace Corp. seems to be the best bang for the charitable dollar. I hope this post sparks some discussion on which charities do the most good with the dollars they get. Good luck to UNITES and friends.
Re:Comments (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Comments (Score:2)
Re:Comments (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: Teaching People How To Fish. (Score:3, Insightful)
If you give people a fish, they eat for a day. If you teach people to fish, they eat for a lifetime.
If you teach a community how to use/manipulate technology, they become better equipped to get employment. So you've given them #2: Self Sufficiency. By getting jobs using the technology you've taught them, they can take care of #1: Basic Needs. Once they have work, they can worry less about #1 and start concentrating on things like educating their children and participating in the political process (#3). And one day, when they're good little consumers like the rest of us, they'll be able to waste their time keeping up with the Joneses (#4)
Re:Comments (Score:2)
Nor is implementing technology a waste of time for people in dire straits, as you seem to imply. Consider email communications to experts in other parts of the country or on the other side of the planet; Internet access to scientific, medical and agricultural resources; and the ability to coordinate programs to avoid duplication of effort. These are some of the things we all take for granted, but take them away and your making a very hard job even more difficult.
Re:Comments (Score:2)
Re:Comments (Score:2)
Of course it's no good; that's why different services need to run in parallel. As the parent said, many of the resources dedicated towards technology can't easily be redirected towards other means: I'll gladly teach folks to run computers, but I won't dig ditches. Indeed, ditch-digging would be a waste of my skills: it'd do much more good if I were to teach computers at home for profit and donate the money to pay locals to dig the ditches than to dig the ditches myself.
The other thing is that there's not one single pot of "limited charity dollars". There are charity funds for food. There are charity funds for tech. Many of the people who spend money on charity funds for tech would not be willing to spend that same money on charity funds for food. Many of the charity funds for tech accept direct hardware donations -- how much good does that do to a food bank?
Look at the value of cell phones in many developing areas. Computers have the promise of being at least as useful. Are they a substitute for food or clothing? Of course not! Does that mean that those who are receiving assistance with food and clothing shouldn't be given assistance in tech as well? By no means.
Finally, wrt the power grid: Dunno 'bout everywhere, but the area of Ghana around Acra gets semi-reliable power at least part of the day. That's good enough for many communications purposes, at least given a battery backup. Other solutions are available as well -- manually powered generators, etc -- with varying levels of cost.
Re:Comments (Score:2)
Tech Corps (Score:5, Interesting)
In my opinion, you can't beat the gratification that comes from doing something like this. I get the opportunity to lend my expertise to an inner-city school district that could greatly use it. Definitely a win-win. I can't encourage this enough.
Google? (Score:4, Insightful)
Seriously: I'd be interested! Just like the Peace Corps without the tropical fevers!
Re:Google? (Score:4, Interesting)
Seriously: I'd be interested! Just like the Peace Corps without the tropical fevers!
No way! I was in the Peace Corps. Those tropical fevers were the best part.
Seriously, the best parts included:
Something tells me that these experieces would be diminished if you "phoned it in."
Count me in (Score:3, Funny)
In my humble opinion... (Score:2, Flamebait)
Go work on some elderly person's house...do meals on wheels, or best of all start a computer job skills training program with your local government.It's been my experience that I can't save the world, but I can make a huge difference in a small people's lives.
Re:In my humble opinion... (Score:1)
Thes large organizations that try to do charitable work (the UN and the vile, heavy handed United Way), absorb way too many resources, and attach way to much agenda to what they do. If you want to do charitable work, do it at a level where you can see the results of what you do first hand.
Personally I get enough geeking in at work, so I only do volunteer computer work that is incidental to my other volunteer work, mainly network/PC support for my ambulance squad.
Geek Corp (Score:4, Informative)
Sounds like a concept similar to this. [geekcorps.org]
Re:Geek Corp (Score:2)
Thanks, I just realized that we have not yet talked with them about co-operation. Will do so. I believe same principles of co-operation could work with them as with UNITeS. If someone from geekcorps is listening, let's see who acts faster :))
commitment needed (Score:3, Interesting)
I've worked on enough volunteer projects to realize that most volunteers are people that have too much time on their hands. They've just moved to a new city, are between jobs, broke up with their significant other, etc. There is nothing wrong with this other than that all these situations are extremely temporary. As soon as the other parts of their lives start back up, the desire to volunteer disappears.
This a huge pain for the organization as they have devoted time and resources to orient and train these very short term volunteers.
Your proposal is even more likely to suffer from this as volunteers who never meet the people they are helping will feel even less obligation to the people them. You need to find some way to secure a time commitment from you volunteers and work very hard to make them feel connected to the work, otherwise the turnover will kill you.
Closer to Home (Score:5, Insightful)
I donated time to volunteer work at a then local high school - I have since moved - teaching students in project oriented programming competition formerly called the New Mexico Supercomputing Challenge [nm.org] (now called the Adventures in Supercomputing Challenge when they rolled it and the Sandia NL sponsored rival program together).
Students were brogutht ogether in small teams and taught programming, often from the ground up, math, and science towards a project. Often a lot of backfilling took place to get the students up to the point where they could understand the math and science behind the project as well as actually grasp what it would take to write code for the supercomputers. It was very challenging and a lot of fun.
It has always perplexed me when we have people so constantly complaining about the school system that those that have the time and energy to volunteer do not simply go down to their local school system and volunteer. Make an appointment with the principal and see where you can help. I betcha he or she will be very ecstatic if you can bring ideas and time to the table so long as it does not tax the school resource wise (budgets being tight things...)
The rewards of seeing a student's face light up when they get it are well worth the time...
An excellent idea - but... (Score:1)
I have little free time, but would love to donate IT skills to local organizations aimed at improving the education level of our children. Before the obligatory 'check Google' responses, note that I did, but was overwhelmed by the 265,000+ 'hits' no matter how I narrowed my search.
Ideas like yours are valid. I imagine that far more people would volunteer, if it were simply easier to do so. Being able to volunteer within your own area of interest would draw out even more of these 'closet' volunteers!
I hope you keep at it.
Re:An excellent idea - but... (Score:2)
Thanks for the comment! A clip from another thread. "Exactly, schools, universities and other organisations like could also benefit - and we are trying to get them informed. If you know any, please feel free to spread the word. Actually, if you read the 'about openchallenge [openchallenge.org]' page you will find a fairy tale tailored for universities. :)"
ps. I am also a father of two :)
I would (Score:1, Funny)
make the people you're helping partners (Score:5, Insightful)
Beyond just giving them the source, you've got to make sure that you make every effort to make the recipients of your aid part of the team in the cathedral [tuxedo.org] or at least feeling like they're part of the bazaar.
There's nothing worse than sending in aid that makes the person wind up with this big shiny thing that they don't have the resources to maintain or expand on.
So yeah. Clean water first. Food second. No war third. Good medicine, industrial infrastructure, a reliable democratic and open government... and then technology that the developing country can really feel that they own, rather than that they adopted because they found it or someone gave it to them.
The Key is Empowerment (Score:4, Insightful)
*EXACTLY*. Any venture that claims to be of benefit to the "needy" should make sure that it provides the tools and education to empower the community in which they are working; otherwise, you end up with a community that is now *more reliant* on outside sources to work with the technology/software/whatever that you have provided.
I would liken giving a Zambian village a network of PCs without training them how to use and maintain them to teaching schoolchilren how to read a book, but without teaching them anything about semantics, grammar, etc... in other words, worthless.
greeat. something else to keep me inside (Score:2, Funny)
Kinda Missing the point (Score:3, Insightful)
It seems to me that while potentially useful, your idea of passing out sub-projects from software companies or IT teams in developing nations to a group of open source coders in the Western world doesn't really advance the goal of the UN initiative. As another poster mentioned, there are more serious problems to overcome in many developing nations that make "bridging the digital divide" realtively meaningless. I believe someone else pointed out that what these nations really need isn't code, but IT infrastructure.
Those are valid points, but I think the fundamental idea of the UN program is to provide technology experts who can not only assist in local projects, but also transfer their expertise through the course of working on those projects. A group of US/UK/GER/FRA/etc coders whipping out brilliant and useful code for sub-projects is certainly helpful, but it doesn't go very far in creating a communal working environment wherein the presumably more experienced techs volunteering can pass their knowledge and experience on to the local techs. Sure, the locals can read your brilliant source code, but they don't get to participate in the development of that code necessarily, and having their questions answered via email is nowhere near as positive a learning environment as working on the code with a real person next to them who can answer their questions and point out interesting tidbits on the fly.
The real digital divide is knowledge based, and the best way to close that gap is to teach someone how to do it themselves, not tell them to send the hard parts to someone else to do for them.
Of course that's just my opinion, and I'm probably wrong
it'll never work (Score:1, Troll)
Re:it'll never work (Score:2)
how do they bring it together? (Score:1)
Re:how do they bring it together? (Score:2)
Yeah. That's the reality. However, keep in mind that we have not spend any penny in marketing - and actually just started spreading the word. Anyway, since the beginning, the hitrate on the server has been exponential, and I hope that within next 6 months there is already real potential. It will take time, but there is no hurry. If people think it's a good thing, the word will spread. If not, nothing is lost.
If you build it... (Score:5, Interesting)
I've helped out with a few foodbanks have always been shocked at how incredibly primitive their distribution systems are. They have to have nearly prohibitive amounts of notice to get the orders for the right amounts of items correctly taken care of up-line. Locally there are no computers involved in this at all. A hand totaled list is read over the phone to a person who plugs it into a spreadsheet. AAAAAAAck! This is a job that screams, "Automate me." The people involved drool at the opportunity to place their orders less than a month in advance and to get rid of the paperwork, but setting up the infrastructure is most of the problem and actually writing the order submission app is pretty easy. In this case and so many others that I can imagine the majority of the work will be done on the scene. But for the fraction that doesn't have to to be done there, start some sourceforge projects and ask for volunteers. You'll find'em.
Re:If you build it... (Score:2)
We need a website that will tell me where to mail my still-working surplus computer junk next time.
Worth Every Second Spent (Score:2)
Without a doubt... (Score:2)
Could be a good idea... (Score:2, Insightful)
I, for one, would be interested in helping out through some volunteer work, as long as I agreed with the bigger picture.
People have made some good points about putting the needs of a local community ahead of those of the international community, but I've always been of the opinion that no matter who you help, it benefits everyone in the long run.
What I wouldn't like to do is devote several hours/days/months of my time to a largely useless cause ('We're going to give all the kids in Namibia a web page!'). What sorts of things could one volunteer their time for that we could actually beleive would help those we're volunteering for? Are we talking about automating agriculture or streamlining AIDS testing in african countries? (I'm not sure if either of those makes much sense in this context, but you get the point)
How about some good, concrete examples? I've often thought about how much I'd like to be able to help out various orginizations by loaning myself to them to write a bit of code or somesuch. Of course there's always handing out soup to the homeless, but I tend to think your average geek has enough know-how and intelligence to do a little more good than just preforming manual labor. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but if some impoverished 3rd world country could actually _benefit_ from me helping out, then hey, I'm all for it.
Support this donation-funded ad!!!!!!!! (Score:2)
Also: NetAid (Score:2)
NetAid [netaid.org] online volunteering.
nonprofit colocation facility (Score:2)
California Community Colocation Project [communitycolo.org] provides:
One of the issues is follow-through (Score:2, Interesting)
One of the big issues we're discusssing is backend maintenance.
Yes, I'm all for us volunteering our time. That said, we need to make sure we implement systems and solutions that won't leave staff or other volunteers frustrated and/or in worse shape when we move on.
A good example is setting up a church web site. A geek comes along. Makes it look and feel great. A year passes. The geek is gone and now the organization is left there scratching their head trying to figure out how to modify things without breaking them.
In other words. Let's volunteer. But lets not make this like the one time we worked in a soup kitchen so we could feel better about ourselves. Instead, lets provide permanent, long term solutions.
Time != Money (Score:2)
It's great to do this... (Score:2)
Others have mentioned that there are groups in the US that need help, and ways to help the local services. At least in California, there are a few groups that do this. One that I'm affiliated with [calteg.org] has provided web space (low/no cost web space), on site technical support, and various small projects for a group of non profit organizations.
It is very interesting looking at this stuff-- there are literally no companies that will offer low/no cost tech support even as donations, to local non profits-- the ones that need it the most.
Get involved with the local groups. Any skills you have are really appreciated, and even if you don't want to or can't be there to help them, if you run a server, set up a little web site for them! Give them an account to get mail, and a hundred megs to put as big a site as they want on it, and it doesn't cost you anything but electricity which you would use anyway-- Usually they pull less than a few thousand hits per month
Re:It's great to do this... (Score:2)
Exactly. Organisations like this is another group we will try to get informed. If you know any that might benefit from openchallenge [openchallenge.org] - please spread the word. For schools, fairy tale written in 'about openchallenge' [openchallenge.org] might provide some hints on how to utilize it.
The Devil is in the Details (Score:2)
In fact, project management and business analysis skills may be a *key* donation to such an effort. Skilled business analysts, workflow experts, and project management people (esp those familiar with OS projects) would be a real asset to any such plan and should be figured into the mechanism. Correctly setting expectations would be an important part of successful and satisfactory development. This won't be a for-pay effort and it will be a distributed effort. Both invoke certain characteristics and limitations.
I have been looking for just these kinds of local or Int'l IT projects, insofar as I would be permitted by NDA's etc. to participate. I think this would be a worthwhile endeavour for the UN and the Open Source community. And it would leverage some of the powers of some open source OSs which run well on some older hardware, as much of the developing world may not be able to afford the latest 3.4GHz P-4 megasystem.
If this does go anywhere, I hope slashdot will provide ongoing coverage.
Good comments, I will build up a FAQ (Score:2)
Thanks for helping!
The conclusion (Score:2)
Based on the feedback, Yes - I will use time to proceed with the proposal to UNITeS. Also, there was a lot of feedback which helps me in this work. Also, I now know more about the weak points of this approach and can start thinking for answers to them. So, final thank you to all of you who used some brain cycles on thinking. I hope you will hear some good news regarding this co-operation within a couple of months. Thanks!
Re:Ask slashdot: (Score:1)
http://yro.slashdot.org/yro/02/10/24/1659231.shtm
Re:[OT[ WTF? What happened? (Score:1)
I guess that'll teach them to try to pull a "fast one" on us, huh?
Re:Waste of time.... (Score:1)
I know you work hard (Score:4, Insightful)
You are the master of your own destiny for now, only because there are many people in your country who would die to preserve the free and open system which supports your market.
Take that away and life becomes a lottery. It won't matter if you are an elite business person or a crack guerilla sniper- in times of civil disorder people suffer, and suffer, and suffer no matter how hard they try. And I don't mean having to do something mildly degrading like sit around with objectionable people who are richer than you. I mean being so hungry that people can count your ribs and knowing that your high IQ can't turn stone into bread unless those people in the hills stop shooting long enough to plant a lousy vegetable patch. Even the people who are ostensibly in control of the whole war find themselves locked into the conflict and unable to see a way out that doesn't get them killed.
In afghanistan, there used to be kabul university [afghan-info.com](est 1932 by some french and turkish guys) complete with schools of medicine, pharmacy, economics etc... Then the taliban sent the country back to the stone age, with the exception of a pile of the imported tanks. What happened to all the educated, hard working people? they had crap lives and then died. Some of them wound up in other countries, where their hard work and life savings bought them a cell in a processing camp.
Anyway, bottom line: if you really feel bad about donating your time to help people like yourself except that they suddenly woke up one day to find out that terrorists had killed their government, just consider openchallenge as a competition instead. It says so on the website linked in the main article. Here's a list of winners [openchallenge.org] and the cool stuff they won demonstrating how elite they were.
Wouldn't you like to have another feather in your cap? Another free GPS module to show off to your friends?
And if one day you were to find out that your country had dissolved into war or your economy had imploded into a gooey mess of corruption, wouldn't you be comforted by the hope that somewhere out there there might be smart, talented people who care about other human beings in real dire straits and for whatever reason use their powers and skills to help.
Re:I know you work hard (Score:2)
And if one day you were to find out that your country had dissolved into war or your economy had imploded into a gooey mess of corruption, wouldn't you be comforted by the hope that somewhere out there there might be smart, talented people who care about other human beings in real dire straits and for whatever reason use their powers and skills to help
Uh, you know I already wrote around one hundred lines in reply to your comment, until I noticed that there is no point in doing it.
Instead, I think all I have say to this is: Yes, we are insanely much better of than most of the other people living on this globe. No, I don't believe people in the lucky countries are interested enough in helping out those whose life is miserable. This is why I think we need ways to contribute to goodwill projects, which does not require complete rewrite of your life. For those that have huge amounts of excess money, donate some of that to an organisation that can find a good use for it. For those that have extra capacity in their head or skills (like programmers), donate some of your time to goodwill projects. For those that can build conrete things with their hands, participate in a such project. I think that there should be possibilities for helping by giving out a part of your excess resources, whatever it may be.
And the motivation for it? Who cares if the motivation was just getting a free GPS module? So what? Atleast I am just an average greedy person, and am interested in cool gadgets, good food, good TV shows. Sorry. There is no chance that I could ever devote myself to others like some other people do. However, I have decided that atleast for now, when I have extra resources left after running the simple survival process, I will put some of these extra resources atleast into thinking how these extra resources could help others. But yes, be warned - if a civil war starts in Finland, my first concern will not be keeping openchallenge.org up and running.
Re:Smiley face (Score:2)
Hi Jussi, Sure, you can use it.
Not a long reply though ;)))
Re:You have the problem BACKWARDS (Score:2)
1) I don't have money. 2) I believe many unemployed programmers would get work, if they could show that they have real life experience. You could understand participating in a goodwill project as education. I really believe, that if you are unemployed - by helping someone else, you are helping yourself.
Re:This guys isn't qualified... (Score:2)
I know about netaid. I believe we can complement it. According to my (limited) knowledge, contributing through netaid poses quite many constraints and has some limitations - also it is targeting a much wider focus, software is not the key issue in it. Yes, it might be that in the end the co-operation will be with NetAid, instead of UNITeS. However, the matter is worth investing.
Re:Similar Idea (Score:2)
for the rest of the readers, we already exchanged emails - and will probably try and find ways for co-operation between VWDN and openchallenge [openchallenge.org].. :)
Re:I'll volunteer if ... (Score:2)
Someone should suggest Uncle Sam that they should re-invent goods-trading economy on these issues. I am sure they have lots of software projects to which people like you could participate - and as result get your debts cleared in exchange :)
Re:Perhaps Universities could have a role? (Score:2)
Exactly, schools, universities and other organisations like could also benefit - and we are trying to get them informed. If you know any, please feel free to spread the word. Actually, if you read the 'about openchallenge' [openchallenge.org] page you will find a fairy tale tailored for universities. :)