Nosy Vendors? 72
avante asks: "For reasons ranging from political to financial, we have convinced an organization who wants to use our software to use only Open Source and Free Software, including GNU/Linux as their operating system. Because they will need support, we decided to go with Dell, since we had heard that they distribute a free operating system with their computers. First, I found out that they only sell non-Microsoft OS's on their 'server' models, which cost several hundred dollars more than comparable 'desktop' configurations. Since our clients are a cash strapped not-for profit group, we decided to purpose a low price 'desktop' as a server, and suffer the expense of the superfluous OS. When the sales rep. at Dell was told of our decision, he became upset and began demanding explanations as to why we wanted to use a 'desktop' as a server, what version of GNU/Linux we had intended to use and other things that were not any of Dell's concern. This is not the first time this has happened to us. Has anyone else experienced this sort of hostility when you try to deviate from their pre-ordained sales path and use Open Source/Free Software?"
They're in the hardware business... (Score:4, Insightful)
'nuff said.
Excuse me sir... (Score:4, Insightful)
Remind him . . . (Score:3, Insightful)
And then cancel your contract and buy your machines cheaper from a local white-box guy, which is what you should have been doing all along.
Dell has quit being it's own company and become a mildly independent subsidary of Microsoft sometime ago.
Maybe you should... (Score:5, Insightful)
Then demand of him
his name,
his supervisor's name and phone number, and
the phone number of a DELL competitor which doesn't presume to tell customers how to use their machines.
Then tell him good-bye.
Support Issues (Score:5, Insightful)
Look at it this way -- if the server support desk is trained in handling Linux issues on Server hardware, but the Desktop Team is trained in handling Windows issues on Desktop Hardware, who will provide support for Linux Issues on Desktop hardware?
Their questions should be angled at finding the Business Problem, and recommending the appropriate solution, but sometime the implementers have already defined the Business Problem in technical terms. (Linux WILL run on Dell Desktop Hardware, for under $XXXX.XX). Now, the salesperson has to try and work with this to recommend a solution that fits those criteria, is supportable by Dell, AND is a solution that will not fall apart and make Dell look bad.
Of course, the sales person should be nice about, and not "demanding"....
Umm... (Score:5, Insightful)
Good sales process (Score:3, Insightful)
On the matter of vendors (Score:3, Insightful)
It is entirely possible that he was curious about exactly what you wanted the system to do, and trying to come up with the best deal he could make you....
of course, if he was confrontational about it, etc, that's rude, poor salesmanship, and terribly unprofessional on his part. He should have asked for clear specifications regarding your needs in the first place.
I've also learned through extensive experience dealing with vendors like telcos, circuit carriers, and colo providers that keeping control of a conversation with them, and keeping them focused on what you want or need, is an acquired skill. It takes patience, the ability to be manipulative, and the ability to put your foot down while not stepping on anyone. And most importantly, you must remain focused on your needs.
(well, ok, maybe there was this one hosebeast at this one telco that I wanted to step on...heheh...)
One potential reason... (Score:3, Insightful)
Not actually being on the phone with the fellow, I don't know exactly how accurate your assesment(sp?) of his attitude was, but I think there is the possiblity that he could have been genuinely interested in the customer here. If Dell does not support linux on the configuration you were after, how do you expect them to support it? If they do not, why go through Dell in the first place? Find a white box locally. Also, perhaps he has been instructed to ask the customers about how they plan on using linux, so Dell knows better if/how to support linux in the future. They did at one point think/try putting linux on the desktop systems I believe. I don't think this guy is going to send out the elite dell stormtroopers to get you.
Ask for a different rep, go elsewhere, or build (Score:2, Insightful)
Also keep in mind that the "warranty" they offer isn't free, it's priced into the machine purchase or as an "extended" warranty option. They simply run the numbers each year and figure out how much repair costs are based on failure rates, pad that amount and then contract with a 3rd party servicing group. Locally, there are at least two different servicing groups that Dell uses.
That said, even though I buy Dell's for work I am still custom building for home. Unfortunately, the price points keep leaning more and more in Dell's favor. I build for reliability and therefore don't care about gaming or having the absolute most reliable computer. Dell or any of the big vendors can simply build decent machines a lot cheaper than we can by using volume purchasing and we don't have to worry about RMA'ing defective motherboards and such.
You made it his business (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Good sales process (Score:2, Insightful)
This is not, as some have suggested, a support issue, either. If you use an unsupported operating system, and you come to Dell with OS-related issues, they are morally and legally right to tell you that it's no concern of theirs, just as if you wrote an application that didn't work. When we choose open source, we become our own support organizations. When the issues get over our heads, we find help. If the only help that works costs money, you pay what it takes, or you don't. If we can't handle that arrangement... well "we" is the wrong word. Opensource zealot or microsoftie, if you're still with me, you're not in that category.
Dell is protecting their reputation (Score:2, Insightful)
Dell charges more for their computers than an equivilant machine from ernies-house-of-whiteboxes.
They charge more because they want to stay in business. Selling the cheapest possible computer might seem like a great idea, but it turns out it's a lousy business model, and everyone who's tried has gone broke.
They're able to charge more because they have a reputation for good service and reliable computers. I suspect that's pounded into the Dell sales force's head quite a lot. It's probably also pounded into the sales force head that you try to sell the customer the right tool for the job. If the customer needs a server, sell them a server. If the customer needs a configuration that's been rigourously tested with linux, sell them a configuration that's been rigourously tested with linux.
In this case, I think the Dell rep did the right thing. If this is the kind of thing that has happened to you often in the past, as you claim, then you're probably not very good at selecting the right tool for the job. The Dell rep probably sensed this, and (rightly) decided to call you on it. Since you're basically acting as a consultant to your client, the Dell rep knows that if the buying decision later turns out to have been wrong, either you or Dell are going to be blamed for the failure. If Dell has gone on the record as recommending against your decision, they've placed the fault squarely in your lap. If something fails, you'll look like an ass, and Dell will look golden. If nothing fails, they still have done the right thing for your client.
The question you should be asking is why you're not willing to take the advice of your vendors, and work together with them find the best possible solution for your client's needs.
Re:Dell is protecting their reputation (Score:3, Insightful)
A far more likely scenario is that the poster has a lot of experience setting up and/or managing servers, while the Dell sales rep has a lot of experience using handsomely-printed charts from HQ in Austin to figure out which equipment to sell to which customers.
One of these people has the requisite experience to adapt appropriate tools to the job. Guess which one?