Do Online Schools Provide A Quality Education? 598
"After the dot com 'boom' settled down a bit, and I was no longer required to work 80 hrs a week, I decided that after ten years of being absent I would go back to school and finish up that elusive CS degree. Well, after shopping around a bit I found a very good, well known, University that was offering the degree, online.
'Cool,' I thought, no classes, all on my schedule, save gas, and I could work at 2 am if I wanted. I thought I had found the perfect way to learn.
BUT, after just one semester, I am starting to have my doubts. I am sure this is the way to go in the future, but I'm not so sure that the schools has got all the kinks worked out and I am beginning to believe that the professors, and possible even the schools, see this as a way for them to teach a class with a minimal amount of effort and cost.
You basically have a public conference area (a web based discussion group for comments) that you, the other students, and the professors participate in. This works very well because your assignments are given out on a weekly basis and you have a whole week to post comments and complete your assignments. You are required to participate in the discussions and then post your answers to quizzes in a private portfolio where it is graded by the professor and then returned to you.
Most of the professors participate in the conference like you are in a real classroom; with student asking questions and the professor responding, though, it is not real time.
But some of the professors only want you to post to the public discussion groups and never have you post to the private portfolio, basically this means they don't have to do anything accept scan the conferences and give out more assignments. They don't have to look over your work and give you any feedback. I bet it takes less than an hour a week to do this. Also, this allows other students to see the answers and just repost them.
The only thing this person seems to be doing is sitting on his butt all week; telling the students to just follow the syllabus for reading; and occasionally surfing the discussions groups to see who is there. That sounds like a very good deal for them, but I am not getting much out of this.
I also feel that ALL of the professors are very behind-the-times when it comes to IT. Just today I had a professor tell me she would not allow me to post a PDF file to my portfolio because she was worried about getting a virus when she read it?!
A few questions come to mind: Is this a quality education? Should the professors be required to show what they have done because they don't have a real classroom to attend? How much effort should a professor put forth for an online class? This has always been an issue in a real classroom, but now we have a whole new twist. Shouldn't professors be required to be a little more techno savvy before they give a course like this? Shouldn't the schools be reevaluating the 'new teaching style' and making some adjustments?
I am so angry with the way the school has set this up I will probably return to a normal class environment here at a local college, at least I know the guy is going to show up!
Has anybody else been to an online college? What were your experiences?"
University of Phoenix (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:5, Funny)
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:5, Insightful)
Hurray for you, and I mean that. I've attended several conventional colleges, and it is not unusual for me to think I could do just as well buying the textbooks and hardware and learning on my own. Supposedly, the instructor in such classes is teaching me to think on my own. Fine; I can think on my own without going into hock to some school. This is particularly true of programming, which I am beginning to suspect is never actually taught anywhere, because everyone has theories about programming, but no one has any science. All that exists in the programming world are fads and baseless dogmatic assertions.
Science in Computer Science (Score:3, Informative)
This is particularly true of programming, which I am beginning to suspect is never actually taught anywhere, because everyone has theories about programming, but no one has any science. All that exists in the programming world are fads and baseless dogmatic assertions.
May I suggest Introduction to Algorithms by Cormen, Leiserson, Rivest, and Stein? If you like the material, The Art of Computer Programming (three volumes) by Knuth is very detailed and very heavy on the math. If one does a thorough
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:3, Insightful)
Just because you can read do
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:3, Insightful)
Now take something like engineering thermodynamics. There are so many different ways to approach thermodynamics, and there are a ton of arbitrary experimentally derived constants (like emissivity of a material
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:3, Informative)
On another note, UoP is shooting itself in the foot by having an age requirement.
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:4, Insightful)
If you already know how to think, why weren't you honing your skills by using your amazing logic-fu on them? Surely someone as smart as you could have had them all watching Fox News within a matter of days.
Sounds to me like you're afraid to think, afraid of head-on confrontation with perspectives that differ from your own.
There's no better way to figure out what you really believe than by being surrounded by people you think are wrong. That is, if you're up to the challenge.
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:4, Funny)
> I never assign my students busy work
Hmmm, a professor thinking that his/her assignments are all completely useful and relevant.
When in traffic, I only exceed the speed limit when I have a good reason. I never speed without a good reason.
I don't know (Score:5, Insightful)
For example, they have these teams "collobarate" to write a paper. The team lead, gets to write the introduction, each person gets a specific section in the body, and another poor sap gets the conclusion. What a stupid way to write a paper. The team lead is on easy streat writing a one paragraph into, each person writes something so so so so specific, as to not learn/grasp anything, or even learn how to structure an essay, and the schmuch who got stuck with the conclusion, ends up spending hours trying to cohesively tie everything together. In the end, you wind up with a paper that is poorly written, has no logical flow, etc etc. I'm all for group projects, but it seems they like to work in groups for things that don't need to be worked on in groups, and don't work in groups for things that make sense to be worked on in groups, etc.
And all the communication is done by usenet newsgroups? This has got to be one of the poorest mediums for this type of work. I hear people complain how the servers are slow, don't update correctly, lose postings,etc. And people are having a hard time even tracking threads/converstations and such, cause people keep attaching to the wrong thread, etc...
Some of my EE classes in college were also distance learning classes, but we had cameras set up in the class, etc. Then again, I had a special prof. He didn't believe in note taking, cause he said every minute you spend writing notes, is another minute you aren't paying attention. So he had all the notes, guides, tables, etc all written before hand, and organized into a big fat binder, that you had to buy from the bookstore. That and he was very interactive, but now I'm getting off topic...
Anyways, for the money that UofPhoenix charges, I think its a big rip. I think they should've had pre-recorded and/or live lectures in real/windows media/name your favorite format, and you watch those, and the assignments are assigned there, etc. Use instant messaging for live chats/lab sessions/one-one etc etc. Hell, even use email threads for conversations or turning in assignments, using PGP or equivelent.
Anyways, back to our regularly scheduled programming...
Re:I don't know (Score:5, Informative)
In the end, you wind up with a paper that is poorly written, has no logical flow, etc etc.
Welcome to the business world. And I'm not even trying to be clever, this kind of collaborative work is more and more common these days. Our company swears by Lotus Notes which means most documents are pored over by huge teams of people, everyone submits a comment or two which must be incorporated, and you end up with something truly collaborative that often doesn't make a whole lot of sense. In fact most "collaborative" software people are raving about these days is about consolidating a cacaphony of sound bites from different people into a cohesive document. I'm not certain it works, although that's certainly what Open Source is about (and literally the entire purpose of CVS) so maybe I'm wrong. I still subscribe to the belief that a single brilliant chef can make a better meal than 20 working together. In fact, it makes me want to coin a phrase...
Re:I don't know (Score:4, Insightful)
Ownership, it does a project good.
Re:I don't know (Score:5, Insightful)
http://www.longleaf.net/ggrow/computerbad.html [longleaf.net]
[How Computers Cause Bad Writing]
In the past seven years, I have edited the writing of a number of professionals--including instructional designers, engineers, management consultants, environmental planners, biologists, psychologists, Army officers, and journalists--who write with computers. Like most users of word processing, these are not "writers"--they are professionals whose work requires them to write. Few of these have ever heard of "the writing process," and few have had any formal training since freshman English 20 years ago. For them, like millions of others, writing by computer is largely a self-taught enterprise.
Although most of these professionals share the belief that computers help them write, they display specific writing problems that may actually be caused, or accentuated, by the fact that they write on computers.
There are two reasons why the writing problems of professionals may be important to teachers of writing. First, students that I have taught (graduate students in instructional development and education, juniors and seniors majoring in communication and journalism) show similar tendencies when they write on computers. Though student writers may not have enough experience to demonstrate all of them, they distinctly gravitate toward the writing problems described here.
Second, many students from writing classes will soon be surrounded by people who have largely taught themselves writing and word processing. These self-taught professionals will become your graduates' next writing instructors--and their bosses. Unless students bring with them enough experience to maintain and defend good writing habits--the kind that make them effective, productive writers--they may be swamped by the kind of writing habits and writing problems common among self-taught professionals.
I will describe the problems I have observed among "real world" users of word processing and suggest some strategies for working with future professionals while they are still your students. What I have to say will apply best to nonfiction writing that is amenable to strong focus and clear organization--functional writing of the kind required of professionals in many fields.
The Editing Trap [Substituting Writing for Thinking]
Computers seem to tempt people to substitute writing for thinking. When they write with a computer, instead of rethinking their drafts for purpose, audience, content, strategy, and effectiveness, most untrained writers just keep editing the words they first wrote down. I have seen reports go through as many as six versions without one important improvement in the thought. In such writing, I find sentences that have had their various parts revised four or five times on four or five different days. Instead of focusing, simplifying, and enlivening the prose, these writers tend to graft on additional phrases, till even the qualifiers are qualified and the whole, lengthening mess slows to a crawl.
Drawn in by the word processor's ability to facilitate small changes, such writers neglect the larger steps in writing. They compose when they need to be planning, edit when they need to be revising.
Problems in Collaboration by Computer
Computers encourage more collaborative writing, and they encourage the collaboration to be far more intense. Before computers, the usual form of collaboration consisted of dividing up the work so that different authors wrote different chapters; then they reviewed one another's work. Writing with computers, though, collaborators can enter into one another's work so readily and revise it so easily that, in effect, co-authors can mutually co-write each sentence.
This kind of collaborative writing can be difficult to read. No two writers have quite the same sense about punctuation, tone, rhythm, headings, sentence variation,
A better way to write a group term paper (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:A better way to write a group term paper (Score:5, Insightful)
What I find works well for group projects (papers, particularly) is to appoint a group "editor". They will actually do the writing. As a group, you all get together and determine the outline and form of the document, and what you want to accomplish. Then, divide up the portions of the outline and assign the specific research to each person - but keeping it lighter on the editor - they'll work harder in the end.
As research is completed, the parts are sent to everyone for review and comment - but these parts aren't fully written, but again, more like an outline.
Once everyone is happy with the content that will be included, the "editor" then takes the outlines of everything and writes the paper based on that. That draft then goes out to everyone and people comment, revise, correct, etc... but the writing is done through one person.
This way, everyone contributes to the work, and knows where it is going before they start. The paper has "one voice" and sounds coherent.
If you think of a product assembly process, it's stilly to have each person do every step of the process. It's better to have people focus on what they are good at - some at editing, some at researching, etc.
in the real world, yes, but not in school (Score:5, Interesting)
a big part of going to school is learning to do new things--getting better at the things you're not already good at. Focussing on the stuff you already do well kind of makes the whole exercise moot.
Re:in the real world, yes, but not in school (Score:3, Insightful)
It has been my MBA class experience that these group projects are designed more to get people to function as groups - and not to see if each person can do the whole project. It's trying to prepare you for the "real world".
Most of the projects I've worked on are bigger than one person can normally do - so you are forced to learn how to organize as a group and work together and complete the project. It's in your best interest to distribute the work in accordance w
Re:A better way to write a group term paper (Score:3)
Anyway, the point is that only one person did the writing, thus keeping the documen
Re:I don't know (Score:3, Funny)
Well, that would explain the poor quality of postings and why there are so many "IN SOVIET RUSSIA" goatsex, etc. posts when they should be discussing class stuff.
Re:Sounds like a typical college eduation (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:I don't know (Score:3, Insightful)
Note taking is an important skill and part of the learning process. Is the professor going to write notes for you after you graduate? Do you expect your boss to write your notes for you? Or, do you not expect ever to take notes after graduation?
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:5, Informative)
What really bothered me is that the school has billed my credit card for over $3,000 in billing mistakes. While they have refunded all this money, I have spent more time on the phone with them then I care to think about.
At the moment I am looking for other options.
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:3, Interesting)
To me, the UoP seemed like a two year course on Power Point using a smattering of topics to keep things somewhat interesting.
Is this really all the school has to offer, or do things get better
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:3, Interesting)
they also have at least some standards. Their grade inflation is caused by competition, not by desire of getting you to pay more.
U of Phoenix is accredited (
Not so: The truth about the (many) for-profit Univ (Score:5, Interesting)
UoP is the "gold standard" because they only do degree programs. The rest have greater or lesser participation in "diploma" programs, which could be anything from art school to diesel mechanics. (Think Sally Struthers, and I'm not talking about hungry kids.)
Two-thirds of the all the for-profit enrollment goes to these institutions. The rest mostly go to numerous privately-owned for-profit colleges.
The big guys all have online programs to some extent, while the little guys are also developing them thanks to online service providers like microcap EVCI, which used to be a videoconference company but now licenses software and acts a service provider for online education to many colleges, including some of the big ones.
All the big colleges are expanding by buying up the smaller institutions. However, already owning 2/3 of the space, they are now finding it tougher to expand profitably and have started buying things like Caribbean medical schools (Ross U.). Because of the way Title IV federal funding for education works, it is much more favorable to by a branch already in operation that to open a new one. To continue to expand, they have to gain students from the non-profit colleges, namely the community colleges.
At quick glance one can't tell a for-profit from a non-for-profit unless you check it out. And it's not clear that you should care too much--many non-profits are run basically for the benefit of administrators and faculty--that's who gets the economic profit!
The big difference used to be the aggressive recruiting by the for-profits, which has since been disallowed because the institutions would price whatever program (degree or diploma) at the level of the government loans and just sing people up, telling them that they didn't have to front any money. Then the poor bastards would graduate (or more often, not) 18 or 24 months later none the wiser, default on their loans, and the institution would still get paid, because the loans are government guaranteed (besides which, they already collected their money). New York state is now changing the law to at least withhold 1/3 of funds until the student actually graduates; it's a small hardship for students to raise the cash ( a few thousand) but will make a huge difference in eliminating the "no-money-down" type programs that really take advantage of people who believe everything they read in subway advertisements.
As you would expect, the for-profits are quicker to sell what they know people want to buy. And many people want cheap, easy degrees. Particularly in government service, it doesn't matter where you get your degree, as long as it's from an accredited institution, which almost all institutions aside from pure diploma mills (and a number of law schools) are. Like people said, I'm sure you could learn a lot online if you were really excited about the material. But most people aren't paying for the material; they are (or should be) paying for the structure and feedback that they need to help (force) themselves to learn the material, just like hiring a personal trainer.
The online degrees may be a great deal for the first people to get them, before employers get wise to the average level of learning completed. Then the backlash will come.
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:5, Interesting)
Overall, however, online education has given me much more than a classroom ever has. For instance, I'm horrible with math:
Traditional classroom: Instructor works through some problems during class, talks about theory, etc. Assigns homework. You turn it in. Little to no conversation with your fellow students on these assignments, as it's considered to be cheating.
UOP: All homework was posted, publically, in the main classroom folder. Yes, this means everyone got to see everyone else's homework, and we were encouraged to discuss it. The homework accounted for a small % of the total grade. Several days after each homework assignment was turned in, a quiz covering the same material was due, which was posted privately. The quizzes impacted our grades in a major manner. And, of course, there was a final.
I was able to look at other student's homework assignments while doing my own, and actually post public questions when I had problems (which was often) and I'd receive half a dozen replies every time. The end result? I learned enough during the homework phase each week to ace the quizzes, and received a 3.9 in the first class and a 4.0 in the second. I barely passed Algebra classes at our local community college.
Overall, my experience with UOP has been great. Expensive - I wouldn't be attending if my employer wasn't footing the bill, as it will have cost around $50k when I'm done - but if someone else is paying for it, there's no better way to fly.
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:3, Insightful)
Quite the opposite at my college. Our lectures do consist of the professor going through the theory and presenting a few examples, but it doesn't stop there. Our homework assignments are challenging, but we are encouraged to work together - otherwise it would be nea
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:3, Informative)
I'm not sure what college you went to but this wasn't the case at either of the 2 colleges I attended (CWRU and a tiny liberal arts school in the middle of nowhere).
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:3, Informative)
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:University of Phoenix (Score:3, Insightful)
On-Line University Circumscision (Score:4, Funny)
It cost him $48,00 but he has a good job now at the hospital. He gets 100 skins a week, and a chance to get ahead. Really.
He got his certificate by email, and he printed it on his color printer, and it looks really great up on his wall.
He hardly ever makes many mistakes.
It worked for him.
Shorty
That is all you can ask for! (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:That is all you can ask for! (Score:3, Funny)
I think online courses would be outstanding in this capacity.
Waah (Score:5, Interesting)
Calculus - yeah, read the book, do the assignments, complete the exam. Hooray, you know calculus - you pass.
Literature - much more subjective, requires more work on the part of the professor/TAs.
It's important to note that many professors "skate" in real life university as well. They give the lectures, and the TAs do all the actual work. Some make themselves available between classes, some dont.
Quit whining.
Re:Waah (Score:5, Insightful)
It does depend on the class as well as the teacher, not the tools. My best teacher used online tools to teach, we used blackboard, she used the internet to assist with her lectures, and our assignments were posted on the internet.
This was best, first if you messed the lecture it means you'll have to put more effort into doing your required readings, if you make your lectures the exams are much easier.
When it comes to writing paper it requires you to do alot of research on your own and you'll need the computer to do it, however its guided research because the teacher tells you what you need to research.
Overall a teacher is supposed to be like aa coach or guide, they show you the right way to do something, then you go do it.
Sometimes they dont show you the right way, such as with writing papers, here you have to figure out yourself the right way and your graded on how well you do it.
Like I said a teacher is just a coach, they guide you, its your job to teach yourself using the materials they give you and the tools you have as your disposal.
Re:Waah (Score:3, Insightful)
I frankly doubt that a person who makes it through Calculus this way really knows Calculus. Really all this approach does for you is put a notch in your transcript. To really understand the subject you have to learn the mechanics but also come to grips with the theory and concepts, learn how to apply what you've learned into new situations, learn how to see it in everyday things... Just punching t
Re:Waah (Score:3, Insightful)
There is an excellent point here -- lectures (and, by extension, all classes) are educational only insofar as they compe
of course they do (Score:5, Funny)
In related news today... (Score:5, Interesting)
HSD official obtained Ph.D. from diploma mill [washingtontechnology.com]
A high-ranking career official in the Homeland Security Department apparently obtained her doctorate from a Wyoming diploma mill [fakedegrees.com].
Laura L. Callahan, now senior director in the office of department CIO Steven Cooper, states on her professional biography that she "holds a Ph.D. in Computer Information Systems from Hamilton University [hamilton-university.edu]." Callahan, who is also president of the Association for Federal IRM [affirm.org] and a member of the CIO Council [cio.gov], is commonly called by the title "Dr."
Callahan's resume says she began her civil service career in 1984. Before joining HSD, she was deputy CIO at the Labor Department.
Hamilton University, according to an Internet search, is located in Evanston, Wyo. It is affiliated with and supported by Faith in the Order of Nature Fellowship Church, also in Evanston. The state of Wyoming does not license Hamilton because it claims a religious exemption. Oregon has identified Hamilton University as a diploma mill unaccredited by any organization recognized by the U.S. Department of Education.
[...]
Not me (Score:2, Interesting)
Is this your first college experience? (Score:5, Insightful)
Sounds like they are providing a pretty darn authentic college experience.
Education is what you make of it.
Misconception about Online classes by Instructors (Score:3, Interesting)
Typing out an answer to a question requires a lot more time and effort than if you can say it orrally while visually checking to see if everyone understands it
Additionally, an instructor is much harder pressed to find ways to check students for understanding. In a classroom I can just call someone to t
Re:Is this your first college experience? (Score:4, Insightful)
Utterly untrue. Are you asserting that if you took a class with an interested and involved professor, that you would gain zero benefit over the same class taught by an apathetic jerk of otherwise equal qualifications?
All evidence points to the contrary. Graduates of small, high-quality, close-knit colleges outperform graduates of large, impersonal universities in almost all fields including science and engineering. What's more, these small colleges are usually less selective than the big prestige schools, taking B or C high-school students and turning out top performers. In other words, a good education doesn't just teach you stuff, it should literally make you smarter. If all you got out of school was that the book is your "teacher," then your tuition was little more than an expensive library card.
It sounds like this worked out very well for you, but that's merely making the best out of a bad situation. Your thoughtful advice should be heeded only by people who attend a school where professors won't -- or can't -- contribute to the improvement of their students. (This includes every online school I know of, although I would love to know if there are any exceptions.)
--
Dum de dum.
the best online class (Score:3, Insightful)
Brierberk College in London inpartnership with a University in Israel..
Classe were online from IUPUI campus(Purude at Indianapolis) and discussions were held in a MUD..
and this was 1994...:)
I have worked for a university in the past... (Score:5, Interesting)
On the other hand, for the courses that they offered entirely on-line both knowledge acquisition (by performance on standaraduzed tests) and student satisfaction declined (something like 15 and 10 percent respectively, IIRC).
Now they have switched several other courses over completely to the 80/20 format, but offer fully on-line courses only as correspondence alternatives.
Not just online colleges (Score:2)
Re:Not just online colleges (Score:4, Insightful)
How many people do you know who are stupendously competent, but have little in the way of formal certifications? How many people do you know who have a list of letters after their name, but couldn't find their ass with a flashlight and a GPS?
Now, for extra credit, which one gets promoted?
Such is life, unfortunately.
Well said... (Score:4, Insightful)
I feel that way about my profs. and I don't go to an online school.
Re:Well said... (Score:4, Insightful)
I had very few undergrad classes where there was actual classroom interaction with an actual professor and other students (like less than 5), because most had at least 50-75 students.
I don't knock the TA led small groups or even small classes, because often the TAs are more current on the material being taught than the profs can be, especially when its more basic undergrad stuff.
The thing online classes can never have, IMHO, though is the magic that can take place when a talented professor lectures. Not only do you learn stuff, but they can make even tedious sounding material come alive ("Germany During the Reformation"). Reading books and doing online busywork can't compare.
Re:Well said... (Score:5, Insightful)
stradling the gap (Score:4, Interesting)
Basically, in addition to the book, the sylibus, and the final exam, an online class should provide you with work (which you are supposedly motivated to do) and rapid responces to your work. Therefore allowing you to quickly learn by example and understand your mistakes. If you are able to motivate yourself, and already know enough about the subject to find your mistakes, you would be better off simply buying a book.
Costs are very high... (Score:3, Interesting)
Interesting, analysis, I think (Score:3, Funny)
My Mamma Told Me.... (Score:5, Informative)
Quality varies greatly, as do student expectations. Some students simply want the credits and there are certainly programs out there willing to offer the "skate" option.
However, I know plenty of professors/instructors who are passionate about online education. They spend much more time now with online stuff then they do for an in-class class. Answering emails, homework help, IM sessions, group chats, etc. And, it works and students are happier because it fits in their schedule. But in each case that I can point to as a success, the instructors are working harder.
professors (Score:2, Interesting)
I'm sure we've all had professors in our day that have been sub par. That is when you must take it upon yourself to learn the material on your own. In my opinion a professor should only be used as a back-up tool for your own learning... no matter how good or bad the professor might be.
Good for me (Score:3, Interesting)
For example, my last class was a law and ethics class. I probably spent 20 - 25 hours a week working on my papers for that class. However, I was greatly appreciative of my professor of that class because he provided me with detailed homework assignments. In addition, when I got feedback from him, it was on the order of 3 pages long. However, my class before that was not as good. The professor in that class would just give me a grade and not tell me why I received that particular grade. However, all the of the professors that I have had have been very open about communication. In fact, my current accounting professor and I have talked every weekend since the class has started.
Maybe some schools take it seriously and others don't? But, I can tell that I am working my butt off. I haven't had a whole lot of slack time.
My Troubles With On Line Class (Score:5, Interesting)
My problems were partly due to the way the class was run and partly due to my own nature. I had a tough time getting work done because there was no 'scheduled' time for me to show up any where. Rack this up as a failure on my part but I just tend to be more successful at getting work done when I've got to show up to class and turn it in.
The lack of in class time was tough because I couldn't sit and look at examples while the instructor was there to talk about how things were done. I missed that time to discuss with the instructor and other students. I know I'm not the only one who struggled in that regard. I did meet up with another student early on and help her learn how to set up and use her compiler. (free borland compiler)
On the class failing side- when I emailed the teacher with questions, responses were not prompt. His lectures were posted and there was no good method for getting further information to clarify points made in the lecture, etc. It was basically as you describe. Read a book, do homework, take a final.
There may be some who can use the format to advantage but it did not work well for me.
Not Limited To Online Schools (Score:2, Insightful)
I often tell about an experiment I did in college. I wrote a English Composition 101 paper with some carefully crafted mistakes and submitted it to the four teachers that taught that course. The final grades were: D, C, B, and A. For the same paper.
Of course, there
Arizona State University Online (Score:2, Informative)
Just like real school! (Score:4, Insightful)
The only thing this person seems to be doing is sitting on his butt all week; telling the students to just follow the syllabus for reading; and occasionally surfing the discussions groups to see who is there. That sounds like a very good deal for them, but I am not getting much out of this.
Yup, that sounds like pretty much every professor I had! Infact, there was one "intro to unix class" where the guy just printed off MAN pages right before class and used those to "teach"!
Couple that with people who have TAs do the grading, and the fact that at research oriented uni's (like mine) the professor is busy trying to get grants, screw the kids!
A lot of university classes are like that- and in those cases you are either paying for a "name" university, or you are paying less for a non-name uni.
Now I just finished my masters from the Part Time Engineering program and I had some friends take the same classes but the on-line versions: its a mixed bag.
If the professor has a set of slides that they teach from and they are top-nothc quality, then you don't even need to go to class! (this was true in undergrad for my CIRCUITS course- the text book blew, but his bound class notes were INCREDIBLE. start studying 6 hours before the final, walk out with an A)
So I'm sorry your professors stink. Its the SAME in person.
Unrealistic expectations (Score:4, Informative)
I never got huge amounts of feedback from my assignments in school, beyond the obligatory "nice work" etc. I think your expectations are a tad too high.
And "techno savvy"? Quit channelling Jon Katz!
Nathan
Berkeley online... (Score:2, Insightful)
Anyway, I don't see anything inherently *wrong* with the model -- provided
Not Online college but, (Score:2, Informative)
The rest of my school is a complete joke, and the major reason is the professors. I
reliability (Score:2, Insightful)
I did my A-Level computing at a local college (UK). The tutors kept quitting, we went through at least six, and most likely more, some for only one week. More time was spent telling the tutor what we had done then learning, and there were people there who thought this was what you did after a typing course, and wanted everybody to go at their pace.
Just because the place is phys
not face to face is not education, its research (Score:4, Insightful)
You may as well be in a library reading the books on yur own... your simply spending your time paying bucks to get a "degree". Education is supposed to be a much more immersive experience, in which your entire world is focused upon whatever subjects your learning for certain spans of time. From the chalk-board to the many students to the profesor and all the hands on materials along with real hands on lab projects you can show to your fellow classmates and teachers in TRUE real-time.
When your simply posting and returning data from a web-page, and reading material be it online or off... you are not recieving an education, you are paying for the right to research and to attain a degree from it.
There are reasons why test taking is done in a class without access to the net and other such things. It is because you are supposed to test the actual mind and skills of a human without those resources at hand. This enables you to learn what you DONT know and to sharpen those skillsets.
Hence online education is kinda a joke. Ilearned a long time ago, i can learn anything i want without a piece of paper that says i did. So if your gonna go to school... make sure you go to the one with the biggest name.... cause thats all that matters in the end, youll learn what you want to know no matter what.
My experience (Score:5, Interesting)
I do have some complaints, though:
- The whole curricula was the standard texts and notes "grafted" onto an online interface. The material and method of moving through it was a "transplant" of a traditional class lecture, lifted onto an online format. This does not work well - kind of like taking a book, scanning each page into a graphic file, then posting this as an online version.
- We were provided PowerPoint lecture notes taken from "live" lectures, though without the benefit of seeing the lectures (my suggestion : record the "real" lectures and have online students purchase as DVDs or VHS)
- I missed office hours and the ability to chat with knowledgeable graduate students when I got stuck. With some conceptually difficult material, you really have to hash over it with a live mentor to understand how it works.
- No real socialization with other students, owing to geography.
- "Group" projects were a nightmare of conference calls, online chats, emailing drafts back and forth, etc.
The good side is it allows folks with full time jobs to get degrees. It also allows folks to get specialized degrees that may only be available at a handful of institutions.Re:My experience (Score:3, Insightful)
My experience. (Score:5, Informative)
Throughout the computer courses, it was specifically stated that "This program [the computer learning software] is a supplement to the book, and is NOT intended as a replacement for it." Well, because of the low funding (too many dropouts - imagine why), the books were not available. The courses mainly consisted of a page where it would have 30 or so possible answers, and a date,event or name. You were supposed to pick the associated answer (after all, you read the book already), then move on. Every time you got the wrong aswer, you had to answer 3 more correctly before you could continue. Fortunatly, I learned to take notes (selection window, alt, e, copy, alt-tab, ctrl+v), so I could continue at a decent pace. Note taking was allowed. So while most people failed out after just a few weeks (the courses were _impossible_ without notes), I passed my senior english class in under 24 hours (I did have to rent mcbeth, and write a report).
In short, if you are a die-hard student (or really hate the place like I did), or if the program is _properly_ implemented, it can be a great tool. In the wrong hands, it's just failure waiting to happen.
University of Illinois - Urbana Champaign (Score:4, Interesting)
I only took 2 courses so far, and I am very impressed with how they handle and treat the program. Everyone invloved is very professional. The teachers actually go out of their way to accomodate both on and off campus students. My experience has been extremely pleasant, and I'm very satisfied with what they offer.
USC too (Score:3, Interesting)
Depends on what you want to get out of it (Score:5, Interesting)
Along the way I learned that graduate work is fun and picked up an MS degree [stevens-tech.edu] as well.
While my education allows me to check the "has a BS" and "has an MS" boxes on job applications, the real benefit came from the faculty and students I met over the course of my four years.
That having been said, I think there is an enormous opportunity for online education. My education was expensive, and in this economy there is no guarantee that you will have a job on graduation. High quality schools have can accept only a limited number of students. The Internet is an incredible way to inexpensively disseminate information to a large number of people.
The original universities expanded substantially as books and paper became more and more available. Surely the internet will change education to an even greater extent.
Comparison Website (Score:3, Interesting)
Two-way street (Score:5, Interesting)
Likely those professors feel exactly the same way about the students taking online courses.
There is an ongoing conservative perception in academia (not without merit) that, quite simply, people that are dead serious about obtaining a quality education are willing to make time for classes and all the homework they entail. I have spoken with a few of these teachers myself; they all felt that anyone whose schedule was already so packed that they couldn't find time to physically attend lectures and discussions was probably better off postponing their enrollment altogether until a point when they had the time and resources to properly devote toward a formal education, rather than risk acquiring something of potentially lower quality.
One of them went so far as to speculate on the much more involved feeling one gets when actually sitting in a classroom surrounded by dozens of students and with the professor lecturing authoritatively at the front. Basically, such a setting makes it all seem more real and therefore adds unconscious pressure to the participating students to take the class and its material seriously--as opposed to viewing absolutely everything to do with the class on your own comfortable monitor, in your own comfortable home, where any pressure to succeed in the class has to be entirely self-generated. And don't kid yourself: motivation can often be totally unreachable without a kick in the pants. Hence why some instructors penalize for non-attendance. They don't do it out of meanness, they do it because such a policy helps students to learn when the students are not willing to help themselves.
Maybe I Don't Want "Quality Education" (Score:3, Insightful)
Maybe the best place for these online classes is as a way to teach the things that you never really wanted to learn in the first place and that you'll likely forget about as soon as you get that diploma.
I'm taking classes at a VERY expensive college in Boston, upwards of $15K a semester (with tuition, books, paying off the expensive Boston dorm/apartment, etc.). In order to take some nice $80 credits, I enrolled at Bunker Hill Community College for some gen eds. My major requires me to take History of A
Mississippi State (Score:5, Interesting)
I enrolled at Mississippi State University through their distance learning program. There's a good chance someone you're watching on TV has been through this course. It's three years, 17 courses, 50 some odd credits. Until I'm totally finished, there's no need to go to Starkville, MS or anywhere close.
I am impressed with the idea and execution. My lectures are delivered on both VHS tape and DVD (I watch the lectures on DVD, though at double speed!). My textbooks are standard issue, same as are used at brick and mortar colleges. Each course features weekly untimed quizzes (10%), quarterly timed tests based on homework (30%) and a timed midterm (30%) and timed final (30%).
The lecturers/professors aren't polished TV people... but which of your profs were? There are different instructors/proctors online who monitor a bulletin board, answer questions and ride herd. They are mostly attentive and helpful.
The tests and quizzes are administered online and are multiple choice.
The courses are run using WebCT software, which I am told is pretty standard with distance learning.
As in "real" college, sometimes I have to study, other times I do not. I have learned some interesting things (having gone most of the way through my first year)... even one or two useful things.
After the first semester, my wife asked if I had learned anything? I said yes. But, she noted, "how important could it be if you didn't need it in the last 20 years?" And, of course, she was right.
I found it interesting that before I was accepted, I had to send my transcripts and SATs to MSU. I was surprised the College Board still had my numbers, taken in December 1967 (back when SAT scores ended in single digits and not tens). I'm curious what these ancient records could possibly say about me now? It is living proof that when your teachers said something would go on your permanent record, they weren't kidding!
As a 52 year old, in the middle of my career, with a wife and family, this is the only way to go back to school. I'm a proud to say I'm a straight "A" student, something I never even approached during my first, ill fated, trip to college 35 years ago.
As an online instructor... (Score:3, Interesting)
I talk about some of these subjects from the instructor side on my own weblog, The Intuitive Life [intuitive.com], in particular you might want to check out I thought students had lots of opinions? [intuitive.com] and Lazy students, a rant [intuitive.com], both of which address the same basic question of student interaction.
If anyone has further questions that I can answer, please feel free to drop me a note!
Lowest Common Denominator Learning (Score:5, Informative)
I've come to think of online education as Lowest Common Denominator Learning (LCDL). I've had instructors who value face-to-face interaction and the "art" of teaching admit that the college is moving more and more classes to the online format because it's cheaper to run.
My reaction after all the online courses I've taken:
Interestingly, the best class I've taken online -- which I'm taking now -- is a Perl scripting class. It's only 1 credit hour, 3 weeks. Why?
Okay, that was waaay more than $0.02!
there is no free lunch (Score:3, Insightful)
This actually improved some of my classes. For one technical writing course, my professor was blind and conducted the course through e-mail via a screen reader. It was one of the best classes I've ever taken, and I had no clue he was blind until after the course was over and I talked to a friend (I always wondered why he was so particular about what the subject lines of our e-mails were...)
The key is that all of these professors had prior classroom experience. There is no Free Lunch (tm). If the institution has a good reputation IRL, they will offer good online classes. Online only universities without real life backing are sadly not ready for prime time yet. Maybe initiatives like MIT's OpenCourseWare, and less prestigous initiatives like the VT CS department's online courseware publishing (http://courses.cs.vt.edu/ - great lecture slides on C++ there) will change that someday by providing a basis in quality courseware... until then, though, you're better off at your local brick and mortar educational institution.
E-Learning needs to grasp the concept of 'online' (Score:3, Informative)
When doing E-Learning or setting up an E-Learning enviroment or teaching in an E-Learning enviroment there are a few things one has to keep in mind:
1.) Quality and content costs work and effort. The LMF may be SCORM compliant and cost 10 Million $, but if there's no quality content that has been set up by a competent team of developers, editors and teachers it's just a big hunk of code - and a big pile of useless, steaming excrement.
2.) E-Learning has benefits and drawbacks and so does classic learning compared to E-Learning. In your situation E-Learning may be more benefitial, but only if all involved know how to reap the benefits of E-Learning! If your Profs haven't the most basic skills of preparing and browsing online content - be it with their special system or the usual tools - it's somewhat pointless of taking lessons with them. Training the teachers is crucial to an online learning enviroment!
3.) E-Learning requires a basic skillset to even actually take place! Like normal learning and teaching requires skills like reading and writing, and, let's take math for an example, a basic knowlege of a formal language, so does E-Learning and E-Teaching require skills like proper e-mailing, online editing, preparing content for hypercontext, object-oriented thinking and a totally different subset of discipline. In class you shut up and listen and raise your hand when you want to ask something. And you only speak when asked (usually that is). Via E-Mail you use quoting and don't write tofu. (that's a simple example of this discipline thing)
With these points in mind and a whole lot more in the background I'd like to add that E-Learning hasn't grown up yet, imho. When I see the last remaining stashes of 'dot-bomb' cash being burnt on E-Learning projects that have no link to reality whatsoever (performance and usability wise) with hideously bloated databases that aren't even properly normalized and LMFs (learning mamagement frameworks) that cost enough money to give Etiopia a real chance and zilch usable content in them, I think it's safe to say one does good when looking closely thrice at an E-Learning enviroment. Be it as a teacher, scholar or the president of a university.
E-Learning/Online Learning will grow up when standards have prevailed and people generally will have grasped the concept of Hypertext and quoted commenting. Until then it will remain closer to pointless.
The rest is just detailwork by us developers and is mostly academic by real-world standards. Who in the end gives a damn if you use Smil or XML or JBoss or Zope? Right.
I took an online CS course. (Score:3, Insightful)
My Univ of Idaho experience (Score:3, Interesting)
I've heard good things about Univ of Pheonix, but last I checked, they don't offer Ph.D.s in Computer Science.
What I don't like about U of Idaho is how fast the papers come back to you graded. (Sometimes a month or so, depends on the instructor.) At first I was upset about it, and now I just figure that is how distance learning at the school works.
I've got only 18 hrs worth of Ph.D. work. It would be better to work off a local university, but if you don't have the option, this isn't bad too. The classes are entertaining and educational.
I've also heard it is a good idea to make sure that the instructors haven't graduated from the university they teach at. Inbreeding is a bad thing.
As a former online instructor... (Score:5, Insightful)
The entire process of "teaching" in that environment is only suitable for subjects that allow lots of "round table" style discussion. A liturature class where the plot motives are hashed out online in a forum would be a good example.
Math and science is next to impossible.
I would argue that the instructors are working in an unsuitable environment more than I would argue that the instructors are slack. It is a system that encourages a very hands off approach.
I would also argue that the degree obtained from those online schools is exactly what was purchased, a piece of paper. It has no academic merit. Like many private, for profit "schools", they exist to make money, not educated graduates. The one I was with even had incentives like those of a dot-com (stock options!).
In short, if you want an education that will move you ahead in life, go to the best traditional school in your interest area that you can get in.
If you want an impressive piece of paper that verifies you (or your parents) paid enough classes to qualify for a graduation ticket, go to a big name traditional private school.
If you want to wast several years online to "earn" a "diploma" doing the barest minimum for a big bucket of cash, go to an online school. It won't advance your career unless you dig ditches or hang off the back of a garbage truck (an completely horrid job that I am very gratefull that those people do. I always thank them when I'm out and the truck shows up.)
schizoid schools; more work, not less (Score:5, Interesting)
I've never taught an online course before, but from talking to a lot of my colleagues (and my wife, who's a teacher), reality seems to be exactly the opposite of what you're saying: it's typically much more work for the professor to teach a course online. Look, teaching a traditional lecture course is an easy gig, if you don't care about doing a good job. You have a set of canned lectures that you deliver every semester. You drone on and on, pausing to ask for questions, but never pausing for long enough that anyone will really go ahead and ask one. If you want to, you can also engineer things so that you don't have a lot of grading to do: don't grade homework, don't require papers, make all the tests scantron, etc.
Teaching online is a huge amount of work the first time you do it, because you have to create a cr--load of stuff on the web.
At my school, people seem to have had very mixed luck teaching things online. A lot of them report that they end up getting all the worst students in the online sections, because the students perceive it as an easy way to take care of the course -- you don't even need to show up for lecture? -- kewl! It also tends to be more reading- and writing-intensive, which is a problem for a lot of students at less selective schools, who are operating at a remedial level in English, or who may not be native English speakers.
Lazy Professor may really be Busy Professor (Score:5, Insightful)
So I'm saying the problem you see is probably fairly widespread and definitely real but will take a while to fix. The universities will need to put a priority on the online classes and hire staff that focuses on them. When that happens you will see better content/participation.
Online Horror (Score:5, Interesting)
We had a similiar online forum or web board to discuss with other students and get help from the teacher. The problem was the teacher was supposed to answer any questions and reply to each of your posts, ours never bothered. This wasn't too bad, as some of the students had a better grasp of the subject than others.
The worst problem I encountered, was that our teacher was not computer literate. She had problems opening my RTF, TXT, and PDF files. Claiming they were "too large" for her computer or giving her "virii." These are only little paltry 100K files, and she's griping.
She would assign 0's for these assignments without any dispute because they violated her "on-time" policy. Out of all the worst experience I had with her was with deadlines. When Christmas vacation rolled around, I synced all of the January dates in my PDA and on my wall calendar so I could do them on-time when the break ended. When I came back to turn them in, the datches were mysteriously changed to the last day of the break.
Now assignments are always spaced by almost three days a piece, and these were too before the change. When I tried to contact her about the late assignments, and why the dates were changed (especially why I wasn't notified) she said I should have been checking the calendar during Christmas when they were changed. Sure. An email would have been nice.
Finally she gets feud up of my complaints, and writes my course liasion (the guy who sets you up for the course). The irony is that she forged the date on the email to look as if she sent it a week earlier. Sadly headers proved her horribly wrong and caught in a lie. I showed the liasion and he called the "school." Her claim was that she doesn't make sure her rig's clock is set appropriately. Sure. Her clock magically jumped a week back.
When the course ended, I had failed miserably, I would get the correct answers but 0's for her inability to open (or willingness to do so) my files. I called the school and asked for a refund to which they complied.
Sadly to this day she still spams me with "You are late," emails...
Ph.D. on-line (Score:5, Interesting)
Some of the courses were easy, and related to my interests, others made me get out the Calculus and DiffEQ books from 20+ years ago when I went the formal route for my BS/MS.
While its true that there were no formal classes - the professors/tutors were available upon request, and there is an on-line chat capability for others taking the same course.
I busted my butt harder in this program than I had in the two previous ones where I was attending meat-space classes. Of course, this time I was working full-time with a wife and a 4yr old son (at the start).
My biggest complaint is that my employer would not reimburse me because their policy was if a local uni is available, they don't pay for distance learning.
jerry
No (Score:3, Insightful)
My experience as a virtual lecturer (Score:5, Informative)
My HORRIBLE experience at HVCC (Score:3, Informative)
I took an online CS course through Hudson Valley Community College (near Albany, NY) this past semester to brush up my C and C++ programming skills, and the course used the online course system from SUNY. The system itself has limitations in its capacity for providing an equivalent to a face-to-face lecture and for facilitating real discussion among students and instructors. But the biggest problem was a professor who went way beyond "skating" through the course, and virtually abandoned it.
Some people in this thread have claimed that a professor who puts insufficient effort into an online course is no different than one who does so in a classroom course, but I beg to differ. In a real classroom, you will at least know if the instructor doesn't show up for class. In my course, several times the professor didn't respond to anything posted for a week to ten days (if he responded at all), and at first I actually thought he might have died (or at least been in the hostpital)! What else could explain such behavior, unlike anything I've ever experienced in a classroom?
As an unfortunate side effect when this started to happen, most of the other students dropped the course (or at least stopped participating). If only I had known that this would continue throughout the course, I would have done the same while I still could. The consequence of this was that there was only one other student with whom to "discuss" anything, and she in too far over her head to be of any help.
After much effort I was able to get in touch with the professor by phone, at which time he assured me that things were back to normal and there wouldn't be any more slipping of the course schedule, assignments not handed out, questions not answered, self-tests not posted, etc., but that turned out not to be true. Assignments were not given until after the course syllabus said they were due. The course slipped weeks, then more than a month behind schedule.
I realized that contacting the professor again wouldn't be enough; I e-mailed his department chairman, who said he'd look into it. So the professor cut the missed units right out of the curriculum until it appeared we were back on schedule.
By the end, he had delivered more-or-less-complete materials for only about half of the units in the entire course, including almost nothing relating to C++. And he never once gave any feedback relating to any of the assignments submitted; they may as well have gone into a black hole. The only feedback I got on any of the programming assignments in the entire course was from the compiler.
The result was that I didn't get any more out of the course than if I had simply bought a textbook and done some of the exercises: no real instruction from the professor, no discussion among students, no feedback on any assignments.
I'm still in the process of trying to get my money refunded for this course that essentially didn't even take place, but I don't think my chances are too good now--because I was too persistent and (largely) stuck with it until the end! But in a classroom course, if the professor never showed up for half of the classes, wouldn't you expect to get your money back, or at least get a chance to take the course again at no charge (with a better instructor)?
Developing Online Courses (Score:3, Insightful)
My impression was that the Prof worked as harder or harder than in most face-to-face classes. Everytime I submitted an assignment it was returned graded within 24 hrs. Usually if I submitted in the morning it was returned in that afternoon and when I submitted in the afternoon it was returned the next morning. This was even true when I submitted them on weekends. He responded to emails even more quickly usually in less than an hour, frequently in 5-10 minutes.
Since it was a course in developing online courses, we talked about the amount of time it takes for the instructor. It was my Prof's belief that an online course took more of his time than a traditional class. In fact he limited the number in the class after the first time it was given because of this constraint.
The really nice thing about the course was that it provided for a broad range of learning styles. The main lectures were done in RealAudio with HTML "slides". But there were plenty of optional reference materials that a person could browse at the same time: outlines, transcripts, glossaries, etc. That plus the fact that I could instantly "rewind" and review anything I didn't quite follow made it a very good learning experience.
My guess is that you have instructors who barely know the material themselves, didn't develop the course materials themselves, have no educational training and are earning a pitifully low salary. That would be par for the course (no pun intended) in todays educational environment.
More work than they think (Score:3, Interesting)
A few questions come to mind: Is this a quality education?
That depends on what your goals are; if you need to get the paper to get a better job then sure! If you need to really do real work with the knowledge you gained, probably not.
Should the professors be required to show what they have done because they don't have a real classroom to attend?
Professors should be required to meet whatever criteria happens in a physical classroom. Sometimes that is not much, if you feel like the professor is not getting watched, your gripe is with the school, not the professor.
How much effort should a professor put forth for an online class?
A great deal. Making a class online is pretty hard, under estimating how much time, effort, and work it takes is common.
Shouldn't professors be required to be a little more techno savvy before they give a course like this?
Absolutely. Either that, or have someone around who is participating in what is going on who can teach the professors, or simply do the work for them. (Especially for a CS or technical class, the Prof. should have good to excellent computer usage skills, their students probably have them.) I constantly ran into not only technical ignorance, but arrogance about the techonology, like somehow if they could not push a mouse in the right direction it was the fault of the mouse. Not the fact they were inept and in way over their heads.
Note however, that the school also has the responsability to put forth enough effort to make the departments capable of teaching online (i.e. $$$). It is not as easy as getting a server farm, buying an expensive whiz-bang pile of software and a couple of grad students to admin the thing. It takes massive effort to teach the professors, the students, and generate the material correctly.
Shouldn't the schools be reevaluating the 'new teaching style' and making some adjustments?
No. They should be rebuilding the entire method used to transfer information from one brain to another.
Ok, here's my rant.
Every single client I ever worked with doing online classes severely underestimated the amount of work the presenter and the institution would need to put forth to put classes online. Not one came to me with even an INKLING of how much work it takes.
Even a "1 day" or "2 day" seminar takes a man-months to produce. Each point, concept, conclusion, idea, and so on has to be articulated in a scripted way (HTML, PDF, images, video, sound or whatever) and put together in a massive outline.
Most clients had the attitude "well, give it to the tech guy and he'll put it in there" without ever once thinking about the fact that the whole classroom model they are used to using is busted and needs to be planned out, created and put back together.br>
Once the big outline is done, THEN the whole thing has to be crammed into whatever method use to present the stuff. Next the professor has to figure out how to run all the stuff, and on top of dealing with their material in a new way, learn to deal with the interface, the new "24-hour" nature of the item, figure out how to keep the student's attention, run discussions and chat, and so on....
A few of the presenters were not even able to articulate themselves differently than their habititual ramblings in a classroom. They would say things, but couldn't TYPE them in a way that was understandable.
Struggling through this, they bitched the whole time about how much money it was costing. My response was, "well, hire your own full time geek or put up." (not in those exact words)
Web pages, and the companies that sell the "online classroom" services are only a
Lots of great schools, but even more frauds... (Score:5, Informative)
Totally dependent on the subject matter... (Score:3, Insightful)
If the course involves nothing but writing/reading, or writing computer code, then yes; it should be able to adapt fairly well to being taught online.
It would, on the other wing, be extremely difficult (if not impractical) to teach, say, courses in electronics over the 'net. This is simply because really -learning- electronics, chemistry, or any of the other physical sciences requires a hands-on lab environment with specialized equipment.
Until we develop 'holodeck' technology, I don't see how it would be possible to effectively teach such courses online. However, if someone knows of a system that can teach good hands-on electronic assembly skills, or techniques of component-level troubleshooting, I would love to hear about it.
So, in summary; it sounds to me like the course you're taking, although adaptable to an online environment, is indeed suffering from incompetence or laziness at the teaching level. I would not only complain to the school involved, I would also get in touch with your local state board of education, and tell them what's going on. At the very least, they may be able to start some sort of investigation.
Good luck.
Re:Er, (Score:5, Funny)
the whole idea of "on-line" is that you don't attend ... unless you can convert yourself into electrons or light pulses and shoot down the cat5 and fiber, in which case you certainly have a marketable ability/talent already.
Since it's leaving you feeling cheated, when they ask for "real" money, fax them a copy of a $100.00 bill. When they complain, tell them that you're giving them virtual money for a virtual education. If they had given you a real education, you'd give them real money.
Mind you, you have learned a real lesson, I hope ...
Re:pdf (Score:4, Informative)
And this class is part of a CS degree?
In the past there have been virus's that have been transmitted by pdf files such as the peachy [cwru.edu] virus. If the professor is not completely familiar with her univerisities virus scanning software it wouldn't be totally unreasonable to limit submitted files to certain formats.
Re:well... (Score:5, Funny)
Mr. Pot, please leave Mr. Kettle alone.
Re:Kennedy-Western University and Cappella Univers (Score:3, Informative)