Any Advice for Starting a Web Design Business? 76
stizoked asks: "Although we both have full time jobs, my wife and I have been doing a little web design/development on the side for some extra cash. Since we've started, we've built up a nice little client list, one big enough for us to consider getting a little more serious about pursuing it as a business. Does anyone have any advice or experience that we can use to dodge young and stupid mistakes? Any advice on some open source project management software or other software that makes running a small business a little easier?"
honset advice... (Score:5, Funny)
yeah... dont !!
Re:honset advice... (Score:1, Insightful)
Don't do it. Take the extra cash and realize that web design isn't the place to be.
Re:honset advice... (Score:2)
Too bad I didn't have mod points, nothing like an AC that has been flagged (Score: 2, Insightful)
Re:honset advice... (Score:2, Insightful)
1.He asked slashdot and that pathetic
2.He is working with his wife and by doing that he is risking a divorce.
3.The web design business is saturated.
4.since he is not a business yet then probably his list of clients are uncle joe and cousin george.
I want my karma backkkkk,.
Re:honset advice... (Score:2, Informative)
1.He asked slashdot and that pathetic
This is informal research to go along with other feasibilty research that I have been doing.
2.He is working with his wife and by doing that he is risking a divorce.
Some couples do have teamwork and relational skills. We're not all cube geeks who don't know how to relate.
3.The web design business is saturated.
You're probably right about this.
4.since he is not a business yet then probably his list of clients are uncle joe and c
Re:honset advice... (Score:2)
and what was the outcome of your research?
Some couples do have teamwork and relational skills. We're not all cube geeks who don't know how to relate.
I'm not antisocial, and I score "fair" with women but seriously do you want to put business in your marriage? starting your own business and strugling with your startup can put you very intense stress, and before you know it business and work will follow you to
Re:honset advice... (Score:1)
We are taking it VERY slow. It will remain a side job until we have a clear, longer term plan. We aren't going to rush into anything that we're not ready for, financially or socially. Trust me, Slashdot is not the only place we are seeking advice.
As far as competing with the "whole world," we are currently, and plan to keep, serving a couple of specialized, niche business areas, capitalizing on grassroots advertising. We feel that this is a wa
Re:honset advice... (Score:2)
on your right.
Re:honset advice... (Score:1)
Re:honset advice... (Score:2)
back in my days it took ages to etch the source code of kernel 0.0.01-alpha on the pyramids.
Re:honset advice... (Score:1)
I want my karma backkkkk
And this is where the no-karma-for-a-funny-mod 'rule' is punative.
C'mon, are we really expected to take Slashdot that seriously?
similar honest advice... (Score:2)
Nowadays I fear that large companies will require snazzy flashy "professional" sites that will require more than 2 people's spare time to create. And if you're not doing web design for those companies, just do it in your spare time as extra cash, not as a company.
Re:honset advice... (Score:2)
Web design is deader than MS Word skills. It is deader than putting MSDOS 4.2 on your resume. HTML is so easy, there are too many high school kids who can code in W3-standard HTML + PHP + CSS + Javascript, which is getting out of web design already.
Now if you're considering learning all about RDBMS, J2EE and building fancy business-oriented web-faced solutions, get right into it, but that is not called web design. At beast, 'Web Design' includes a simpl
I did the same (Score:5, Informative)
To manage the projects I use a combination of Quicken and www.tutos.org.
Tutos allow you clients to login and view the progress your are making on their website.
A bonus for us is that we are also a small webhost so we provide the domain, the hosting, and the website all in one package. Most of our clients feel much better knowing they only deal with one team.
Here are some tips:
1) Get incorporated. I can't stress this enough!
2) Get insurance. You like your house right?
3) Give estimates first with a deadline. Without a deadline you will be in maintenance mode forever.
4) If things get too busy, you can always count on me to help you out
www.TTSIweb.com
Good luck!
Frank
Re:I did the same (Score:1)
"Closed because of 'Software-Patents'"
Bummer.
why bother to incorporate? (Score:2)
Re:why bother to incorporate? (Score:1)
Here I can charge my company rent, expense milage, meals and pay myself in dividends which means lower taxes than being self-employed.
Also small corporations ( $200,000 a year) get a lot of tax benefits.
It's easier to apply for corprate loans, grants and raise your hourly rates as a consultant. Corporations can also hire and sub-contract with more ease.
Personally I like the ability to keep all the finances separate. Personally, I am completel
Re:why bother to incorporate? (Score:1)
Re:I did the same (Score:1)
IANAWD, but I am curious what you are in fear of being sued for. If I follow tip #1 (get incorporated) I don't see the reason to get insurance. Maintain the corporate veil and let the devil care if you are sued.
I am also a firm believer that you are more likely to be sued if the other side's lawyers see the potential for a fat insurance payout. Use the corporation to protect your assets.
I would also have to believe that a web designer's name and reputation is
Get good advice, (Score:5, Informative)
Another great resource is SCORE, which is the service corp of retired executives. My Grandfather used to work with them before he got too old. Its a lot of older folks who would love a chance to mentor someone young.
Oh and find a decent accountant.
Re:Get good advice, (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Get good advice, (Score:2)
Re:Get good advice, (Score:2)
Good advice. Also, the start-a-business help provided by the Internal Revenue Service can be a great source of information.
Try this link [irs.gov] and this one [irs.gov] for starters.
Portfolio (Score:4, Insightful)
Others suggested getting a corp right away. I actually would suggest that it's a bit premature at this stage. If you get into stuff with DB backends with client/customer data, then it makes sense. If you are doing puffery advertising type pages for local groups and businesses, hold off on the expense for a little while until you see if it is worth it.
What is preventing you from holding down your regular job as well as your new design jobs? Plenty of people who start new businesses wisely wind up working two full time jobs until the new business can support you. Or, segue into it. You work both, but your wife leaves her regular job to focus full time on the web work.
It's a rough environment to enter feet first these days. Anyone with a cracked copy of FrontPage fancies himself a web designer.
Re:Portfolio (Score:1)
I would aggree with that. Do web design work for awhile and see if your really into it, if you are then incorperate.
The thing about incorpating is that its a hassle. About $2,000 to $5,000 in fees then you have to have to do taxes each year for it too.
Not that much to incorporate for small biz. (Score:2)
Since it's all in the family, you don't need to get a lawyer to teach you about dispute resolution, director selection, etc. Besides, if in the future your company grows, you can rewrite the rules of your company (and pay the associated lawyer fees) l
Re:Portfolio (Score:1)
The other biggest tip I can give is to RIGOUROUSLY schedule every hour of the week. It is unbelievable how much more one can accomplish.
Re:Portfolio (Score:1)
One thing I do everytime... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:One thing I do everytime... (Score:1)
The best way to get business... (Score:3, Insightful)
I've gotten some excellent referals from people and business who have received referals from me in the past, including one relationship that ultimately led to six figures in follow-on contracts.
Outsource your company to India! (Score:3, Funny)
Re:A way to syphon off some of the netbacking cash (Score:1)
Some suggestions. (Score:5, Informative)
However, if you do persist in the notion that web design is a profitable small business, some points to consider.
First, always always always get the requirements in writing and have the customer sign off on them. When the customer changes their mind 75% through the project (which they always will) you can then legitimatly charge them more.
Second, charge what you're worth. Remember when doing charge sheets that unpaid documentation/beancounting will take up 40% or more of your time, have your prices reflect that.
Third, learn php and SQL. Webdev these days is generally not about static pages. If you can design your own implmentations of some of the more common applications, you can roll out projects and get a much higher return on your time. Prefabbed components are worth investing and coding in.
Mock up the entire website in pencil, and when you're showing it to the client, let the client "interact" with the environment.
In essence, don't do web design. It takes too much time, your customers take forever to pay, and it's not worth the aggrivation of keeping up with the various standards.
Re:Some suggestions. (Score:2)
Sad but true. If you really want to do web design (and if you are better than all the other designer wannabees), add other design services to your portfolio: create business cards, restaurant menus, invitations, brochures etc. Anything that relates to a website and should have a similar design.
BTW, as far as I know the payment (for multimedia services) is settled in 3 thirds: 1/3 in advance, 1/3 after the final design has been agreed upon, and the
Re:Some suggestions. (Score:1)
There question is, "Is your approach the same as all the other design companies out there?" If so, that's not much of a business plan. If you really want to do this, because every man and his dog is doing it also, you have to offer far more than there average WD out there.
When clients ask your advice, your knowledge in this area is a major asset, do you have real knowledge in this area? If so, give them real estimates of what sites and strategies really cost, now, in the near future and down the trac
Re:dont. (Score:1, Redundant)
You already have a business (Score:5, Informative)
Get new clients
Sounds to me like you already have a business. I think that the most important thing is getting the word out. Since you already have a client list, you have a great start -- you have people who you have done work for in your community who can help you. I would suggest calling each and every one and letting them know that you are trying to turn this into a full time business. Ask them if they know of anyone who they know might be looking for web design.
Keep your existing clients.
Set up a quick php/mysql database or out look contact list with notes about each or your clients and the last time that they had work done.Set up an email to remind you three months from the last time you spoke to them, and give them a call. Tell them that you are just checking up, and seeing if they needed any updates to the site, etc. Make sure that you keep notes on the conversation that you have, so you can refer to the last conversation: "Oh, I tried that resturant that you reccomended, you were right, we love it." or "So how are those classes going?"
Advertise
It's expensive to get a full page advertisement in the local paper, but it might be worth it. It's not the only way, though: You can drive around and drop off mailers at small businesses, or offer to do a free seminar on how to use the internet to help your small business at the library or chamber of commerce or SBA, etc. It gets your name out and establishes you as a local "expert"
From what I understand, this is a very hard business to be in, with lots and lots of competition. You can do it, but your best product is your customer service and your best friend is word of mouth. Things like birthday cards help you stand out. Try as hard as possible to never to let anyone leave dissapointed with your service, or product: angry people talk a lot more that people who are satisfied, and it doesn't matter if they were wrong when they tell someone you "ripped them off", the person you told isn't going to take the chance.
good luck!host! (Score:5, Informative)
Re:host! (Score:2)
So, if you don't have a cluster of web servers for redundancy, you need to ensure you have a highly redundant and highly recoverable web server, monitoring, someone to answer the monitoring when it detects something
Re:host! (Score:1)
Single point of advice (Score:2)
Never say "no" to business... (Score:2)
Instead, say "yes" with a price that makes it profitable. "Yes" may include the cost to farm it out to someone, too. This assumes you've made careful notes during discovery so you're quoting accurately on the scope of the project. And keep a list of those prospects who say no to your quote! As long as you've dealt with them in a fair and upfront manner, they're still potent
Re:Never say "no" to business... (Score:4, Informative)
I guess this guy never had a problem customer.
My advice?
Say "no" all the time.
Say "no" to people who want big sites for very little money, say no to people who say "I just want this eensy teensy weeensy little site, so I don't think I should pay all that much", say no to people who say "I've noticed that yahoo only charges $20 to make it myself per month, but I'd rather have someone who knows what they're doing manage it, but I'd like to keep the price pretty low."
Notice the pattern here?
You should say no to people who don't want to pay (much) money for their website.
You're not going to make money off of them, not unless you grow to a company making hundreds or thousands of websites a year, which will be a pain and probably require hiring on more people. You will make money by making a few (20-40) good websites and charging them a decent price for them.
Also, if people don't pay much for their website, they don't see it as all that valuable, and they don't put much time and effort into marketing it or involving it in their business. Which car would you willing spend more effort and money maintaining? a '89 Porsche, or an '89 Cavalier?
If they do see their website as valuable, then they see you as someone not valuable, because you're a chump who gives away good things for no cost. People who use their websites a lot will call you all the time, because they'll feel they're more important than you are.
And there are always customers where there is no "yes" price that makes it profitable. Unfortunately, there are crazy people in the world, and some of them somehow manage to run businesses. Even if they offer you what seems a nice tidy sum, run away, because in the end they will suck the life force from you.
Prospects who've said no to a quote generally don't call me back. They usually are shopping on price and aren't interested in the extras that our company offers -- like superior programming and customer service.
The second to last paragraph also is good from a sales standpoint, because people like it when you express genuine interest in what they do in their business -- it makes them feel that they're working with someone who will make a website that works for their business, not just a generic site.
I agree wholeheartedly with the final paragraph; unfortunately there are a lot of people who don't even like itching over the price.
Re:Never say "no" to business... (Score:3, Insightful)
You're dead on about problem clients. Some clients are not worth what you'll put into them, even if they're willing to pay a lot to get it. We've turned down clients (or said "no" to existing clients) for many reasons. Sometimes it's because we know that what they want can't be done in a way that will satisfy them, often because they've indicated that they're not willing to pay a price that makes it a worthwhile business proposition, and sometimes just because we know they'll be hell to work with.
That last
Re:Never say "no" to business... (Score:1, Insightful)
"Mind if we pay you in 90 days?"
"Mind if we give you only half now and half later?"
"We can pay once the site starts making money."
AKA, people that will probably never pay you for your work. As soon as you hear any of these magic words, run for the hills.
Learn (Score:2)
1) Learn everything you can
2) Make no assumptions
3) Stick with a standard
4) Offer alternatives
For 1, people will make weird requests ("You want the frobnitz gonkulator feature?") because they saw a four-colored glossy on it, so it is obviously a good thing. You want to know it at least on the surface so, if necessary, you can give an intelligent answer as to why the frobnitz gonkulator drop-in is a Bad Idea.
One common mistake I see peop
Re:Learn (Score:2)
- CEO, Frobnitz Gonkulator Inc.
Re:Learn (Score:2)
Use Web Standards. (Score:4, Informative)
A basic overview [happycog.com]
Designing With Web Standards [zeldman.com]
one thing to look out for (Score:1)
Learn (Score:1)
1. Read a lot. Find out what is good and bad about the web. Use xhtml and avoid javascript and flash. Don't use frontpage (or dreamweaver)!
2. Be a Pro. Take graphic design (or hire a designer). Make you web pages look professional and user-friendly.
3. Become a web application programmer. Use PHP, sql, ASP, etc... and learn to write dynamic, remotely administered page
Real Advice (Score:1)
Contracts! (Score:1)
I know... (Score:2)
Actual advice? (Score:4, Insightful)
2) If you really feel you must, work out a coherent, intelligent business plan--one you can take to the bank if necessary to borrow money against. That means 1, 2, and 3 year projections, profit and loss statements, capital and other expenses. Be serious about it. Pay yourself a salary. Know precisely what your monthly living expenses are and how much you need to earn toward them.
3) Be sure that business plan includes (a) an exhaustive study of your target market; and (b) some realistic projections about how you're going to reach that market. Your list of contacts may be the best in the world, but you'll starve if you rely on referrals.
4) How/why should people find and pick you rather than one of the bazillion and one other Web designers out there?
5) Where did you attend art/design school? Know anything about color theory? The color wheel? How color is perceived by a human viewing a monitor vs. a human viewing an actual sunset? How about navigation? Typography and typefaces? Accessibility? Web standards? Any background in fine arts? Advertising? Marketing? How about computers themselves? Networks? ISP's, hosts, e-mail? How does a moitor work? How does HTTP (vs HTML) work? Do you have concrete resources for getting to the information you don't know?
Best to know the answers to all this and more. People who pick up a mouse and a copy of Frontpage make truly unfortunate websites.
I'd have to say that if you haven't puzzled your way through all of this and a whole lot more, you're probably getting ready to waste a great deal of time and money.
I've actually had my business for almost three years, and I earn enough money to contribute my half to a two-income household--most months. I didn't thrive until I did my business plan. I know precisely how much work I need to do each month to survive, and I know how much selling and marketing I need to do to gain that work.
I hope this doesn't sound too grouchy. It is realistic.
Anne
Re:Actual advice? (Score:3, Insightful)
I actually find this the most useful piece of advice I've ever had. Every couple of years, I ask this to myself just to make sure that I am on top of my game.
If you can't answer this one to your satisfaction, then your resources would be better off doing something else.
Been there, still there (Score:2)
We did what you're doing. The highs are better than you could imagine, the lows much, much worse. You can avoid a lot of the latter by thinking ahead (which it sounds like you're doing, so you're one up on nearly everyone else).
Any Advice for Starting a Web Design Business? (Score:2)
The Market (Score:4, Insightful)
Find a profitable place to host accounts. Don't try to host them yourself. You'll hate the work. Go somewhere like Hurricane Electric or ValueWeb and let them do the majority of the work while you collect $5/month or less on the accounts. You'll be milking those accounts for several years without touching them.
2. People who have no idea what they want ... (Score:1)
from my own experience... (Score:3, Interesting)
1) Don't
2) Look for clients that got ripped off for a site 5-10 years ago, they paid $50k for some junk, so they think $30k for something good is a bargain.
3) Everyone and their dog can write html, so you need a speciality. Incorportating bits of Flash where it is actually beneficial is my trick, you need to find your trick.
4) People are inclined to buy their headed paper, business cards etc from the same source as they get their website. You can get business put your way (and pass on business for a mark-up) by forming close relationships with local printers/copy shops.
5) See all those people saying Don't? Listen to them!
My $0.02 (Score:1)
If you plan on starting a business, first perfect your skills until you are sure that you can actually COMPETE
Use version control software if you aren't already (Score:3, Informative)
CVS is good and free.. Perforce is a pro tool for a reasonable price.. etc.
You'll thank me later, even though you'll curse me for putting you through the initial learning curve. You'll be able to track who did what, where, when, and (hopefully) why. You'll be able to roll-back changes you made simply by clicking a button and typing in a date. You'll be able to make incremental changes to a live website without bringing everything online all at once (and watching everything break.)
Plus you'll be able to prove you did the work, when you did the work, and how much work you did in all its gory detail.
Trust me, if you ignore all the other crappy advice in this thread, don't ignore your versioning.