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Graphics Media Music Software

Hiring Artists for Open Source Projects? 73

Posted by Cliff from the sights-and-sounds dept.
MikeFM asks: "What is the best way for an Open Source developer to hire artists to provide graphics, music, and other artwork for Open Source projects? I need to hire such people and I'm not sure where to go or how best to spell out the terms of the contract so that it's okay to release the works for hire as Open Source. I'm willing to pay but can't afford to pay a lot. It seems to me that providing artwork for an Open Source project sounds like great exposure to art students and artists still early in their career but how do I find these people? I've posted ads in the local schools and art stores.. what else can I do?"
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Hiring Artists for Open Source Projects? More

Hiring Artists for Open Source Projects?

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  • i love art (Score:2, Informative)

    by alexdm ( 728255 )
    working with graphics etc.

    Though all I have taken was the first CG class, and the rest after was self taught. Since it was just a hobby, and not somthing I wanted a career in.

    If your work isn't too intricate beyond my skills, I will be glad to help out.

    email: codedemon @ gmail . com
    • Me too.

      Been tooling around in PS for about 5 years now, and I would love be involved in helping create software, especially since I've seen far too many good programs that look like refried crap.

      Aside from the exposure (minute as it may be), the challenge of doing something new would be fantastic. Let me know if there's any way I could help.

      • Re:i love art (Score:3, Informative)

        by UPi ( 137083 )
        There is a sort of "talent pool" at sourceforge.net called "Project Help Wanted". It's mostly for developers, but there's also a section for graphics artists/designers. If you are an artist and would like to help out a project, why not try and see if there is one that could use your talent.

        I have tried it before (I'm working on a game called OpenMortal)... got zero response. Maybe others have been luckier.

  • Well.. (Score:4, Funny)

    by standsolid ( 619377 ) <kenny@nOspaM.standsolid.com> on Tuesday June 22, 2004 @08:34PM (#9501740) Homepage
    You could post on a site that gets a lot of geek exposure.

    hey, how about slashdot [stalshdot.org]?
    • Well part of the idea of posting on Slashdot was to see if any users were, or knew, artists that might want to make a few bucks.

      Exposure isn't yet what I'm really working on though. My one program I most need artists for was actually in the July issue of Linux Journal Magazine. Sadly I had no advance warning and my own website has been down due to dns problems I'm trying to get worked out. Darn, talk about bad timing! I hope when I get a 1.x version they'll give me another print up. :)
  • I have a friend who could do some good design work for you. If you like, I can put you in touch with her. Go to my website at zesty.ca and scroll down to see my e-mail address.

  • Student artists... (Score:5, Informative)

    by howman ( 170527 ) on Tuesday June 22, 2004 @08:38PM (#9501780)
    Hit the art colleges during open houses or design shows... take a look around and talk to the students... Don't count on anyone calling you from any adds you take out. Artists and designers want to know what is in it for them... The best thing to do as far as the contract is concerned is to offer to pay them, you retain rights to use and distribute anything they 'sell' to you, but they retain rights to use the 'work' they produce in their portfolio... you can also pro-offer to supply them with a free finished product, as well as liner or some form of hard copy with their name on it. Things like that go a long way to getting designers or artists to hand over work. As long as their 'signature' ends up somewhere in the finished product hard coded (read printed in a booklet somewhere), they are usually happy.
    As for artistic freedom, that is a whole different kettle of fish... Try to let them do what they do best and stay out of their way only offering direction. Try to arrange work previews during the buildup and don't hit them with 'buts' use 'ands' to direct their work. You will find that you get much better end results that way
    Best of luck.

  • Open Source Artworks (Score:5, Informative)

    by _aa_ ( 63092 ) <j.uaau@ws> on Tuesday June 22, 2004 @08:48PM (#9501880) Homepage Journal
    You can start by browsing already "open sourced" works at opart.org [opart.org] and opsound.org [opsound.org]. If you cannot find anything pre-existing to fit your needs, you will at least find a community of artisans who embrace open source principles. You'll also want to consult creative commons [creativecommons.org] for the various free asin speech liscenses for the various mediums of art you'll be using.

    I think you'll find that most open source artists, as with most open source developers are not seeking to be financially compensated directly, though are open for donations.

    I myself am an "open source" musician and have contributed music to a few open source projects: SonarBuoyix [opart.org] and Tong [nongnu.org].
  • They're full of artists, waiting on tables. No, wait, those are actors.

  • Some tips (Score:4, Informative)

    by Cthefuture ( 665326 ) on Tuesday June 22, 2004 @09:19PM (#9502095)
    Post want-ads on graphics Internet boards. Search the web to find graphics boards. Here are a few to get you started:

    CGTalk [cgtalk.com]
    Polycount [gamespy.com]

    And there are many others out there. Many have help-wanted boards.

    Just use a standard work-for-hire type contract. That is, you will own the copyright. Then you can do whatever you want with it (like release under an open-source license). This is just standard practice for contract work of any type. There are lots of contract templates on the web and just about all of them assign copyright of created works to the person/company paying for it.

  • Hiring involves Money (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Stone Rhino ( 532581 ) <mparke@gm a i l.com> on Tuesday June 22, 2004 @09:24PM (#9502127) Homepage Journal
    Even the starving artist needs food and money for said food sometime. If your artist is going to be producing "Works for hire," it doesn't matter if it's an opensource project or not--the copyright law is the same. If you're asking for people to chip in labor for free, then they will still own the copyright on their own work and have to be willing to hand it over to your project.

    There are plenty of people here offering suggestions on where to find free labor, but if you actually hire someone, then you can do whatever the hell you want with the work they've done--opensource it, burn it, throw it to the dogs--it's no different from source code.

    • The poster is right. To assign copyright, "due consideration" would need to be exchanged. That means money. Otherwise, the courts could say that the person had no real incentive to assign their copyright to the company/organization. The due consideration should also be at market rates, although the courts would consider the market value of work produced by entry-level student artists.
      • Actually it probably doesn't have to be at "market rates" whatever they are. In a contract, all that you have to show is that consideration was given. It could be a penny, or just the promise to release it as part of an open source project that the artist could use as well. ANY consideration, monetary or otherwise, would make it a valid contract and assignment of copyright.
    • I have every intention of paying with real cash. The couple possible artists I've talked to so far I would pay for their work if they were interested. If someone just offered to donate their work to the project I'd probably accept but I'd still look for someone to hire also. In this case there is really no end to the art I can use so it's my intention to keep buying it until I have enough to, with the rest of my program, fill a CD. Then I'd like to sell the program on CD for like $5 for people that don't wa
    • This isn't necessarily true. Many times you'll have a contract that stipulates limited uses and the artist will retain the copyright. The only time I actually transfer copyrights is in the case of logos because the client obvously would need to use it for many things and they wouldn't want to pay a royality everytime they print up something new. Be sure that any contract specifically states that you get the copyright for the work or you may end up on the losing end of a lawsuit.
  • just remember that artists have a very different mindset than coders, and will be far less open to opensource (at least in my experience as a professional code monkey at a small game developer).
    Of course, you could pay for their art, agree to royalties, and then just change it 20 percent (by putting a filter or bilinear mask of sorts on it) and skrew them outta the royalties like an evil company that shall remain nameless that i know of does (or did in the past).
    • I actually called up the Intellectual Property Office once and they told me that there is no 20 percent rule [about.com]. It's a myth. The IP people consider a multitude of factors -- although it *is* possible to change an image enough to have it qualify as a new image. Part of the test involves determining whether the image appears to be based on the original.
      • That's good to know. I'll save that for next time company X get's me pissed off at what a monkeyf*** sorry excuse for a gamedevelopment house it is.

        Of course, that's wandering a bit off topic, so for some on topic...

        I have a lot of respect for artists, and wish game development management shared that feeling. I really hate how most places treat them as expendible. Dozens of artists have come and gone from my shop and only one programmer has ever been fired (after he failed to turn a profit for the full y

  • Hey, over here! (Score:3, Informative)

    by FueledByRamen ( 581784 ) <sabretooth@gmail.com> on Tuesday June 22, 2004 @09:49PM (#9502323)
    If you need 3d characters or assets (including texture/bump maps and such), I can do just about any modelling/rigging/animation in any format that Maya can export (or for which specs can be provided, so I can write a translator). And seeing as how I'm a student currently on summer break, I have plenty of spare time and don't expect to be paid much, if anything.

    Interested? Shoot me an email: sabretooth@gmail.com
  • I know a few hungry artists and musicians.
  • Surf the net for indie game houses. A lot of them post 'how to be an indie developer' pages, and a lot of indie developers outsource their art and sound development to russia, romania, india, pakistan, vietnam, guatemala, etc.

    Post a project on rentacoder [rentacoder.com] or guru [guru.com] and the 'low end' artists from those countries will come to you to bid on your project in droves. Pennies on the dollar, my friend.

  • Music (Score:3, Informative)

    by littlerubberfeet ( 453565 ) on Tuesday June 22, 2004 @10:38PM (#9502641)
    I compose music for TV shows for a living. I can afford to work for free or very little on a limited amount of projects. email me at:

    littlerubberfeet (at) yahoo (d0t) com

    Otherwise, read the above post about getting students and student artists to pitch in.

    In any case, good luck!
  • But I'm a newcomer to the design thing (mostly web stuff) and wouldn't mind doing some work on the cheap.

    e-mail me at the address above.

    _g
  • I would begin by realizing that what you're describing is probably not a work for hire, and thus would result in your being fucked.

    17 USC 101 defines a work made for hire, and it is very strict. As a rule of thumb, you should not assume works are works made for hire unless the person making them is your employee, not a contractor, and the works are being made in the scope of the employment. Typically, someone is your employee if they're working for you permanently, you withhold their taxes, and so forth. C

  • You need to publicise your project. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by isolationism ( 782170 ) on Tuesday June 22, 2004 @10:58PM (#9502766) Homepage
    Well, Slashdot is a good first start, but I didn't see the project actually mentioned in the article.

    I'm part designer, part 3D artist by day, and at night (when I have any energy left) I "just draw" on the old Wacom tablet, usually.

    What grabs me? Well, money is nice but frankly, I don't need it. What I'd like to contribute to is a project I see value in. Something that will let me learn the ropes of what it's like to work with other people through the OSS model, because I never have before; I've only ever been a corporate monkey where the dynamics are presumably quite different.

    That said, there aren't many projects that have grabbed me by the collar and said, "WE NEED YOU TO HELP US MAKE IT LOOK GOOD." The only apps that I've ever considered helping out with were Inkscape [sourceforge.net] which shows a lot of promise for a vector graphics drawing package -- but isn't looking for designers as their road map is mostly replete with "stuff needs to be reprogrammed"; and Freevo [sourceforge.net], which blatently advertises that they're looking for (skin) designers. I think I'll be helping design a few skins for Freevo, because they look like they really want it, and I love the package and want to give something back to that community.

    Since your project isn't done yet, selling on the basis of "giving back" because people like your project is pretty unlikely. That doesn't mean you might not gain a little interest by publicising what it's all about, though. Worst-case scenario, it's really dull and the requests are few -- at least the people that do volunteer will be in for the long haul, whereas signing up sight-unseen might result in a few people abandoning ship early on.

    • I didn't mention a specific project because my DNS is messed up for a few days and thus nobody can go to my website right now. Here is the Freshmeat link [freshmeat.net] though. This project is a coloring book and I'd like to make it a decent little edutainment program. I have other projects I'd like to hire artists for too if the process goes smooth for this project. I'm largely interested in edutainment so most of my games are oriented towards that.

      I'm perfectly okay with paying artists for their work. If anyone wants t
    • Well hell, since you're offering, you can do 3D for my project! It's not even started yet, but on the plus side it'll only take 36 hours to complete! You can find it here [rdc36.com]. Shameless plugs are so rarely requested like this... must be my lucky day!

  • Easy (Score:2, Funny)

    by minusthink ( 218231 )
    1. Find which edge of earth artwiz fell off.
    2. Make him do it.

  • I'm working on a coding project I needed a cheap or free logo for, and I had a friend who was (really) desparate for a new computer. He had GIMP skills and I had a stripped down eMachines box to get arid of. Worked out great.

  • The shortcut: (Score:2, Flamebait)

    by sakusha ( 441986 )
    Just submit your job offers directly to this website. [fuckthatjob.com] You'll save them the trouble of tracking down your job offer and subjecting it to humiliating attention. Be sure to come visit the chat boards so we can abuse you personally, ya cheap bastard.

    Your request is similar to what I see over and over on FTJ. For some reason people think that students or unemployed artists and designers feel like giving away their labor for nothing. For example, someone found a job offer up on Craig's List seeking a candidate w
    • So if you're to good to work for $8/hr then go back to working at Burger King for $5/hr. ;)

      Besides I didn't say I wasn't going to pay the going rate. I've always been fair when hiring contractors for projects in the past. If that means I pay $20/hr instead of $200/hr and that isn't good enough for you then simply don't apply. I would have been very happy to be making $20/hr to practice my skills when I was in school.

      • Re:The shortcut: (Score:4, Insightful)

        by sakusha ( 441986 ) on Wednesday June 23, 2004 @03:13AM (#9504173)
        Yeah, this is exactly the response they always get from employers who discover their job offer is listed on FTJ. Usually it's some asshole offers minimum wage for a job involving design, programming, and sys engineering, and when called out on it, they ALWAYS reply "I've already got a whole bunch of people who applied and are happy to find work at $5.15/hr with no benefits. If that's too low for you then there's always someone who will do the work for the price I want to pay."

        What you are failing to realize is that anyone who can do your art and design work does not need to practice, they already have the skills. Your offer is known in the business press as "the race to the bottom" or "walmartization," you're trying to convince people that their work is worth less because there's always some guy who will do it cheaper. So go find them. Hint: try free clip art.
        • Dude, I think you need to go get a job and a girlfriend and chill out. I realize you were abducted by aliens and forced to work at minimum wage while undergoing an anal probe but jeez you are off your rocker. ;)

          • Re:The shortcut: (Score:4, Interesting)

            by sakusha ( 441986 ) on Wednesday June 23, 2004 @09:19AM (#9506101)
            Your attempt to deflect blame for your ridiculous offer isn't going to work. I am the only person in this whole discussion who has actually done work as you have described. Let me tell you how this works.

            After working in graphics production for many years in LA, I went back to my old university to finish my art degree. I was disgusted at my old employer because they were charging $80/hour for my work but paying me about $10 (this was in the late 1980s), I figured I'd earn more if I finished my BFA.
            So one day in the Art building I notice a flyer on the bulletin board. Some guy in the Theater department is doing a multimedia MFA thesis on CDROM, he wants someone to do the interface design and graphics to wrap around his videos and text. It was a groundbreaking project, nobody had ever done a thesis on CDROM before. So I decided, what the fuck, I need to keep up my skills, I'll help the guy out for free. Total time about 10 hours, it would have cost him a thou if he'd contracted with my old studio, but he got it for nothing, all I got was a credit.
            So about a year later, I'm reading the newspaper about how a local theater student won a national award for his innovative interface design on his multimedia MFA thesis. Bastard didn't even acknowledge that I did the work, he took all the credit for himself.
            Meanwhile, I'm trying to pitch my real artwork to the local galleries. I work in an antique photo process, I'm one of only about 3 people in the world who work in this particular process, it can take me a week to make a color print, it's very labor intensive, and the materials cost hundreds of bucks. I showed them one of my best prints, it cost me about $150 in materials alone to make. The gallery loves the work and wants to sell it, but they want to sell it for $200 and take a 55% cut, which would mean I'd lose money selling the prints. I inform them that prints of this type usually sell for about $2000 and tell them to take a hike.

            It is obvious you really do not understand how artists work. They're always getting offers to do work for nothing. They're always doing hugely expensive projects of their own, they'd rather be doing their personal artwork at their own expense than doing someone else's drudgework at their own expense.
            • Plagarism in academic work is taken very seriously - a threat of writing to the theater guys' supervisors would probably have got you a credit quick enough. Presumably you have enough sketches etc to prove you designed the interface?

              Ever considered getting a new job? Of course a customer doesn't care how much something costs to make - it's the value to them that's important, not what it cost you. If somebody is prepared to pay $200 for something, then it's worth $200. The amount it costs to make is irrelev

              • Re:The shortcut: (Score:3, Interesting)

                by sakusha ( 441986 )
                Well, my name was in the credits, but it only appeared when you exit the multimedia project. Of course I have copies of all the original files. But the point was moot, the guy got his MFA degree and moved on before the award was given. I could presumably put this work in my portfolio and legitimately claim I did award-winning work, but I'd probably feel like I was just as dishonest as the guy who claimed the award for my work.

                You missed the point of the story of the gallery offering to sell the $2000 photo
                • Just because he got his degree and moved on does not mean he can keep it after committing fraud. If what you say is true, and you have evidence, you have a case.

                  Check out: DISGRACED PHYSICIST STRIPPED OF PH.D. DEGREE [acs.org]
                • You think there hasn't been a flood of people in the software development market that drove the prices down? That happens in every market. The point is to realize that if your competition can sell what is good enough for lower than you can sell your high quality work then you'll have to match their rates unless you can find enough people looking for high quality work. That's just the way life is. It sucks but what can you do? Either live with it or simply learn to find those high paying jobs that demand qua
            • If you think you're the only one that got ripped off from doing free or low cost work then you're obviously blind. I doubt many of us on here haven't had stuff like that happen. That's no reason to be an ass and assume everyone is out to get you. A good many of us does contract work and yes sometimes we don't get paid and yes sometimes we don't get credit where it's due. It sucks monkey balls. That doesn't mean you should go live in a closet and never work again. Not even if it's a really nice walk in close

    • I disagree (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Tom7 ( 102298 ) on Wednesday June 23, 2004 @08:33AM (#9505639) Homepage Journal
      I beg to differ. You could level the same argument against computer programmers, yet there is a huge amount of free labor to be found from hobbyist programmers, even ones who are professionals and have loads of experience. Many people just like to be involved in fun projects, and some people feel a strong social commitment to "open source" or "free software" or even "free art."

      Personally (as artist and programmer!) I prefer to work on my own projects, but if the project were cool enough, I wouldn't feel cheated to work on it for no pay.
  • ... check out one of the numerous 'musician' forums that are out there... for example AMPFEA.ORG [ampfea.org] ... download some stuff, find the style you like, and contact the artists you prefer.

    There are thousands, and thousands of artists/musicians out on the 'net who would love to work on an Open Source-style project that can be used to promote their works. You don't need to hire them, necessarily, though you can of course. But most would love to do it just for the 'excercising of chops' such a project would provi
  • Why do programmers work on OS projects?

    • It's an intereseting project
    • It's a program we need for our own work
    • It's a great way to show our work and skills to the world
    • Programming is our hobby. It's fun, exciting and really wild stuff


    These could apply to artists too...
  • You could always put a job up for auction at sites like Freelance Auction [freelanceauction.com] or Rent A Coder [rentacoder.com]. You put a cap on how much you're willing to pay for your graphics, and let bidders compete for the job.
  • Deviant Art is a great website and resource for digital art. There are many gifted artist there that have the digital artist's equivalent of an open source community. They share their work and post tutorials. There are many people there that are willing to work for close to nothing just to help a good cause and to get more for their portfolio. Give it a look - Deviant Art [deviantart.com]

  • OLA - Open License Art (Score:2, Insightful)

    by wcb4 ( 75520 )
    Perhaps some well meaning geek on slashdot could develop a site where people looking for artistic talent could list what exactly they were looking for (CG folks, musicians, etc), what kind of project (game or app), what type of compensation they can offer (fame?, or a few sheckles) and some details about what they envision, and "artists" who have registered with the site can just click a link and their details are emailed to the contact for the project, or even better, artists who register could receive aut
  • What, you too are behind some corporate non-disclosure agreement? Although if you're working on OSS it shouldn't be the case...

    Don't you think that one step towards getting some people that would want to participate in whatever you're working on would be to tell them WHAT it is?
  • Or, you could do what we do at spamgourmet [spamgourmet.com] -- that is, go ahead and put up artwork that the developers did. It looks so bad that the artists will volunteer to rework it all (we're currently undergoing a rework now :)).

    The new site will definitetly have links to the artist's site, so there's some no-cost promotion involved.

    So...
    1) get out the crayons and the scanner
    2) slap something up
    3) sit back and wait, countering frequent expressions of ridicule with offers to volunteer
    4) art!
  • how con no-one have mentioned deviantart.com? definitely the biggest collection of indie artists ive ever seen. There is a hugh amount of amazing talent on that site that posts their work on deviant art for free, im sure that someone of its 6 million art pieces (while a fair bit of it is crap, at least the top third of it is jaw droppingly good) would help out either gratis or for a small fee.
  • So, let me see if I can rephrase your request:

    Would you please develop some art work for me? Of course, i can't pay you very much. But! It would really help me out and my project is so cool that it will give you exposure to people that may just be willing to pay you more than me. Oh yea, I'll be sure to be dilligent about promoting you at least as much as I'm promoting my own spiffy project (for which I need your help). So, will you spend some of your time to help me?
  • You might try Craigslist [craigslist.org], especially if there is one in your area. I see all kinds of interesting jobs on there. Just today, I saw an ad for oil-wrestling girls for a trailer-trash themed party.

    There's more serious stuff there too.
  • If you pay the artists the normal rates, you should have full rights over the work they produce for you. AFAIKv there's no source in art, just 'the work'.
  • I'm not sure it'll help too much, but you might consider this: instead of just posting ads at local schools, find out if the schools have Placement offices, and go talk to whoever works there. A lot of colleges have some sort of office dedicated to helping students find internships, after-school and summer work, and find a real job after graduating. You may be able to get someone to do some of the leg-work in finding employees that way.
  • The problem is that Slashdot-frequenting code-heads believe in open source--which is a very new idea. Visual artists and musicians do not believe in open source. Visual artists and musicians are trained, and taught by experience, that making art and music for free is very bad business. This is because it's extraordinarily difficult for visual artists and musicians to make money from their hard-won talents in any event. They want to make dollars from their art, not from the day job delivering pizza that the

  • Check out worth1000.com [worth1000.com]

    This type of thing has been done there before, for other types of projects that can't pay, can't pay much, or can pay oodles.

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