Getting an IT Job in Europe as an American 187
IvanHo asks: "I'm looking for success stories, hints, tips and tricks from any Slashdot readers with U.S. citizenship that have managed to find gainful employment in Europe. For various reasons, my wife and I would like to spend a couple years working in Europe -- preferably Southern Europe. For the last couple months, I have been applying for IT positions there with no luck. Although, my wife grew up in Rome and her family is there now, she is a U.S. citizen, so that well trodden route to a work permit is unavailable. Any advice? I'm trying to avoid incorporating and transferring myself if possible."
"My resume is fairly strong and I've had a couple companies express interest until they realized that I would require sponsorship to work in the EU. Given the number of H1 folks I work with day in and day out, I'm starting to wonder if it isn't harder to get a visa to work in Europe than it is here. I've noticed that even American companies are posting prior right to work in a country as a prerequisite for employment. Language is a possible problem, but I do know a couple European languages beyond English -- Portuguese and French."
take advantage of EU (Score:1, Interesting)
EU residents, please feel free to call shenanigans here and tell me the real deal.
try like hell to get hired by a US company (Score:5, Interesting)
1. The pay will be higher, the taxes lower. (Though your Italian counterparts will get 6 weeks vacation to your measly 2-3
2. Less paperwork and other hoops to jump through. Many EU countries can't hire an international unless they have exhausted all local options. I love Italy, but the paperwork, bureaucracy, and laissez faire attitude of governmental agencies will put you in gulag even if you speak perfect Italian. Even then, your prospective employer will probably need to be DESPERATE to hire you to advocate on your behalf.
3. They may be more willing to overlook your language difficulties (not that you said you had any, but if so, they may view your technical skills as more important criteria than your italian skills.)
I've noticed a number of firms in the Netherlands, for example, have many internationals working in the office, so for simplicity, they just speak english at work. But then again, the dutch on average speak 3+ languages better than the average American speaks english, but that's another story. It's not so in Italy. MANY people speak Italian only and maybe they can communicate in a similar Romance language (Spanish, French). I've noticed younger people speak more english, as do women (something about them doing a bit better in school than men
I would also check out UK employment sites, they sometime serve as a gateway for English speakers looking for IT work in the EU. Most of the employment agencies will have more staffing in their UK offices, and probably have divisions within them for various EU countries.
Employment Agency is your best bet (Score:4, Interesting)
I wanted to move to the UK and did my research on the internet, found some openings. But no one wanted to speak to me from half of the world away.
I figured what the heck and decided to go there for a visit. I got a visitor's visa and flew there. Spend a month just travelling and getting used to the country. Then I went in search of a job. It took me about 3 months. Eventually I found 2 agencies that specializes in my field of work. Got 2 interviews which resulted in a pretty good offer. I accepted.
The company sponsored me for a work visa. They had to prove that they couldn't find a UK citizen, nor an EU person to fill the position. That didn't take any time at all since they did have a job posting in the trade paper for a couple weeks.
The company filed the paperwork and I got a visa and started to work in a week.
So, as I was saying. The important thing is to get the job and agencies are very useful for that. There are a lot more agencies in UK than here and they seemed to be very specialized. The tough part was finding the right agency actually. I spent a lot of time in internet cafes and going through a lot of newspaper and phonebooks trying to find one in my field.
I would say work visa isn't nearly as hard to get in UK as it is in US.
I hope my experience is of use to you in Southern Europe. I should point out that the British sometimes don't consider themselves as Europeans. Still I would think the rules are similar.
Good luck! and enjoy the slow pace and long vacations you get there!
Re:I did this, but not in Europe. (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:Europe is not a country (Score:3, Interesting)
The rampant anti-Americanism in Europe at the moment might be a problem too.
I don't know about other European countries, but in my experience at least in Germany, even if there currently are lots of reservations towards the US as a nation, these usually don't extent to USians as people.
If you do not try to force certain US mindsets down people's throats you will usually be treated friendly. Several of my friends work sometimes very closely with Americans and they are usually well liked (the Americans). What can happen is that people want to discuss with you US foreign policies, but normally this also happens in a non-aggressive manner as long as both sides are not completely drunk.
Another advantage in Germany is that at least in the bigger cities and in larger companies people speak reasonably well English, at least in contrast to most South European countries and France.
Re:take advantage of EU (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Been There, Done That (Score:3, Interesting)
I moved to Saint Petersburg, Russia from Santa Barbara, CA two years ago.
I get all kinds of different reactions from the locals here. I've had people throw beer bottles at me on the street. I've had people hear me speaking english and just want to meet me. I would say the reactions are more favorable than non so it's not too bad.
Keep in mind you'll miss some stuff when going overseas, food in particular. God, I miss Ranch dressing, peanut butter, good barbecue sauce, good sushi. However, some thing make up for it, like unlimited cheap pirated software (sold on every street corner), 25 cent bottles of beer, 70 cent packs of Marlboros and beautiful THIN women.
Here's a little bit more of my story if you're interested.
I started a business with a few Russian guys. Basically, we setup a fiber internet connection in a large apartment building. From there, we run our own fiber to the neighboring apartment buildings and run twisted pair to everyone's apartment who wants service.
I set up a custom linux firewall that also does billing and traffic accounting. Currently, we have 200+ customers and we're just getting started. The only thing holding us back is funding; for now we're just sinking all of our profits back into the company.
Broadband is either incredibly hard to find here in the city suburbs or extremely expensive.
We're the only game in town and there is no end in sight for our growth.
Our website [winlink.ru]
To those of you thinking about moving overseas to work, I suggest you grab a round trip airfare and a backpack and fully investigate before making any commitments (plus, you'll have a great time).
Re:Europe is not a country (Score:4, Interesting)
I'm not being sarcastic -- it's a serious question. Many countries love Americans as much for what they're willing to spend as they do for their attitudes. I've known Americans who have gone abroad and bought things for a tenth to half the price they might pay inside the US, and know they paid too much as far as the locals were concerned, but they don't mind because they still got a deal compared to normal prices and the merchant was happy to make some extra money.
Re:Welcome to... (Score:3, Interesting)
You, as an American, Canadian, Australian, Japanese or whatever... are the equivalent of migrant worker here to pick tomatoes, even if you have a degree, even if you have no intention of being a burden on the social system. Of course, the US is really lame too. A friend's brother was supposed to go work for nVidia, who wanted to hire him and pay him a lot of money, but since he had no degree yet, nothing doing, it was not possible.
Your best bet is to come spend some time and see if you can find a job, because no one is going to hire you from afar. Then you will have to go back to the US and wait months for your permit.
In reality, where does this leave you? You need to just live here illegally and be done with it. Italy has so many laws on the books that no one really pays attention to them anymore. Heck, the prime minister is on trial for bribing judges and people still vote for him.
The big, big *however* is that you wouldn't get so bitter if it were not such a wonderful place. In some ways it's so much nicer than in the US. I went out for a drink with my friends this evening. No being carded (how stupid is that - you have to be 21 to drink a glass of alcohol, even though you can go to iraq and drive a tank at 18?!), not having any problems being in the piazza with a glass of alcohol. And there is a stunning variety - we went up to Bolzano for their 'Linux Day' last weekend, up in the middle of the stunningly beautiful dolomites. Then you have Rome, Florence, Venice (I live a half hour from Venice), and so many beautiful small towns that are what I really prefer to the large tourist centers.
Anyway... I don't know. Spain is doing better than Italy right now. Its politicians are more credible, and seem serious about fixing problems rather than just bickering. The food isn't as good as in Italy, but it's still a beautiful country as well, and who knows, maybe they treat foreigners less like dirt - "curious.com" is right that even renting an appartment will be difficult. Many people don't want to rent to a 'suspicious' foreigner, or really even people from another region of Italy.
On the other hand, I wouldn't complain if I didn't love it, I would just leave. But my life is here, including my fiancee`...
I'm in Spain Now (Score:4, Interesting)
Also, forget about trying to get a job here without being here. It's one of those things that is technically possible, but you're talking close to lottery odds. Either you find a way to get here and get here legally, or forget it. Sorry man, I'm here now, and it's not easy. However, I wanted it enough that I am here. If you want it, make it happen. That said, in Spain, go to Barcelona if you want to work. Madrid is an awesome city, but Barcelona seems more serious about everything and the economy seems better. Just an observation since I've only lived in Madrid.
I won't speak for the rest of Europe, but Spain is tough going. Remember, unemployment here is extensive and there are lots of Europeans competing with you for those jobs. Leverage the English angle, as much as Americans are being told that the entire world loathes them (it doesn't) everyone here wants to speak English and every employer wants fluent English employees. Also, if you don't speak Spanish well, right there, 80% of your employability vanishes.
Just laying it out for you. Hope this helps.
Re:Nope that is the problem (Score:3, Interesting)
According to The Economist this could change soon: and to the US's detriment.
In short, because the dollar is used as the reserve currency by a lot of countries the US is effectively in the position to be able to write cheques that are accepted for payment but are never cashed. However US policy (borrow, borrow, borrow and devlue the dollar so you owe less) means that this is likely to change soon. After all: would you accept a cheque today that know will be worth 30% less tomorrow? In fact its already happening: the Euro and Yen are both attracting people whom 5 years ago would have gone for the dollar. Once it starts in earnest the dollar will collapse practically overnight: there's over ELEVEN TRILLION dollars in uncashed cheques out there...