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Media (Apple) Media Music Software Technology Hardware

New Technology for the Blind? 213

Recently, quite a few questions surrounding technology for the visually impared have dropped into the Ask Slashdot in-box and I'd like to take the time to share these questions with you. Please read on for more.

Gaming Accessibility Recommendations?

openSoar asks: "I work for a company that makes and runs a virtual online world called SecondLife. One of the most inspirational stories I've heard recently has been about a group of people with extreme physical challenges and limitations who are using our software to great effect including (to quote from the original forum post) - 'the chance to be on an equal playing field for once, to not have to have folks get past what they look or sound like... to be warmly received... to play and have fun the way their peers do.' - I want to make things even better and provide a broad range of accessibility features and options. Time constraints mean I can't tackle everything so I'm trying to hit the really useful ones first. Of course, we're going to ask the users what they think but I figured that the folk here would also have some great ideas and suggestions."

Blind Friendly Open Source Software?

scubacuda asks: "A friend of mine is blind, yet he effortlessly navigates through his Windows XP box (installing programs, buying stuff on eBay, reading web-pages, etc) using JAWS. When I asked him what open source resources were available for him, I was surprised to hear him say, 'Almost nothing.' Is this true? Are we just not looking at the right places, or do blind-friendly resources tend to be Microsoft-centric? I tried to get him to switch over to Firefox, but he says that it doesn't work as well with JAWS as IE does."

MP3 Players for the Visually Impaired?

holden caufield asks: "As the geek-in-residence for my circle of friends, I've been asked the 'Which MP3 player should I buy?' question repeatedly, and I'm yet to offer an answer to them that doesn't rhyme with 'iPod'. Now I've been asked this very same question from a good friend who is blind (only *very* limited vision in one eye), and I'm thinking the iPod is still the way to go? Can anyone tell me their visually impaired experiences with MP3 players? Keep in mind, I don't mean 'can you now use it without looking at it?', since the learning curve would have been flattened for you by being able to study it originally. Any suggestions? A few reasons why I think the iPod will work for him:
  • Simple user interface
  • Cursor changes can be heard with (or without) headphones on
  • Bright back-lighting may be helpful for him.
And now the constraints on the software side:
  • He uses a screen reader (JAWS for Windows), so compatibility with that is possibly more important than nearly any other feature.
  • He is looking for an MP3 player. Ogg and FLAC compatibility is not a consideration, and will not weigh in favor of any device.
  • Sorry, but switching to Linux is not an option, however open-source that is Win32-compatible is fine."
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

New Technology for the Blind?

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  • by davidwr ( 791652 ) on Monday December 20, 2004 @05:55PM (#11140957) Homepage Journal
    The original MacIntalk arrived in 1984, and was probably talking in the lab in 1983. There was even a developer's kit of sorts available. If I recall, it could speak English and Spanish directly and had a phonetic mode also.

    A historical note:
    I wasn't here, but I heard that the first Mac did, or was supposed to, introduce itself using MacIntalk. If true, in 1984 this would've had a lot of *ooh* *ahh* potential.
  • iPod?! (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Chriscypher ( 409959 ) <<slashdot> <at> <metamedia.us>> on Monday December 20, 2004 @05:59PM (#11141002) Homepage
    I can see.
    Using the iPod in the car is *infruriating*, because with a WHEEL it is difficult to select one of 311 artists, or one of 520 albums.
    Spin-spin-spin...backspin, backspin, click click click.
    It is *difficult* to *impossible* to select an album, artist or song when confronted with 35GB of music.

    Wheel-selection is only somewhat practical to select a playlist (since I only have 2 dozen or so). A wheel interface is impractical unless you can constantly look at it / see it, and you have a limited number of items to select from.

    The iPod interface is *overrated*.
  • by davidwr ( 791652 ) on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:06PM (#11141067) Homepage Journal
    Here's a Technote from 1990:
    Macintalk, the Final Chapter [apple.com] You can find some more tidbits on google's groups, search for Macintalk with a date filter of 1990.
  • Re:OS X works for me (Score:5, Interesting)

    by BWJones ( 18351 ) * on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:06PM (#11141076) Homepage Journal
    I work in vision research. While we are making advancements in vision rescue and understanding of processes that occur in retinal degenerations, we are some years off from a true rescue. Therefore, technologies such as the ones offered through OS X are going to be significant to our patients who are currently having to deal with vision loss.

    Of course Apple was having to work on their accessibility issues for federal approval, but not only are they are going far beyond the absolute base requirements, they have made the same OS a productive work environment for scientific research as well. Therefore, I am more than happy to try and integrate OS X into patient education and use as well as in my basic science research in the lab.

    P.S. There is a movement within the National Library for the Blind to replace all of their "books on tape" with a digital format compatible with .mp3 and the iPod would be absolutely ideal here as well with just a little software engineering.

  • by mattrwilliams ( 534984 ) <mattrwilliams@gmai[ ]om ['l.c' in gap]> on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:08PM (#11141090)
    There is a standardized format for talking books on CD called DAISY [daisy.org]. My mother is blind and I put together a PERL script that takes a DAISY cd, extracts the title/author/chapter information from the DAISY index file and then embeds that as MP3 tags at the end of the MP3s. I then load that onto an iPod so that she can carry around 10-20 books with her without having to carry the fairly large DAISY reader. Huge benefits of the iPod (3rd gen, not 4th): - audible feedback when you push a button or use the scroll wheel (clicks) - customization of main menu to remove irrelevant entries and can put browse by album (book title) at top of menu - separate tactile buttons for play/pause and skip track (chapter). with the 4th gen iPod, these buttons were integrated into the scroll wheel like the iPod mini - much harder to use - large storage capacity - each book is on average 500 MB
  • Re:POPFile (Score:3, Interesting)

    by zoeblade ( 600058 ) on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:10PM (#11141112) Homepage

    "If you want to work on it then you need to do that PLUS you need to make it pass the Bobby Accessibility Guidelines".

    Beware that just because something passes Bobby, it doesn't necessarily mean it's completely accessible. As the W3C [w3.org] themselves point out, there is no automated test that can prove or disprove that your site is accessible. Several people have come up with accessibility checklists [google.co.uk], however, which are a good place to start (as is Bobby, for that matter; it's just not a good place to finish).


  • My hope here is that some of you folks interested in this topic might have some insight on a related issue with the US voting systems.

    I've been a spectator in a recent discussion regarding the best approach to delivering a secure voting system to the blind. It was an offshoot of some discussions on the current US voting systems, their serious shortcomings, and solutions. So far, I haven't read what any proposal that made much sense to me - they are all either extremely expensive (ie: everyone gets a special $3k reading wand) or otherwise highly impractical (ie: convoluted, multi-step, off-the-cuff type procedures to supposedly ensure a secure vote for the blind citizen).

    I'm no expert in this area, and I want to understand it a bit better. Can anyone suggest a practical solution that could be reasonably implemented across the US ?
  • by Takehiko ( 20798 ) on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:20PM (#11141214)
    Print ballots in brail.
  • Don't forget KDE (Score:3, Interesting)

    by JaxWeb ( 715417 ) on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:27PM (#11141268) Homepage Journal
    Heh, I was just reading the KDE news bar on the left, and this came up: KDE 3.4 Will Talk to You [kde.org]

    The KDE Accessibility team is in the process of integrating speech synthesis into KDE. Not only does this mean better support for visually-impaired and speech-impaired users, but the new features should also prove for a fun desktop experience overall.

    Seems very relevent!
  • Re:Sad truth (Score:2, Interesting)

    by MattyIce ( 565167 ) <slashdot&mattw,cotse,net> on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:35PM (#11141340)
    Speaking from experience (I've been blind since birth), Windows so far has the best accessibility using a text-to-speech interface. Web-browsing with IE is painless and most other Windows apps are farily easy to use with either JAWS or Window-Eyes. It is true that Firefox does not work well with screen reading applications (JAWS/Window-Eyes) but a beta of Window-Eyes and Mozilla (1.8) shows some promise. The iPod is not a viable option since it requires knowing what is on the display; the wheel does not have any stops so it is nearly impossible to know how many options you have scrolled past and there is no feedback other than pointless clicks. The best audio player would not have a display--I've seen some like this in the past and I've heard the iPodFlash will have no display so that may be viable. Speakup is an open-source project to provide text-to-speech from boot-up to shutdown. I have not used it at all at this point (I primarily use ssh to access my Linux machines) but there is a thriving user community and plenty of support. Gnome 2.4 and above has a screen-reader called Gnopernicus which is supposed to work with OpenOffice and Mozilla. I just installed this on my Gentoo box last weekend and have not done any testing yet but again, there are mailing lists etc. so if you are technically competent, this might be an option. If you google for Speakup, Gnopernicus, YASR, etc., you should be able to find plenty of resources. Hope this helps.
  • by CrazyJim1 ( 809850 ) on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:37PM (#11141365) Journal
    If you give every object in the game a name, and you relate distance and time, you can quite easily turn a MMORPG into a text adventure that can be read. This is a primitive step towards artificial intelligence. Artificial intelligence will have every real noun and verb in its dictionary, and create a virtual 3d world. Artificial Intelligence is a long way off, but wiring up a MMORPG to play in text mode could be done now if funded.
    More on AI [geocities.com]
  • by Zerbey ( 15536 ) * on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:42PM (#11141441) Homepage Journal
    Unfortunately, it's not free either. A visually impared co-worker needed help finding free software and I couldn't not find any decent software that wasn't free. There are very few decent commercial products, either. This is a real shame because there's a lot of visually impared geeks out there who are crying out for decent software.

    ZoomText is available from AI Squared [aisquared.com] and works great with Mozilla Firefox. Unfortunately at $395 the price tag is pretty hefty and there's no Linux version. Blind charities can usually sell the software at a discount, however.
  • by Raunch ( 191457 ) <http://sicklayouts.com> on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:43PM (#11141455) Homepage
    The sysadmin in my CS dept is blind, he uses linux exclusively, exept for telnetting into the solaris machines that he administers.

    I have no idea what he uses, but he is completely blind. He has an audio output that reads what I assume is the output from the terminal at an incredible speed. I have never been able to understand what it is saying, but he is quick about the whole thing. Probably the fastest typist I know.
  • by MonsoonDawn ( 795807 ) on Monday December 20, 2004 @06:52PM (#11141552) Homepage
    It's really great that games like second-life can allow physically impaired people to "be on an equal playing field for once" But it would also be nice if these games offered people a choice of physical impairments. I might like to have a quadraplegic or deaf alter-ego but I can't do that in game-world.
  • Re:OS X works for me (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Mr. Shiny And New ( 525071 ) on Monday December 20, 2004 @09:05PM (#11142662) Homepage Journal
    The difference is that tape is a linear format, with a handfull of songs, and is very mechanical. So big mechanical buttons are practically required, and also there are only a handful of possible functions, and there's no way to search for songs or categorize or anything. mp3 players typically have more features (but require you to look at them) because they are non-linear, and they have lots of songs, and potentially lots of extra things that can be done once you're holding a computer in your hand.

    So since we CAN sort and categorize music, and we HAVE to be able to search or something, an mp3 player usually provides something more than just basic cd-player controls. And bigger, more physically present buttons would just take up too much space when most mp3-players are trying to become so small you can fit it in your nose (painlessly).

    As for blind people, I expect they will be constrained, like they are now, with other electronic devices, to a few brands that make larger devices or blind-friendly devices. My mother-in-law is nearly blind, and the tape deck she uses for books-on-tape is huge, I'm sure in no small part due to the fact that blind people have to feel their way around it. A tiny device with a handful of tiny, non-descript buttons would not be that helpful.

    I think blind people will be (sadly) marginalized until we can cure blindness, a la Geordi La Forge on Star Trek.
  • Re:OS X works for me (Score:2, Interesting)

    by LiquidCoooled ( 634315 ) on Monday December 20, 2004 @09:52PM (#11142997) Homepage Journal
    Why shouldn't I be able to play and control my media in a linear fashion?
    The attraction of a large media player to me would be "plays as much stuff as the radio, but I can choose what to listen to".

    Simple skip buttons for Song/Folder would be enough for me. Sure, that way, I lose the pointless searching for music, and get on with playing it.

    I wouldn't have put the music on the device if I didn't like it, and at the point of putting it on, I can do whatever searching and arranging I want.

    I have winamp on now, and I haven't done anything with it for days because it just plays my music. If I don't like a particular track, I skip it, if I don't like a genre just I move further down the playlist.
    Its got hours and hours of none repeating music on a semi random playlist. Why would I need to search?

    I think the chunkiness thinking sounds about right, and small illogically designed devices you must actually look at to use are just impractical anyway. A good example of this is with a horrible rectangle remote control for a tv. Good ones are ergonomically styled and based mainly on tactile feedback.
  • by StandardsSchmandards ( 828326 ) on Tuesday December 21, 2004 @06:13AM (#11145576) Homepage
    I am developing a Jaws emulator for Firefox called Fangs [sourceforge.net]. Fangs is GPL and targeted at sighted web developers to help them understand how a web page is rendered by a commonly used screen reader. As a side effect it helps Jaws read Firefox pages in a similar way to how it reads IE pages.

    In that work I have received loads of emails from people who would like to use Firefox in an assisted way. That is why I am planning to start a new project using the same rendering engine as Fangs to create a navigatable text representation of a web page. Much of the work is already done in Fangs.

    Creating software for visually impaired users requires a decent speech synthesizer. This should preferrably be part of the OS. Check out FreeTTS [sourceforge.net] and the "alan" voice. FreeTTS is the only OSS speech synthesizer I know of. Does anyone know of a distribution with libraries for text to speech synthesis?

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