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Biotech The Internet

Burnout and Depression Among IT Workers? 216

Posted by Cliff from the mental-health-and-information-overload dept.
Cultural Sublimation asks: "All of us working in IT seem to be especially prone to problems like burnout and depression. Could part of the reason be directly related to our professions? Recently, there have been a number of interesting features on Kuro5hin which have focused precisely on this issue. From people claiming that " The Internet Is Driving Me Crazy", to an in-depth two-part series trying to demystify depression, the message is that too much information might be making us sick. What are the experiences of fellow Slashdot readers on this topic?"
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Burnout and Depression Among IT Workers? More

Burnout and Depression Among IT Workers?

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  • ADD via the Internet (Score:5, Interesting)

    by dave-tx ( 684169 ) * <{moc.liamg} {ta} {todhsals+80891fd}> on Thursday May 19, 2005 @03:50PM (#12581888)
    I'm sure it's nothing unique or particularly unusual, but I've found that over the past few years my attention span has become very short. I attribute this to the Internet and the ability to get information about anything I want very quickly.

    Television, radio, and even my favorite hobby of listening to music seem to need to be supplanted by something else. I used to enjoy sitting down, putting on a CD or record and just listening. Now, I get bored too quickly - and that makes me somewhat sad (but not depressed).

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 )
      Comment removed based on user account deletion

    • Re:ADD via the Internet (Score:5, Interesting)

      by MrAnnoyanceToYou ( 654053 ) <dylan AT dylanbrams DOT com> on Thursday May 19, 2005 @06:22PM (#12583607) Homepage Journal
      When you've got a brain the size of a planet, like most geeks, it's quite easy to see the outcome of all things. The pointlessness of it all. I'm going to go take a nap.

      On-topic, my guess is that a big piece of it is that tech workers tend away, habitually and culturally, from physical exercise and good eating habits. I started doing yoga (cap?) a month and a half ago, and err... yeah. Speaking of changes in attitude and life style... Wow. My suggestion if you're feeling like crap is to go find a physical activity you enjoy (rock climbing, yoga, swimming, sex, etc.) and egage in it regularly. I suggest, as well, that it become rather easy for you to participate in, (which automatically excludes certain options for most people who spend enough time in front of a computer) so that you don't have to FORCE yourself to do it.

      As an aside, I love Yoga, and my pot belly is going the way of the dodo, slowly.

      Most of all, remember that being athletic and doing something physical every few days at LEAST is something that will make you feel better after a month or more of dedication. Funny how you can spend six months perfecting a rocket jump but be frustrated when you don't feel any change in your body after eating right for a few days....

      And if you get that mental point where you think, "Jesus, I've been doing the same thing for ten seconds now and I can't stand it," physical activity will show you, eventually, that standing it is completely possible, and you will enjoy it later.
    • Dude, I had a recent suicide attempt that I attribute, in small part, to my internet addiction and it's effects on my mental state. There's a lot more that goes along with it, but the way the internet makes my mind go into overdrive is a big part of it.
      • Sorry that you tried to kill yourself and failed, but STFU. Yeah, let's start blaming something else for our problems, so what is it now, the INTERNET? First we blamed violence in movies, violence in video games, and now the internet?

        It's people like you that cannot realize that all of their problems are in their head, and are usually their own fault, and can also be easily fixed by finding a creative outlet. (your mileage may differ, talk to a therapist if you need to)

        Stop fucking blaming others. Atte
        • I never said that the internet grabbed me in a dark alley and forced me to become addicted to it. I know I played a part in the addiction. What I am saying is that there can, in some people, be a danger associated with information overload.

          I personally think that recreational drugs should be leagal. People should understand what the drug can do to them and understand the potential consequences of them. I think we are learning that there can, in some people, be a side effect from using the Internet
      • Whatever. If it's truly your "internet addiction" making you miserable, turn the fucking computer off, take the computer outside and leave it on the curb. Cancel the DSL/Cable and move on.

        Take responsibility for your life.

    • Re:ADD via the Internet (Score:3, Informative)

      by prell ( 584580 )
      ADD is caused by a chemical imbalance. I don't believe you can "get it"; I believe you have to be born with it. What you're describing - if you don't have ADD - is probably something else.
  • I wonder, am I depressed because I'm burned out or burned out because I'm depressed?
    • Wait...I figured it out. Maybe I'm depressed and burned out because, after spending two years on a enterprise wide systems upgrade where I averaged working 75 hours a week as a salaried employee, a project that was completed under budget and 6 months ahead of schedule, I was outsourced at the end of the project to cut costs. Yes, that must be it. (true story)


      • Been there...my condolences.

        If you expect recognition from your employer, you will always be doomed to disappointment. At the end of the day, you just gotta do it for yourself.

      • That sucks!
        Depending on your skillset, if you're in Seattle I might be able to hook you up with a decent employer.
        (Unless of course you've taken this as a sign that you should start your own business. :)
        • Itwerx,

          Thanks for the offer. I live on the east coast right now and the wife isn't interested in moving again for at least 5 years, so for now I will pass on the offer.

          It's funny but since I was laid off, I am contracting to do the same job I did before for 50% more money. I think this is mostly because there are no company benefits included but that is OK, I'd rather pay for my own benefits (health insurance, retirement, etc.) anyway.

          And to top it off, I'm currently working for the company that makes


  • Here's the question that pops into my mind:


    Are we prone to burnout and depression because we work in IT, or do we work in IT because we are prone to depression and burnout?



    • I'd say the first one for most people. I switched into Comp. Sci in college and loved it. I even enjoyed my internships during the summers. Then, I had to get a real job after school. Where I lived, basically the only jobs were government contracting, and there were reasons I needed to live there (family, etc.). I got a decent job with a major contractor, enjoyed learning the ropes for the first year or so, but all that gradually wore away the second year and was all gone after the third. The politics
  • i dunno, but i've never been sicker, more volatile, or more depressed than i have been since i started my current job.

  • Info Overload + Abuse (Score:4, Funny)

    by photon317 ( 208409 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @03:55PM (#12581956)

    Information overload is part of the problem. The other part is the abusive lifestyles we lead - in part by choice and in part because the industry expects it of us. The more strenuous brain-work you're having to do on a daily basis, the more sleep you need to avoid clinical depression - yet we're expected to, want to, and are driven to sleep relatively little.

    The answer is to do you magic during an 8 hour work day, and spend the rest of the day being relaxes, and get a good 8-10 hours of sleep every night - good sound sleep. If you're already suffering clinical depression of some stage, you need even more sleep to recover from it. A good diet and a healthy level of exercise also wouldn't hurt. Be sure to read the linked kuro5hin articles though on the caveats of exercise for the clinically depressed.

  • easy solution (Score:3, Funny)

    by DrSkwid ( 118965 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @04:09PM (#12582128) Journal
    read http://daily.rotten.com [rotten.com] and you'll soon see that *your* life is a paradise, provided you're not featured of course.

    For an early introduction into what you *could* become, take a look at the poor fuckers on the mother site [rotten.com]

  • Should Be On Main Page (Score:5, Informative)

    by mlmitton ( 610008 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @04:12PM (#12582165)
    I really wish this had been posted on the main page. IT or not, far too many people refuse to recognize depression as a problem that's treatable. Myself included. I had gone for 15 years with depression I never thought was serious. My girlfriend (no ex-girlfriend, she left me because of depression) forced me into treatment, and the Pdoc was shocked that I was still alive. All that time, being mostly unhappy, and it didn't need to be that way. I was too stubborn to admit it.

    Anyway, some resources. If you are taking/thinking about taking meds, I highly recommend http://www.crazymeds.org/ [crazymeds.org] The site isn't run by a doctor, but having checked his information from a number of different sources, he definitely seems to get the information right. Plus, the site is irreverant, which I appreciate.

    The first course of therapy for depression is cognitive behavioral therapy. There is a standard book that explains these techniques. Feeling Good, by David Burns. Amazon link here: http://tinyurl.com/7dxos [tinyurl.com]

    I've read a lot of books on depression over the past 18 months, and the best, the most informative, I found was The Noonday Demon, by Andrew Solomon. Amazon again: http://tinyurl.com/99neh [tinyurl.com]

    Finally, the links in the post were good, and a good start, but I definitely disagree with some of his advice. Everybody is different, so take the time to hear different viewpoints on diagnoses, symptoms, and cures.

    If you're wondering, treatment has made me better than I was, but I still have room for improvement. This is important. Depression may never (or it may) be "cured" for you, but in nearly all cases, treatment will decrease its severity. But not necessarily right away. Treatment is a process, and it takes some time to get there. Be patient.

    • Re:Should Be On Main Page (Score:3, Informative)

      by drix ( 4602 )
      No, that's not an Amazon link, it's a Tinyurl link. Insulting my intelligence by burying your referral code inside of a tinyurl makes me a lot less inclined to do you the favor of clicking. C'mon, this is /.--we're hep to that game. Put it out in the open and let ppl decide for themselves.

    • Puts me in mind of Peter's conversation with Dr. Swanson in Office Space:

      Peter Gibbons: So I was sitting in my cubicle today, and I realized, ever since I started working, every single day of my life has been worse than the day before it. So that means that every single day that you see me, that's on the worst day of my life.

      Dr. Swanson: What about today? Is today the worst day of your life?

      Peter Gibbons: Yeah.

      Dr. Swanson: Wow, that's messed up.

  • Huh? (Score:2)

    by Otter ( 3800 )
    So we get a completely unsupported assertion that depression is higher among IT workers, a link to what I assume is intended as a humorous bit (although who knows with Kuro5hin*?) about WWW addiction that has nothing to do with IT and two epic-length bits about depression that have little or nothing (I lacked the patience to read closely enough to state "nothing" with confidence) about IT work?

    And your point is what?

    * I threw in the towel for good on that site when one of their recurring flamewars about t


    • I threw in the towel for good on that site when one of their recurring flamewars about the Middle East devolved into a dispute about whether Israel is or isn't in Africa.

      And yet you frequent Slashdot. Odd, that...
  • kuroshin, -1

  • One should take into account more variables. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by cbiffle ( 211614 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @04:17PM (#12582223)
    I've been watching this pretty closely, preparing for a masters program in a related topic. This isn't directly related to my research, so take it more as an idea than a finding, but:

    Information overload will only affect certain personality types. There are those of us who inhale Google daily. Recent example: "I went home last night, discovered Hibernate, learned it, and converted our 70,000-line service center app to use it. Want the diffs?" Yeah, there are people who do this; we had it happen at work about a week ago.

    Others simply cannot absorb and process information that quickly. These people are potential info-burnouts. Tends to correlate, in my experience, with a general unwillingness to learn new programming languages or adapt to new systems. They're not being sticks-in-the-proverbial-mud -- they understand that they simply can't cram it into their brain quickly enough, and it often makes them anxious.

    There are a lot more types of programmers than that, but you get the idea. In my case, I was trained from an early age to work around my ADD by constantly juggling large amounts of data. (My parents are ADD programmers too.) I have the opposite problem: my productivity declines as my tasks get simpler. It becomes too easy to become distracted.

    My point: don't reduce the problem of burnout. There are a lot more variables than just information.

    I suspect work conditions have far more to do with burnout and depression. Programmers tend to be expected to work long hours, and at least in my experience, a surprising percentage of programming shops have hostile, competitive, or abusive environments.

    • Re:One should take into account more variables. (Score:4, Interesting)

      by judd ( 3212 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @05:10PM (#12582834) Homepage
      I have the opposite problem: my productivity declines as my tasks get simpler.

      Wow. That is exactly my problem. Complex tasks are engaging enough that they consititute a world of distraction in themselves.

      Perhaps this is why I have a lot of unfinished projects. Once it's obvious what needs to be done, and the real mysteries are cracked, you leave the rest as an exercise for the student.

      If only I had a student.

      • Re:One should take into account more variables. (Score:4, Funny)

        by Glonoinha ( 587375 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @05:27PM (#12583044) Journal
        I have the opposite problem: my productivity declines as my tasks get simpler.

        That's funny, because it's the same for me. I'd be most relaxed at a gun-fight, particularly if automatic weapons are being used on either side. At least I could stay focused and I'd have a well defined, single goal.

        The simple crap, like paying bills ... that's the real evil side of my life. I mean - I have enough money in the bank, I have the bills, I have enough checks - where's the challenge in that. Actually writing that check and getting it in the mail is a trivial exercise left to the reader. Much to simple an answer for me to actually complete the exercise. Visa wasn't impressed.

      • Perhaps this is why I have a lot of unfinished projects. Once it's obvious what needs to be done, and the real mysteries are cracked, you leave the rest as an exercise for the student.

        Let me guess. You're an INTP [intp.org]

      • I have the opposite problem: my productivity declines as my tasks get simpler.

        Wow. That is exactly my problem.

        And mine, I mean I should be programming a boring stuff right now. And what am I doing? Reading /.

  • Exercise (Score:5, Insightful)

    by snorklewacker ( 836663 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @04:19PM (#12582251)
    Geeks in general don't exercise as much as they should. Lack of exercise leads to depression in a big way. Cut 40 minutes off your other hobby projects and get some good hard exercise, exercise as in you're in the zone for a solid 15 minutes at least. Go get a Polar monitor, it's a nifty gadget (mmm gadgets) that will tell you for sure when you're in the zone. For most people, it's less effort than they think -- you don't have to exhaust yourself to get your heart rate up, though it's pretty punishing to keep it up for the first couple weeks.

    If you exercise regularly, your mind will be sharper, and you'll write better code. This I guarantee.

    My polar HRM is of course gathering dust. I need to take my own advice.

    • Re:Exercise (Score:3, Interesting)

      by LWATCDR ( 28044 )
      I would also recommend bicycling as a great geek sport. Full of gadgets. You want a flame war. Just start the XTR vs SRAM debate. Should a frame be AL, Ti, or Carbon fiber. Of course you have the Steel is Real group.
      Yes we sit on our butts all day. Believe that coke, pizza and snickers bars are a balanced diet, and what is worse do not spend enough time with our family.

      I think that has got to be the biggest one. Find a good spouse and get married. I did and I have dropped 60lbs, eat food that does not go f

    • Re:Exercise (Score:5, Interesting)

      by david.given ( 6740 ) <dg@cowlark.com> on Thursday May 19, 2005 @07:06PM (#12584034) Homepage Journal
      ...exercise as in you're in the zone for a solid 15 minutes at least.

      What is this 'zone' thing of which you speak?

      No, I'm not being facetious. Some of us don't have one. I don't, for example; no matter how much I do, no matter how I do it, I find exercise very uncomfortable and utterly boring. I don't phase out, I have to keep concentrating every moment.

      I'm not unfit; I'm about 75kg or so, right at the median for my body size, I cycle to work and back each day, but the simple fact is that continued anaerobic exercise is hideously uncomfortable and remains so. I used to go to the gym and doing things like running a kilometre without any practice before hand isn't a problem. I just hate it. I gave up going to the gym because I really wasn't enjoying it and I kept finding myself making excuses not to go, and frankly, life's too short.

      (I have experienced the endorphin rush that I think you're talking about a few times --- but it's never been with anaerobic exercise; always aerobic. Hill walking, actually, which is at least interesting, unlike running on a treadmill. Alas, there are no hills near where I live.)

      • What is this 'zone' thing of which you speak?

        Since he mentioned using a heart rate monitor, I presume he's talking about the aerobic zone [slashdot.org].

        I find exercise very uncomfortable and utterly boring.

        Those two things may be correlated. Once I got a heart rate monitor and made sure to keep my heart rate from getting too high, I enjoyed exercise a lot more. It turned out that I was pushing myself too hard a lot of the time, which made me feel awful.

        As you point out, it's also better to do things you enjoy. Luc
      • Like the next respondent said, the aerobic zone. It's the ideal range, where they tell you to "get your heart rate up", where it should be.

        Basically it's 220 - your age. Pretty easy. The HRM makes it so you don't have to STOP and take your pulse and count and all that rot, you just glance down. Actually my polar beeps, so I don't even have to do that.

        Now if I had a "zone" in the sense like the fitness junkies talk about, I'd actually be using the damn thing. So yes, I hear you. Hiking always interes
      • No, I'm not being facetious. Some of us don't have one. I don't, for example; no matter how much I do, no matter how I do it, I find exercise very uncomfortable and utterly boring. I don't phase out, I have to keep concentrating every moment.

        Sounds like you need sport, not exercise (I'm the same - hate exercising, love playing sport). I would suggest trying a few sports that are fast and/or complex, with many aspects that need to be tracked simultaneously and/or require very quick analysis and action. I'

        • Sounds like you need sport, not exercise (I'm the same - hate exercising, love playing sport).

          Oh, god, no. Competitive sport is something that I will run screaming from. (Relic of a childhood spent at a school with compulsory intensive sports --- they systematically, but quite unintentionally, tought me to associate all forms of sport and exercise with being jumped on by thugs, seen through a short-sighted blur, while being told repeatedly how useless I was. I don't want to go there, ever again.)

          I know

          • Oh, god, no. Competitive sport is something that I will run screaming from.

            It doesn't *have* to be competitive. I used to play a lot of (very) competitive sport at school, but I've since grown out of it. Now I play sport for fun, and while being "in the zone" on the field can result in some otherwise out-of-character single-mindedness, it all just drops away at the end of the game - I no longer care whether or not I'm on the winning or losing side, merely that it was a good game.

            In particular, I've fou

            • It doesn't *have* to be competitive. I used to play a lot of (very) competitive sport at school, but I've since grown out of it. Now I play sport for fun, and while being "in the zone" on the field can result in some otherwise out-of-character single-mindedness, it all just drops away at the end of the game - I no longer care whether or not I'm on the winning or losing side, merely that it was a good game.

              Unfortunately, what you're describing is a competitive sport. It's a zero-sum game, where if you have

              • Ultimate can be very aerobic and it's not that hard to find people to play with who don't keep score and where people switch sides at random in the middle of the game. I.e. when you get tired, you switch out with someone, and then when you are recovered you switch out with someone who is tired without regard for which team you're on. There are plenty of people who play who just enjoy running back and forth really hard throwing a disc around.

                I haven't played in a while (been cycling mostly) but way back t
      • I used to go to the gym and doing things like running a kilometre without any practice before hand isn't a problem


        I don't know if I am misreading this or what but for me it takes more like 10K to really get in the zone. And I will admit that when I was first starting out, even short distances (1K) were difficult and there was no zone to be found. :P

  • Nothing like working 80+ hours a week (Score:4, Insightful)

    by BrookHarty ( 9119 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @04:20PM (#12582260) Journal
    And loosing your spouse to someone who is around more than you.

    This whole "Salary" means 50+ is bullshit. White collar workers make less then union construction workers not even counting in overtime. The union guys at our work pull 6 figures with massive OT, but we get to sit a nice comfy desk why our Boss yells at us why are 10 million customers out of service because of an outage we dont control.

    Ya, no stress there, goto work at dark, come at dark, wife is mad at all hours, you want to provide a good home, but thats not good enough.

    Really, its come down to 2 parents working to make a living so you can spend time with the family. Good jobs require you to put in more hours, ding ding, problem here...

    Humm, ya, unions suck dont they. Thats why companies merge and lay off thousands of workers, oh wait, unless they are union. The IT workers are dropped quick, the union workers sue and get their jobs back.

    Americans are idiots, they refuse to realize unions where created for saftey and fair wages. So, who needs a union, the big old corporation will take care of you right? This isnt the .dot com days, there are no more perks, inhouse childcare, you are being outsourced quicker than you can say "work visa".

    Lets just blame depression, heres your happy pill.
    • There's more than that!

      They are brainwashed into thinking they must consume and therefore must earn a higher wage. A bigger house, a bigger car, a bigger Television, a bigger diamond ring, and it never ends.

      Because they have only time for working there is no time for walking or bicycling (and American isn't really designed to to bike to work every day like I do), so if they do twig that exercise is required for wellbeing they sign up with a health club, which is yet another expense!

      Worse still: All that time working leaves no time for preparing meals so fast food or preprepared are the order of the day.

      Now back to you points about the American work place (which I have worked in for no small time) the whole system is designed to get most out workers for the least salary (AKA market value) so it's really common for less than scrupulous managers (or really under pressure) to resort to unreasonable methods to achieve this. (My experience with this was during 'review' time.

      So 6 years ago I began to demand different things... For four years when I went through my review and they said "oh pay raises are capped to 2 or 3 percent I said "No problem I'll take the 2% and the balance as holiday time" for a total of 11 weeks per year. They said we're closing the factory and moving to Europe and I said "No Problem, I'll come with you"... So now I bike 10 minute each way to work (I've lost 35 pounds), I only work 25 hours a week so my family and I spend many times more time together and are much happier, We bike down to the local farmer market 4 or 5 times a week for food and eat healthy meals (which has had the side effect of teaching my girlfriend & daughter to cook), we go on a one or two day hike once a month (another thing that's difficult in the US), and we travel twice a year to somewhere we've never been for holidays.

      The problem with American Unions is that they are abused and don't apply to all workers, so that there are a relative few being vastly over paid for what they do. And that in turn reveals a problem with American society and with the concept of "corporations"...

      Just my 2 cents as a very, very refugee from the insanity called "The United States of America" And I have to wonder just how many whacked out slashdotters will read this and think I'm some granola hippy who still thinks he's touring with the 'dead. Word to the Wise: High Tech does not mean "unhealthy" or "wage slave" nor is anti-human or anti-nature.

    • Humm, ya, unions suck dont they. Thats why companies merge and lay off thousands of workers, oh wait, unless they are union. The IT workers are dropped quick, the union workers sue and get their jobs back... Americans are idiots, they refuse to realize unions where created for saftey and fair wages...

      I have to disagree with you there. While there are plenty of unions still around who still do what they were originally intended to, there are also quite a few unions out there who screw themselves out o

      • if you're so dissatisfied with your job, instead of feeling entitled to satisfaction, why not find a job that you will like?

        The alt.sysadmin.recovery FAQ covers one angle of this; essentially, if you're a natural sysadmin-type, no matter what job you take, you'll end up fixing your own computer, then other people's, etc. until you've suddenly become a sysadmin again.

        I've been pondering going into auto mechanicry or electricianing (both of which I have some aptitude for), both to escape the offshori

        • The alt.sysadmin.recovery FAQ covers one angle of this; essentially, if you're a natural sysadmin-type, no matter what job you take, you'll end up fixing your own computer, then other people's, etc. until you've suddenly become a sysadmin again.

          Yeah, sys-admining can be a dead-end job (one of the reasons I'm not doing it anymore). Strangely enough, my last sysadmin job was in operations and not IT. After that gig ended, I wound up in IT. I'm wondering how long I'll last here before I burn out. I'm

      • Don't forget the NEA, National Education Association... man, talk about a corrupt union.

        I agree, unions are not the answer. From my experience, unions have always done more bad than good.
      • I mean, there are so many stories of greedy unions making power grabs...remember the California grocery store workers strike? Remember what that was over? They were upset about having to share some of the costs of the rising cost of healthcare.

        In all fairness, It think it really starts to chap peoples' asses when they see the executive management walking away with either huge salaries (regardless of profitability), or HUGE golden parachutes if they are replaced. In fact, I'd posit that this, at least to s
    • Really, its come down to 2 parents working to make a living so you can spend time with the family. Good jobs require you to put in more hours, ding ding, problem here...

      So many people get caught on this exercise wheel they don't realize not running is an option.

      You don't have to live there. You don't have to work for a megalocorp. Your wife can stay home with the kids. It's a matter of identifying the really important priorities in your life and doing what it takes to achieve them.

      Sure, you probably
  • Too much information may lead to burnout if it is not properly handeld (Dream states are our bodys ways of coping with the excess of information) , What causes the depresions is the long hours and heavy workloads . When the body is not given good time to recouperate from our daily chores then we will suffer from the effects.

    The IT field as it is will most likely make us susceptable to this,IE: working that extra couple of hours to get a project finished. If we deny ourselves proper rest and relaxation we a

  • Burn out is putting it mildly. (Score:4, Interesting)

    by infojunkie ( 96487 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @04:23PM (#12582305)
    I've been experiencing this 'effect' lately.

    I'm the sole developer on a fairly elaborate project. Everything tech related is my responsibility. Site design and architecture, development, support, training, hardware, software, security, everything.

    Early on, it wasn't so bad. Then a year went by. Then two. The third has now completed and I'm entering the fourth. Some days I sit at my desk staring at the screen. In my mind, I'm running through everything I should be doing, but I can't seem to get my fingers to do the typing or my legs to move me to the other side of the room to the desk where I work on hardware.

    I almost didn't bother typing this... but it's kind of theraputic in a way.

    Anyway, lately I seem to find all kinds of 'filler' activities to consume my time. Reading up on the latest changes to the various software we use, keeping up with /. , or browsing forums for new knowledge. All (mostly) legit use of my time, but it's starting to feel like it is all I can, or want, to do. The worst part is, nothing seems to stick anymore. I'll read some info on a site and not remember it a day later.

    Sure, I can probably remember most of the topics on /. but ultimately who cares about that. I sit, frustrated at myself and the amount of mounting work... a pile that grows exponentially it seems... Yet I can't seem to motivate myself to change it. I recognize that it's happening... I see the crash ahead of me. It's not that I'm apathetic or lazy, but I sure seem to be behaving that way. Is this a symptom of depression?

    I've never really thought of myself as someone who gets depressed. Maybe that's denial talking. How does one check for that?

    More importantly, how does one go about kick-starting their motivation again? I've tried little side projects that are related to what I do already, in the hopes that will gain me some momentum and I can then change lanes and keep working, but I can't even seem to build up any steam.

    Even as I type I'm getting bored. Could be because I figure nobody will even care what I'm typing in the first place. Then again, if it helps someone else, or someone with insight can explain it then maybe it was worth it.

    I wonder if there's anything good on tv right now?
    • Holy shit man. You've just described exactly how I feel.

      I've been at my current IT job for almost 3 years (in the field for about 5) and I'm going through the exact same thing. My girlfriend is a graphic artist and is in the same boat as we are. She thinks it's because all the tasks we're given don't challenge us anymore, and the tasks that would challenge us either get outsourced to a consultant or wouldn't be pratical to implement. My current project is implementing a network-wide SNMP monitoring tool

      • Four years ago, I had gotten laid off from my .com job, I had started playing Quake 3 RA about 80-105 hours a week, and I was 'looking for a job.' I ended up on my floor staring at the sunny day outside one afternoon, and thought, "What now, this sucks." I then went back to school - I was 22 at the time. If you're that far down, I suggest 2 things to start with:
        1) Exercise.
        2) A Plan To Get You Happy.
        (1) is hard. You need to find something you enjoy doing for exercise. But if you're in a decent IT jo
      • Computing used to be my hobby, now it's a job. I haven't found another hobby to replace it.

        Computers will always be my "hobby" - I personally can't see anything replacing that. Consequently, I fear if ever a day comes where I can't have a job (for whatever reason) that involves computers. At the same time, I entertain a fantasy of seeing the day when advanced AI makes my job unnecessary...

        After work, I tend to do different things - sometimes I just kick back and relax. Sometimes this involves doing nothin

    • You seem to have hit upon something that has bothered me. I can recognize when I'm acting apathetic or lazy, but I lack the motivation to change that, since I'm acting apathetic and lazy. It frustrates me from time to time, and I find it best to just ignore it and move on with what I was (not?) doing, but its one of those great chicken-egg arguments. I know enough to know that something needs to break the cycle, but again, being lazy or apathetic, I won't actually do anything to break the cycle.

      I wonde

  • Depression an occupational hazard (Score:3, Interesting)

    by mutterc ( 828335 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @04:33PM (#12582424)
    I think our (geeks') analytical abilities allow us to easily see things that ordinary people would rather ignore, in order to save their sanity. (Examples: the uselessness of company loyalty, the direction of society, etc.)

    Programming and IT are racing to the bottom awfully fast. If these industries are what you experience most of, you can (fallaciously) extrapolate that to other industries. For example, in my dark moments, I've wondered why cars don't yet require subscriptions to keep driving. I've also wondered when restaurants are going to make you start signing waivers before you eat there.

    Likewise, we can fallaciously extrapolate the dismal quality of software to other industries. (See the old "if cars were like computers" joke). I spent a couple years in support at my company; some customers actually like our product, though, after my experience, I'm surprised that our boxes ever boot up at all, much less occasionally do something useful. I can recognize now that that's a warped perspective.

  • Slashdot! (Score:3, Interesting)

    by mutterc ( 828335 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @04:43PM (#12582531)
    I've really noticed Slashdot being a depressive influence. During my darker times I have to give it up, to try to fight the downward spiral.

    Reading Slashdot for long enough, you start to wonder when corporations are simply going to take over the government, make slavery legal again, and start charging lifetime subscriptions for products you can only use for a year.

    The fact that all the depressing things reported here are true doesn't help. Knowing that you / your industry / society / etc. is heading towards a race-to-the-bottom cliff, and not being able to do a damn thing about it, is awfully depressive.

    Andrew Solomon (referenced above) mentioned in a "Bush Survival Guide" of antidepressant tips I got for Xmas:

    Recent research has shown that depressed people have a more accurate worldview than the non-depressed. The same research also says that a more accurate worldview is not an advantage.

  • It is a hard place to work (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Admiral Lazzurs ( 96382 ) * <.rob. .at. .lazzurs.ie.> on Thursday May 19, 2005 @04:44PM (#12582547) Homepage
    Ask anyone who has left the IT field to reflect and they will tell you how much their job took over their lives....most jobs do not do that.

    Plus you have to understand the type of person who usually heads into this field is usually a geek....this is more than just their jobs and usually the geek life is one that is defined early in school life......maybe we should be looking at this from that angle.

    I need more sleep...excuse me :)

  • Serious Question (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    I have a serious question. Post anonymous for obvious reason. In the real world, people cannot discuss health issues, especially mental health issues. I'm really wondering just how many people have had the same problems as I have. I graduated college almost 10 years ago. After college I got a decent paying job, got an apartment, all the usual stuff. Everything I thought I wanted up to that point. I even had a fiance. American dream so to speak. I became very disappointed. The work was not what I expected, t
    • No, not 'crazy'. Just caught up on the hamster wheel. Zoloft, produce, produce, more zoloft, more code...You haven't stopped since middle school.

      Stop.

      Take a year off. Be a lumberjack. Do a lap of your continent on your bicycle. Flip burgers. Join the Peace Corps. Do something, anything, else for a while. Your brain and body will thank you.

  • ...so I recently changed careers. I'm now a reporter.

  • Before you blame information glut... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by crmartin ( 98227 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @04:53PM (#12582652)
    ... as someone who has suffered from depression for years, let me hint to you that there are several other things in the IT "lifestyle" ("Life? Don't talk to me about life....") that have something or other to do with depression.

    (1) Self-care. The style that we encourage in CS courses, with our image of hackers working for days at a time and living on the four programmer food gorups ("caffeine, grease, salt, and processed sugar"), is not something that people can generally physically deal with even into the middle twenties. Sleep and periodic meals make a big big difference to mood.

    PHB's who think that you can actually do more in an 80 hour week than in a 50 hour week just add to this, which leads to ...

    (2) Feelings of helplessness. We start out with the frustrations of programming, where we're doing perhaps the most complicated intellectual task invented by humanity, doing it with a body of knowledge that's really only 50 or 60 years old, and dealing periodically with apparently inexplicable problems. Then add the canonical Dilbert moments: PHB's, "flexible" schedules, expected overtime, "offshoring", our own inclination toward being obsessive-compulsive (which we either start with or are trained into by our tools and techniques), and then dealing with a whole lot of people who don't understand the intellectual challenges or share the style of rigorous thought and obsession with detail that go with our field. Depression and burnout are very much related to feelings of helplessness.

    (3) programming tends to involve people who are less extroverted and less social. People who are bright, introverted, and unsocial tend to feel isolated and alone. Depressing.

    In fact, a lot of us would test pretty highly for Asperger's Syndrome [udel.edu], which is akin to mild autism.

    The point is that you don't need some new "information glut" syndrome to explain a prevalence of depression and burnout.

  • to do again (Score:2, Funny)

    by chivo243 ( 808298 )
    sometimes I want to be the person in the 3rd world who has never ever even taken a phone call.... not the guy that has 15 remote sessions open, and 10 browser tabs... if I owned a mobile serial killing would not be far behind!

  • WoW cures all (Score:2, Funny)

    by kendoka ( 473386 )
    I was a depressed overweight nerd sitting at the computer too long, getting angry and frustrated.

    Now I am an overweight happy nerd sitting at the computer playing WoW, getting angry and frustrated at all the n00bs who can't play as well as me.

    Things tend to work themselves out. =P
  • Every time I get a support request because someone doesn't know that you move a window by dragging it by the title bar, or because they can't find a program on their start menu I do start to wonder why I bother.

  • Everyone's burnt out, not only IT... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Wudbaer ( 48473 ) on Thursday May 19, 2005 @08:10PM (#12584578) Homepage
    ... or at least it seems like that. I am a Medical doctor by training, and as a part of my mandatory membership in the German Medical association I get their weekly journal. Regularly comes up "Burnout in the Medical profession." (noone suffers that bad from burn out like doctors yadda yadda yadda). I am co-owner of a small company, so I get all kinds of more or less useful business related stuff. Regular topic: Burnout in management. (noone suffers that bad from burn out like owners/managers yadda yadda yadda). And now Slashdot.... So it's not only IT, it's the general trend in demanding jobs to overestimate one's capabilities and capacity to endure a lot of pressure over a long period of time.

  • I'm not sure it's related to the profession necessarily. I've had tech jobs that I hated and which drove me into depression, and ones that left me feeling pretty good about my work and myself.

    A year ago, I was so miserable in my then-new job that I hated getting up in the morning and so consistently irritable that my boss was convinced I had an anger management problem. But that's largely because I was working for a boss whose first instinct when he saw a new employee having difficulties was to diagnose

  • Burnout & Depression (Score:3, Interesting)

    by log0n ( 18224 ) on Friday May 20, 2005 @01:43PM (#12591649)
    I've been there. I burned out - major depression. I use technology in my business (self employed - indy film & videography), but I don't give a hang about it anymore. I'd rather do something with all of the tech than learn about the tech just for the sake of it being there.

    For me, basically my whole life was wrapped up in the computer. Programming, projects, hobbies, my identity - how people recognized me and interacted with me - and often what they interacted over.. all of it was dependent on the computer (and none of this was in an unhealthy obsessive way - for example the antisocial EQ addicts, I was nothing like that - technology was just my drug that got me high and made me my real world friends).

    When I finally burned out, I had very little else to 'me' that didn't involve computers or programming or technology in some way. Major depression ensued. Fortunately for me though, because I've never been the antisocial type, I had a pretty good support system around me that kept me from really offing myself over everything. I've found new hobbies, I've restarted my 'life' and learned from my past mistakes. No one aspect of what I enjoy or what I do defines me anymore.

    Kind of a rambling of thoughts and not to coherent, but I've definitely been there. For those of you afraid of having the same thing happen, start branching out now. Make friends and hobbies that don't involve binary. Learn to spend time away from the comp and not feel like you're missing something terribly crucial.

    And get A LOT of excercise.

  • Well, naturally -- burnout is the IT malady. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by crazyphilman ( 609923 ) on Saturday May 21, 2005 @03:26AM (#12597510) Journal
    Consider what it's like to be a programmer (especially an American programmer) in private industry:

    1. Management doesn't like you. They consider you a big sunk cost, a drain on their precious profits. It won't matter whether the product YOUR team developed is the only thing the company has to sell, it won't matter if your skill in setting up their network made them leaner and meaner than the competition, nothing you do or say will change anything. They consider you an anchor around their neck and they resent you for it.

    2. You are painfully aware that management (the guys from #1 who don't like you) keeps investigating various outsourcing options. From time to time, you see the CEO having warm conversations with guys in suits, who you know from a conversation in the elevator are with a large outsourcing firm.

    3. Although all the guys in Sales are out the door by 5:01PM, and in the bar pickled by 6:00PM, YOU're stuck at work until 9PM every night trying to get a product release out the door. You're working your guts out because your idiot project manager doesn't care (he's drinking with the guys from Sales). And no matter how hard you work, your only thanks is going to be "Damnit, Bill, you're a week late on this! This is going to go in your performance review!"

    4. Because you live at work, and therefore are a pasty, nearsighted, vaguely unhealthy dweeb, you haven't been laid in a year. But you have to listen to the sales guys bragging about all the pussy they're getting when they're drunk in the bar you never make it to. Once in a while, one of them catches a venereal disease and you get to enjoy a minute of Shadenfreude. Then you go back to your compiler. What the fuck! It was compiling fine a minute ago... How the fuck did that... Oh. Right. Never mind. (Type, type, type).

    5. The ONE NIGHT you go home early (at 6PM) because you're dead exhausted, you run into one of the suits and he quips "Half day, Bob?" The rest of the elevator ride is you fighting the overwhelming urge to stab him in the neck with the pen your father gave you for Christmas. The reason you DON'T is, you're afraid the police won't return it after the forensics guys are done with it. It really IS a nice pen.

    6. Every day, on your way in to work, you walk past Smith, who is some vague middle manager or something (you don't know what his actual function is, but he seems to be always present). If you're even a minute late, he makes clucking noises as you pass. If you forgot to shave, he rubs his chin and shakes his head, smiling. The one time you spoke, he got snotty with you, implying that you were a hippie freak.

    7. You can't work for more than ten minutes without somebody ruthlessly interrupting you to ask you a question they could have answered with Google in two minutes flat. You briefly consider buying a spray can and filling it with cold water (it worked on your ex-girlfriend's cat). Then you think, nah, better use battery acid. THEN you worry about why you thought of that, and THEN, you worry that you're a big pussy because you worried.

    One day, you realize: THIS IS MY LIFE. I picked this on PURPOSE! And just like that, you become a burnout.

    DISCLAIMER: When I figured out I was a burnout, I left the private sector and found much happier environs. I feel a whole lot better now. :)

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