Space Tourism? 214
Cave_Monster wonders: "With the successful return to earth by Gregory Olson, the US businessman who allegedly paid around £11m for his trip, what are people's thoughts on continuing with this trend? It is definately favourable towards generating extra funds for space programs, and with Mr. Olson preferring to be labeled as a 'flight participant' rather than a tourist, it definately begs the question as to how much input can these paying people have in space research? Experiments that he participated in included further investigation into how the human body deals with weightlessness and the possible causes to lower back pain and nausea, yet are these activities simply carried out so as to 'entertain' or is there real scientific purpose behind them? With the next 'tourist' expected to be Japanese businessman Daisuke Enomoto, should paying people have a real scientific background or is money simply enough?"
In a capitalist society... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:In a capitalist society... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:In a capitalist society... A lottery is better (Score:2)
The closest you can come to making a scientific justification is that random Guinea Pigs are neede
Re:In a capitalist society... A lottery is better (Score:3, Interesting)
This in a world with only three TV stations and way fewer alternative modes of entertainment.
No freaking way space tourism can payback. Now if we're talking fractional-orbital flights to get you from New York to Tokyo in 15 minutes than space tourism be
Re:In a capitalist society... A lottery is better (Score:2)
I never said that it was a good business model, but consider this: these "rich morons" are in a position to help space programs. They have money to invest in aerospace firms, education, and advertising.
If the only motivation they need to spend that money is a few days of freefall, then send 'em up by the dozen. Of course, the trick would be figuring out which
Re:In a capitalist society... A lottery is better (Score:3, Insightful)
Sadly, the real motivation for the original investment was a combination of chest thumping to beat the commies and crazy paranoia about what the commies could learn or
Re:In a capitalist society... A lottery is better (Score:2)
Well, I'd say that it's pretty clear that the price needs to drop well below $20 million per fli
Re:In a capitalist society... A lottery is better (Score:2)
Second, while I value greatly scientific research, it's pretty clear that human society doesn't value it as much. We can talk about the value of the
Not only that, but.. (Score:2)
Or he could get in the way of the real scientists while they do experiments that don't involve him, but they'll put up with him being in the way. Why? Because he paid for most of the trip, making the experiment cost that much less. Or they're allocating the money for the experiment from the research budget and taking the tourist to earn some c
Re:Not only that, but.. (Score:2)
I dunno, the submitter seems to think that you might be in for some pretty sadistic in-flight entertainment. Probably smarter to be able to pull your own weight.
But capitalism isn't automatically selfish... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:But capitalism isn't automatically selfish... (Score:2)
The big problems right now fo
Re:In a capitalist society... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:In a capitalist society... (Score:2)
Re:In a capitalist society... (Score:2)
The jokes alone will permanently halt all space travel.
More seriously, why not? Rich people die in accidents all the time. No one gets that worked up over it.
Re:In a capitalist society... (Score:2)
I mean, they're doing it obstensibly for the good of the people, or humanity or whatever, they don't seek profit and they do it from tax dollars.
And they do a lot of good research too, I'm not knocking NASA exactly. But when it comes to manned space it's all a bit pointless; there's little research going on. That badly *needs* to be privatised. It's just pork-barrel politics at it's worst. None of their manned projects have really
Re:In a capitalist society... (Score:2)
rj
Fly me to the Moon... (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Fly me to the Moon... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Fly me to the Moon... (Score:2)
If you're going to claim contrary to the steady re
Re:Fly me to the Moon... (Score:2)
Which is why all the Russian critical path equipment is on orbit - and has been for years.
Which is why the equipment is on orbit, and Progress and Soyuz flights have occure
AstrollMods (Score:2)
100% Troll
What a vicious TrollMod of that perfectly reasonable post [slashdot.org]. The Russians have been screwing up the ISS for over a decade, over budget (which they underfund), late, failing parts. It's obvious the Russians threw the US an anvil when we asked them to help with the ISS to subsidize their space program. Instead, the Russians gave us their worst, took the subsidies, and spent it on their own projects, like the solar sails now speeding out through the system, sprea
Re:Fly me to the Moon... (Score:3, Informative)
Partially true. The extra funding they are currently asking for is because the 'free' Soyuz flights (carrying US personell) are coming to an end as per existing agreements.
Hmm.. Where then is the CRV? (Essentially cancelled. Which keeps the crew s
Funding (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Funding (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Funding (Score:4, Insightful)
War -> paid for by government spending -> comes from taxes -> would have been spent as consumer demand.
Takes me back to the 1600s (Score:3, Insightful)
Things have changed, right?
Re:Funding (Score:2)
Is money enough? What? (Score:5, Insightful)
Of course you should "let" rich people buy access that later funds democratization of the new technology.
Re:Is money enough? What? (Score:2)
Another way to view it, is that most of the costs you describe here, eg, research and infrastructure costs are
Tickets to space (Score:4, Insightful)
That should be up to whoever is behind the trip. Maybe if the tourists are completely useless, they'll have to pay more to make up for their dead weight. But we're not talking about buying your way into heaven or something. Sure, traveling to the moon was a big step for mankind, and it takes on mythic, almost religious significance for us for someone to go into space. But bottom line, it's just a new place we can go.
If you've got a rocket and I've got a sack of cash, why shouldn't we be able to make an arrangement? You can't do your science without funding anyway. There's no need to be elitist.
The Right Stuff (Score:2)
Good science is possible. (Score:2)
Re:Tickets to space (Score:2)
Last I checked, not everyone could afford to set aside $20 million. So definitely it's not a wide open field here. The elitist label is probably appropriate.
But consider that prior to this, only a select group of government employees could fly in space, this does open up the field quite a bit. I don't know for certain, but there's probably no more than a thousand or so people worldwide in the past fifty years who
kinda like climing mt everest (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:kinda like climing mt everest (Score:2)
Why money is enough (Score:5, Interesting)
If letting a space tourist go up can attract media attention, then that's great. Its even nice that the customer pays the organization to create good marketing for the organization.
Besides, I'd bet the economics of space flight are such that the cost of filling an empty seat aren't that high. The average cost of putting a pound into orbit may be extremely high, but the cost of adding another pound of person and supplies is probably not bad. It's like the airlines -- if you're going to fly anyway, why not fill every seat.
Creating the idea that space is accessible to an increasing number of people -- not just a few astronauts that spent their life in the program -- is the key to the future of space funding.
Re:Why money is enough (Score:2, Insightful)
I guess; it works for brand-name jeans ans slogan t-shirts.
I'm not sure this is going to be a viable income source in the long term, though. That is, we can't depend on conspicuous consumption to keep our space agencies solvent. As for participating in experiments, when a university does a psychological study, they pay the pa
Re:Why money is enough (Score:2)
(Space travel, that is. Space in itself is quite handy.)
Definitely time to invest in a spell checker (Score:3, Informative)
money is simple enough (Score:2)
NASA, and for that matter the DOD, seem hopelessly technologically disfunctional to this untrained observer, but if some private companies (go Virgin) or national economies devolving into private companies (Russians) can bring the cost of humans to low orbit down slightly we inch towards an economy of scale while the rising powers of the 21st century play catch up. I
Cheaper than a taxi ride. (Score:2)
(I couldn't find the pound thingy on my keyboard so I typed $)
Re:Cheaper than a taxi ride. (Score:5, Funny)
Here ya go. I included a few extras for the next time you need them...
£ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £ £
Hope that helps.
Re:Cheaper than a taxi ride. (Score:2)
science is a fringe activity (Score:3, Informative)
I say make space travel mostly a entertainment/travel industry for now. As the general public finances it, there will be investment and competition by private industry. The cost of space travel will become so cheap that it will be feasible to manufacture in space, and also to throw a few experiments up there.
Forget about the science-and-engineering oriented utopia promised us by science fiction. As a general rule, people want bread and circus. It would be much more effecient to throw a few experiments on the bread-and-circus rockets than the way it's currently being financed.
Re:socializing is a fringe activity (Score:2)
I say make eating mostly a entertainment/reality-show-stunt industry for now. As the general public finances it, there will be investment and competition by private industry.
Space Cowboys (Score:2, Funny)
I'd want to do stupid stuff too. Like put a tether on and fly around with a fire extinguisher rocket. I'd also probably be an idiot and shoot at the moon some. Then all us astronauts would run out and place space ball. I'm sure that'd be a sweet EVA.
I'd make most of my money back plugging Coke and Virgin Galactic. Then I'd make my own cereal called Space-O's which would really be fruit loops with different packag
An interesting answer to a previous story (Score:3, Insightful)
Let's cut the idealistic bullshit on something too. There is something about the government-centric approach to space that needs to be brought up. Who do you really trust to spend money wisely, an eccentric businessman who is getting involved directly like this or Congressmen and government bean counters? The government chose to lock us out of space travel on a private basis for a while and then did nothing to advance it.
This is just more evidence to me of why socialism cannot be trusted to provide for new and edgy research or art. This businessman doesn't have to think about the greater good, he only cares about his ability to fly into space and maybe advancing this for general society. I remember asking a socialist friend why a government owned media outlet would publish counter-culture works and small-time art/literature since there was no proven audience and it was all based on tax funds to produce it (thus an obligation to not be wasteful in publishing art). She couldn't give an honest answer. I think here we see the clear superiority of the free market. There is a lot of money to be made in space so there is a lot of reason for people to support research in this area.
Start my own Space Tourism agency (Score:3, Funny)
In fact, forget the Space Tourism.
Scientific Purpose? (Score:3, Funny)
Given that the space station itself doesn't have a real scientific purpose, using it to host tourists is perfectly appropriate.
Same as archaeology (Score:2, Interesting)
Selling rides to rich people is not a new thing, it seems.
Why does there always need to be a justification. (Score:2)
I mean, I understand it is kind of lame that only multimillioniares can go into space for fun... it would be much better if everyone could afford space travel... I can understan
Re:Why does there always need to be a justificatio (Score:2)
Oh, and before anyone replies to this post saying that SpaceShipOne isn't scalable.. who the hell says you have to have a powered ascent to orbit? There are alternatives to rockets [tethers.com].
Finally.. (Score:2, Funny)
1) Space Tourism, trip to The Moon Disneyland with the kids..
2) Profit!
Japanese space tourist wants to cosplay in orbit (Score:2)
A Japanese Internet whiz is tipped to become the world's fourth space tourist - and he wants to orbit the earth dressed as an ace pilot from a hit Japanese animation series.
Hey Ma Look... (Score:2, Interesting)
Give it a little time, eh? (Score:2)
Early exploration is always touch-and-go, just getting in and out for a quick look (and, ya
Ummm? (Score:2, Interesting)
I don't understand why anybody would ever think these people shouldn't be allowed up. It seems to me that this smacks of elitism, and I don't think that attitude has much of a place anywhere.
Also, if someone thinks participating in scientific experiments is fun (and I would likely think that about some experiments) then more power to them. I don't understand the question here either. Does the fact that someone paid money to go on a trip somehow invalidate the data?
All fun and games until... (Score:2)
Its all good fun and games until someone gets hurt. The first time one of these billionaires gets blown up that will hurt the in
Re:All fun and games until... (Score:2)
personal computers cars steam engines movies X-ray machines forks and spoons
Behind schedule (Score:3, Interesting)
So I think we're behind schedule--- we should have been sending rich people up there to die twenty years ago. If things had gone according to schedule Challenger's cargo bay would have been refitted for passengers by then and 30 people could have died that day in 1986.
Re:Behind schedule (Score:2)
NASA never has been in the space tourism industry. Nor is it clear to me why they should enter and compete with private commerce in this area.
It will be a worry when... (Score:2)
Right now it doesn't seem to be a problem, but what happens when scientists can't get a ride on a rocket because all the places are taken by tourists? Space then stops being a scientific endeavour and becomes a joyride.
When this happens, space travel may cease to advance due to lack of research. Perhaps progress towards interplanetary travel will cease because all the time in space has been bought by tourists? We will have hit a 'local minima'
Re:It will be a worry when... (Score:2)
Your fears are completely unfounded. If tourists buy up all the "time in space", larger spacecraft will be developed to accomodate the need to take extra passengers, or more craft will be built to run more flights at a time. NASA isn't going to just stop doing research because they've got too many civilians who will
Benefits (Score:3, Interesting)
Besides, where's the bad in sending a rich old dude off-planet?
Ask me next year (Score:3, Funny)
unfourtunately moot (Score:2, Insightful)
Since space tourism is here, and probably here to stay, a more valid question is, is t
postflight research (Score:2)
they might be us
It's all about the cash (Score:3, Insightful)
Also, what better measure for getting into space than paying a set price? The price is high, but anyone can work hard with that goal in mind. That it is an open, priced product puts it on the level playing field for all. Being a government Chosen Hero of the State is in no way egalitarian, but an act of status. It allows NASA to fly senators and Saudi princes, but stick their nose up when asked about paying customers. John Denver BEGGED them to let him fly on Shuttle, as a paying customer, they said "screw".
Josh
Carbon Credits (Score:2, Interesting)
Cash is king (Score:3, Insightful)
I say bring it on.
It is time for the scientific strangle hold on manned space flight to end, and for our childhood dreams to come true.
Re:Cash is king (Score:2)
'flight participant' (Score:3, Interesting)
Re: 'flight participant' (Score:2)
And I call myself "a non-participant in the pizza acquisition venture" rather than "a deadbeat", but it doesn't have much effect on peoples' perceptions.
I mean, what's the point... (Score:2)
Consider the end goal (Score:2)
To that end I say the earlier we start thinking of space as a place you can pay to go if you like with no other requiremnet, the sooner we drive down costs so that more people can go.
As a side note I don't think sub-orbital space tourism will big a big hit, I can't see p
Money is enough (Score:2)
Space Flu (Score:2)
I am not sure how much people are going to enjoy space travel unless significant advances are made in providing for people's comfort.
space experience (Score:2)
If the people can actually be actively helpful, that's another bonus, nothing more.
Piper tune (Score:2)
What part don't slashdotters understand? (Score:2)
It is definately favourable towards generating extra funds for space programs,...
A guy pays $20M and suddenly this sounds like extra money. Forget that taxpayers paid several billion dollars to put the ISS up there and billions more to keep it working. For what, to have an unbelievably elitist amusement park ride? What fraction of the i
Paris Hilton In Space .... (Score:2)
But if we could interest Paris Hilton in taking a trip (come on, like she can't pay the $20 million) we could get the first real Zero-G porn action happening. A huge video market -- NASA could do Zero-G PPV.
Although, this would imply that Paris could actually concentrate long enough to go through her flight training. But in case of s
Departure Tax (Score:2)
Can I buy duty free? Do I have to take it with me when I go or can I buy it on my ret
actually no. (Score:2)
Re:Simple answer (Score:2)
Re:Simple answer (Score:2)
Re:money (Score:2)
All that money and where's the fun? (Score:2)
The whole point of the mile high club is to be discrete while packed in around all of those people.
Or do they supply the partner?
Re:Why should it be surprise? (Score:5, Funny)
I don't think 'mile high club' means what you think it means.
Re:DISGUSTED! (Score:5, Insightful)
It's not as if he handed someone a check for $20M and they shredded it right there. Same for ANY luxury item. People make 'em. Others sell 'em. People supply materials to make them and they get paid. Other people supply the suppliers and they get paid.
I suppose you yourself live in a one room hovel, and own no car, computer, cell phone, ipod/cd player, television, books, music, DVDs, extra clothes or shoes. Never eat out. Never see a movie.
If not, then for shame. Why are you spending money on yourself?
How is this insightful? (Score:2)
The money can be far more intelligently spent, and people will still buy clothes, food, etc.
Re:How is this insightful? (Score:2)
Can't have human space colonies without humans, right? Habitat diversitification for humanity is a useful activitiy that can't be performed by unmanned missions.
The money can be far more intelligently spent, and people will still buy clothes, food, etc.
Maybe. What person or group of people are these more intelligent spenders?
Re:DISGUSTED! (Score:3, Insightful)
The guy's Japanese. What difference does it make to him whether he spends his money in Russia or America?
Re:DISGUSTED! (Score:2)
Re:DISGUSTED! (Score:2)
Re:Space tourism while people are starving? (Score:2, Insightful)
In any case, the money spent on this space tourism does not just disappear into space (har har); it goes to pay the people who work at the space ag
Re:Childhood dreams of Space become... (Score:2)
Re:NASA is a Decoy (Score:2)
A sad state of affairs indeed.
Re:NASA is a Decoy (Score:2)
Politically, you're probably right. We really should just cease all operations and abandon it, and push it into a safe re-entry to avoid unintended damage on earth. I can't see that happening any time soon, though.
Curiously, a similar rationale has taken shape regarding the Iraq invasion, and has been mocked recently in the Doonesbury [doonesbury.com] comic strip.
Re:New reality show: "The Astronaut" (Score:2)