Surviving Outsourcing? 234
An anonymous reader writes "As some of you may know, HP is negotiating with DPWN, parent company of DHL, to take on outsourced parts of DPWN's global IT Services business unit. As a worker in that business unit, I and my colleagues are part of what HP is negotiating for. I moved into my current position fresh out of university and so far haven't experienced corporate shake-ups or outsourcing initiatives. I enjoy my work and the opportunities that go with it, which is why this announcement was so distressing to me at first. Then I began hearing about the opportunities HP has internally. If you've been through a similar experience, what advice would you give for someone being outsourced? Should I 'ride the wave' and join the new company and culture, or dust off the old CV/resume?"
Based on my experience (Score:5, Informative)
I've been on one side or the other of 35 acquisitions. My experience is that the only people absolutely guaranteed of a job when it's all done are those who are have a written retention offer as an incentive to keep them in place and not bail prior to the merger closing. Many people will keep their jobs, some will lose them, and no one other than the aforementioned can be certain of either.
If you are uncomfortable with the uncertainty around your continued employment, then there are two options: live with that stress and all of the potential negatives and positives continued employment or sudden termination bring -OR- take your fate into your own hands and go in search of employment elsewhere ahead of time and on your own terms. No one can really tell you which is better, as you have to determine what your threshold for uncertainty and stress is.
I have known many people who have done both, and have had it work out better or worse for them. Some can handle the stress of uncertainty, some really can't. For those latter ones, taking the initiative to determine their own fate was far better for them health-wise. I have always stayed on through the acquisitions, and it has always worked out well for me personally.
One last word of advice I have for everyone I have ever worked with, for, or over: always keep your resume up to date! Don't wait until you are in fear of your job or suddenly terminated to get it out and "dust it off." Changing jobs is stressful, and this is one thing you can do in happier times to help see yourself through the rough ones. Also, it's great to update it with accomplishments when they are fresh in your mind.
I always encourage my employees and peers to get out their resumes and update them no less than yearly, but ideally as often as quarterly. At the successful completion of any large project, I let my teams know "that is resume-worthy, and these are the points you should include" and list the things I think they should be proud of accomplishing.
Don't let your resume get stale, or when you're out of a job it's one more roadblock to getting yourself back in the saddle.
Good luck with the acquisition, whatever you choose to do!
Enjoy (Score:4, Informative)
Just to be sure: Your company/department is being bought by HP, right? I don't how HP works at all, but it is my impression that they aren't all that bad; though, there was a rough patch some years back.
Some 5 years ago I was in a small, but successful company that was bought by Informatica - I'm still here, in case you wonder. I think for the first year or so we all hated it; we really felt like we were pariahs - part of that was our fault; we we resented the whole thing, for a large part because nobody asked our opinion, and I think we all felt rather betrayed. Since then we have worked out our differences, but it didn't happens automatically - management, from the very top, understood that there was a serious problem, and they have consistently tried to do all the right things and address the real problems (as opposed to just trying to look good).
It is very important to feel welcome in a new company, and to feel that you and the way you do things enjoy respect and are valuable. In the beginning I would have left, given half a chance; now I would be very reluctant to change job.
It is very important that feel confident in yourself if you stay in your new company - they have bought you guys because they believe in your product, but also because they believe in you guys. Where the problems can come in is when the lower to middle managers aren't willing to give an inch; they have more direct influence over your daily lives than upper management.
Not necessarily (Score:4, Informative)
"Remember a lot depends on how much you are willing to accept as a reduction in pay which ultimately will happen at some point."
Not necessarily. :)
Been through 2. First ended in a payoff and redundancy, the second resulted in more money as they realised how useful I can be when properly motivated
Opportunities in HP are fleeting ... (Score:2, Informative)
Even as you hear of opportunities in HP keep in mind that they too are constantly restructuring. One of their support centers in Colorado is moving to New Mexico and the current workers have essentially been told "move or find a new job" (and since they aren't being laid off there's "no package").
Also keep in mind that the Ann Livermore (Executive VP, Technology Solutions Group) has openly stated that her job is to outsource (in most cases this means offshore) as many of hp's jobs as quickly as possible. This is done to improve hp's bottom line but obviously impacts the displaced workers even more.
Make sure your parachute is packed well and ready for deployment.
Re:what should you do... (Score:4, Informative)
1) You should always have an up to date resume. Especially when there is some kind of "restructuring" going on.
2) You can do both. Try on the new company. If you don't like it, you can always leave. You can even spin it to new employers as "I stayed on to ensure a smooth transition" to make you look like a team player. This is a great way to get into a new company without having to wade through the throngs of HR drones trying to screen you out of new-hire interviews.
3) I collect job adverts from newspapers. I know this sounds dumb, who uses newspaper adverts to find personnel these days? well some employers do and I find it is useful to do this. Even if it is only to find out who in my locality is doing .Net, Java C/C++, Web development, App development, Embedded etc.... I also like to keep regular track of what is on offer at online job centers/forums even if I am not in danger of being laid off or thinking about moving, for much the same purpose. At the very least it results in me being able to target my job search more accurately.
Jumping ship before the move is kinda dumb -- as long as they don't make you sign anything ridiculous. It could be a much better place. Why would you leave when you don't have a reason to? What would you leave for? An unknown new company? Then you are no better off then where you are right now.
In my experience when a merger or a wholesale outsourcing happens, the PHBs/corporate-weasels running the transition will either lay off the entire complement of people employed by the 'victim' or they will pick and choose. They will keep the best employees from either side and lay off a whole bunch of others. Few things get a PHB more brownie points than saving personnel/wage costs for the company. The employees that will qualify for the great "...opportunities HP has internally..." are the best and most experienced ones except maybe if this happens during an economic boom period, then you may have a better chance if you are young and less experienced. If there is one thing new arrivals on the job market should learn quickly is that companies will demand loyalty and hard work from you but reserve the right to drop you from the payroll the instant it takes their fancy do pep up their quarterly profit returns by reducing costs. Get used to being stabbed in the back a lot, recover quickly and be prepared to find a new job even before it happens. Choosing carefully what jobs you take is important not only because of the wages you will get but also because of the experience you will get. They pay may be good but can you market that experience easily next time you are looking for a job? I know a few people who fell into the trap of considering only the money.
Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.
Re:India or Bust! (Score:4, Informative)
Not so much anymore. I work for a big company who a few years ago did a lot of off shoring (not outsourcing, they were employees of the company) to India. We learned a few lessons, including that it's not really the bargain management expected. There's good, there's bad, but it's no free lunch. Now Romania is the new India. I expect the outcome to be the same.
therapy (Score:1, Informative)
"I moved into my current position fresh out of university"
"I enjoy my work and the opportunities that go with it, "
in other words, you never had to deal with
reality? you seem to think somehow you will be guaranteed a job in 'the new company', as if you have a choice to stay or go.
the point of outsourcing is supposedly to reduce headcount and get rid of labor costs... ie, you. dust off your 'cv' no matter what. its like your lifeboat, think 'titanic'.
and go read dilbert books.
Depends on if you are the buyer or buyee (Score:2, Informative)
Opportunity knocks (Score:2, Informative)
Opportunities are born out of times like this - ride it out, keep a positive attitude and an open mind, look for new people to hook up with, expand your network to include people in the "new" company. You very likely will find yourself presented with a chance to do something new, without having to leave the company.
Been there, done that (Score:1, Informative)
I was in that exact position with HP and a large canadian financial institution about 5 years ago. It went pretty smoothly for some (including me) but not for everyone. The shift to HP's culture was a hit and there was many waves of layoff's.
Stick it out and see what happens. At the very least you can put "HP" (for whatever that is worth to you) on your resume.
Re:Been there - Survived that (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Been there - Survived that (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Why not try it? (Score:4, Informative)
Yeah... I wouldn't worry about finding a new job quite yet. As someone who's currently in the middle of an IT outsourcing to HP, I noticed that most folks have at least six months after the official announcement before they start laying people off.
That said, I wouldn't put too much faith in finding something on the HP internal job board. You'll soon have tens of thousands of EDS employees looking at those jobs as well.
Re:Except it rarely makes sense (Score:1, Informative)
From what i have seen at HP is that they already have a system where they can have low-knowledge ppl onsite (and get rid of a few from the site) and then throw in some of their consultants whenever they need. Also they have a "working" system of employee-resources from everything from salary to education. So what they are basically doing is just taking the production, reduce the local workstaff and then using the already existing staff within HP for anything a bit more advanced. (ie fire all the good guy's and keep the low salary ppl)
Re:I know the feeling. (Score:2, Informative)
Same here.
Our IT department was outsourced to HP several years ago. At the time I was glad I was not in the IT department, although I work mostly with IT things.
In the meanwhile my view has changed completely:
- the people who were outsourced have safe jobs at HP. Some changed to better jobs inside HP, others are still doing the same job.
- My own company has started moving everything offshore and laying off more and more people. No chance of any career or promotion any more.
- The people who stayed are now fighting for their jobs every day, while the people who were outsourced have safe jobs and can even move to other parts of HP.
If you are asking for advice:
- Don't Panic
- keep your CV up to date (this is always good)
- see what HP offers to you. Usually they pay the same, but raises and promotions may be handled differently.
- Quickly Switch to HP mentally: you should now do what is best for HP, not what is best for your old company.
- look for a career at HP: they will probably offer better opportunities than your current employer.
Get ready to move on! (Score:1, Informative)
Re:From my experience (Score:3, Informative)
Actually it has nothing to do with "logic". Fact is not all downsizings are for the express purpose of saving the business. A lot of companies simply need to improve stockholders portfolio entry valuations, and maybe changes in middle/upper management.
I have been through 5 companies in 5 years, and that the only reason they outsourced and downsized was to pay larger amounts of money to the upper management personnel and nothing else. Everyone there knew it, and saw it. The companies were healthy and doing a lot of business enough that it kept all of us very busy.
I learned through this to "follow the money". It's not always this way admittedly, but it's a larger percentage than many people will believe.
Re:India or Bust! (Score:2, Informative)
We love our Romania helpdesk, they actually speak understandable English there instead of "Indian English". The only problem is our current contract they are more expensive per call than the Indians, so only the Europeans get to use them all the time.