IT Internship In the US For a Foreigner? 298
grk writes "I am from Europe, studying Business Informatics. I have plenty of IT-related work experience (from my part-time job and summer jobs) ranging from Project Management and Software Planning to Programming. In the 5th semester my curriculum has scheduled an internship for February 2009 preceding bachelor examinations and bachelor thesis. It will last for about three months. I would like to do my internship in the US, but I do not know how to start. Is it common to send unsolicited applications to companies in the US? Try the big corporations? Should I go for an employment agency? Which ones to choose from? What about the pay? Where I come from it is common to pay only a fraction of what your work is actually worth if it's called an 'internship.' Does this apply to the US as well? Any other recommendations?"
Start with getting a visa (Score:4, Informative)
Unless you're a PhD student with a unique skillset, without authorization to work in the US you will not be able to get anywhere. It takes a lot of time, effort, and money for an employer to sponsor someone and it is highly unlikely any company will do that for a mere intern.
Generally internships with medium to large companies pay well, almost as much as an entry level full time employer. A small company or startup may not be able to afford that.
Re:Start with getting a visa (Score:5, Informative)
My experience (Score:3, Informative)
My school had mandatory co-ops (paid internships) in order to earn a bachelor's degree. In my experience, most companies paid interns between one half and two thirds the standard full time rate, after factoring in benefits. Without a degree or significant full time work experience, they rarely go higher.
On the other hand, it can be a great foot in the door if you do well; a company that may not have hired you full time under normal circumstances may be more favorably inclined if you demonstrate your skills in an internship. Many smaller companies won't hire new grads without a period of internship; they prefer to get a sense of your ability to contribute before committing to a full time offer.
check out IAESTE (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Start with getting a visa (Score:5, Informative)
In my experience (which was the reverse, trying to get an internship in the UK as an American citizen), unless you have an indefinite work visa for the country you are applying for, then forget it. Companies take on interns in order to scout out potential future employees. They are investing in you. Unless you are guaranteed to be able to work for them in the future, there's no reason to choose to invest in you rather than in one of the other dozens of applicants that can work for them in the future without visa hassles.
Microsoft (Score:3, Informative)
Microsoft is known to hire many interns every year and plenty of them are not US nationals... in fact I know a couple in Redmond right now who do not hold a us passport.
Obtaining a Visa (Score:2, Informative)
They have different programs that can get you a J Visa that you can work on for an internship. They also have a 'Work and Travel' program, which gives you more freedom in the jobs you can choose, but is limited to the summer.
Re:Start with getting a visa (Score:3, Informative)
Even as a PhD student with a unique skillset, you need authorization to work in the US :)
The big companies that I have done internships with (Microsoft, soon Google) have official ways of applying online for such jobs. Applications are usually accepted year-round, but there is obviously more interest for summer internships. It's possible that emailing directly will help too: 3 out of 4 internships that I've done so far were obtained this way.
Once accepted, the company will usually get you the required papers in order to work in the US (typically a DS-2019 in order to get a J-1 'exchange' visa, which you will need unless you're Canadian). Btw, formally, it's not the company that sponsors you, but some other organization, with which the company might have a special relationship (why they're doing things like that in the US is beyond me).
Unlike other countries (Germany, I am looking at you), my impression in that US internships in CS/IT are well paid. MS and Google pay VERY competitive salaries to their interns, on par with what beginning full-time employees get (minus benefits such as health insurance) + moving expenses and stuff like that. I am assuming that similar companies pay similar salaries.
Bottom line: apply early, to at least a few companies, look out for special internship application forms on the website and don't worry too much about the visa unless the company specifically says on their website that they won't bother.
Re:check out IAESTE (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Subject (Score:3, Informative)
Do you even work in tech? There are no unpaid internships here, except *maybe* in gaming. Internships in this industry pay better than starting salaries in many fields (teaching comes to mind). While you probably don't want to negotiate hard for better money, you'll always be paid decently as an intern- they want you to come on full time when you graduate.
Re:I'm guessing... (Score:5, Informative)
This advice is specific to silicon valley.
We hire interns as we would any other position (other than lowering the ar on the entry criteria), though we mostly look at Masters students. We expect unsolicited resumes, as we would with any position. We of course support students with the correct student visas (we didn't have a single American citizen apply for an internship last year - no joke), though the transition from intern to full-time employee if things go well can involve a month or two of not working because of said visa hassles.
We pay interns fairly. Not Google/Microsoft well (no one matches them), but our interns are effectively a paygrade lower than new college hires, and being hourly the benefits are minimal. It's the bottom of the payscale, but it's certainly not "work for free" or half pay or anything like that.
Re:I'm guessing... (Score:5, Informative)
I should add that our interns were foreigners who were studying in America, so they already had student visas. Immigration law for students working is complicated, but any Silly Valley company with an internship program has a legal staff to handle this - you have to, as the pool of American citizens is too small to recruit from here (almost non-existant in Masters programs).
Re:I'm guessing... (Score:5, Informative)
I have to agree here. It is going to be tough for you to get a visa to work in the US for such a short period.
If your lucky, you might be able to get a J-1 visa but that does require sponsorship which your unlikely to get unless you have a 'friend' in a company willing to go through the process.
If you are British I would personally recommend you get a Working Holiday visa and go to Australia, Canada or Japan. The process to get such visa's is trivial.
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PS. I did this in reverse (to Europe from Canada) and it was an excellent experience both socially ;-) and professionally.
Re:Start with getting a visa (Score:5, Informative)
Of course there are visas available, my point is his first step should be to get one. No company will want to spend any time looking at you if you don't already have work authorization.
Wrong. The J-1 visa requires already having a sponsor, so you cannot get the visa and then try to fish for an internship, you need to have the internship first, then get the visa(which is usually just a formality, although it can take a bit of time).
Because the visa is limited in duration and you have to return to your home country after the visa ends --- although you can travel in the US for 30 days after, IIRC --- the bar to getting one isn't as high as the other types of visas.
Re:check out IAESTE (Score:3, Informative)
IAESTE is the way to go. Talk to your international students office or similar, there are people there who know how these things work, what kind of support you might be able to get to cover your costs, etc.
Companies won't want to go through the hassle of getting the visa for you for an internship, they only do that for people they hire in fixed positions (and then only for people who are worth it). People are beating down their doors for internships, there is not shortage of potential interns.
Re:check out IAESTE (Score:3, Informative)
Re:check out IAESTE (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Slow news day? (Score:3, Informative)
http://jobs.slashdot.org/ [slashdot.org]
as for the personals. Just pretend to be a girl and you'll get mail all by itself. From the 1% that isn't too shy to mail a girl, that is.
on-topic: just talk to your favorite professors. It's the most likely way to succeed, especially when they already have contacts to US companies. If you want to figure it out all by yourself, then, well, good luck with that.
My Experience (Score:3, Informative)
I'm a Canadian going to a university in Canada which routinely sends 100+ students per term (4 months) to the US for internships/co-ops. I'm returning for my 3rd term with a US company in just under two weeks actually.
Disclaimer: things might be different from where you are due to agreements between countries.
Basically, the process for me has gone as follows: 1) Apply to US company intern positions 2) Get an offer after an interview 3) Start visa application process (J-1 visa).
The visa application can't start until you already have a job offer, and requires your company to submit a training plan to the visa sponsor (CDS International [cdsintl.org], for example) in order to issue the DS-2019 form. The visa sponsor is chosen by the host company. Since I'm Canadian, I bring this form to the border/airport with me, answer a few questions in immigration, and get my visa stamped in my passport.
Most large corporations will have done this before, and it's just another part of the routine.
The application process itself is relatively simple, with online forms that you need to fill out plus scanning some information. You will probably need to meet with a representative from your visa sponsor for an interview as well.
Visas are relatively inexpensive compared to salary. Companies that want to recruit the best employees in the world will pay the extra visa money, especially for an internship. It's not very expensive ($650 + a couple hundred in fees IIRC)
Re:Start with getting a visa (Score:2, Informative)
Unless things have changed very recently, Canadians also need a J-1 visa unless you are a professional covered by NAFTA. If you qualify under NAFTA, you're probably not looking for an internship.
Re:Canada (Score:4, Informative)
Because we have cheap universal health care, a strong economy, a low crime rate, everyone isn't armed to the teeth or carrying a concealed weapon, we aren't the perceived and hated enemy of most of the third world, our dollar is worth more than yours (although only marginally so), and generally we are a very likable and polite society? Because while we have an asshole in power at the moment (Prime Minister Stephen Harper) at least he isn't a complete criminal who should be impeached for violating his country's laws and his inauguration oath (as I see a lot of people claiming of GB Jr south of the border)? Because we don't have a DHS that is absolutely paranoid and prone to abuse its authority when you pass through the airport? Because in a National Geographic survey of the best and worst places to live (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/11/photogalleries/country-pictures/index.html?email=Places14Dec07) we ranked 4th in the world after Iceland, Norway, Australia, and the US ranked 12th(having dropped from 8th place in 2006)?
As well its worth noting we are our own independent country, and quite proud of it even if we don't shout it out loud the way many US citizens seem to do, so calling us "America Jr" is a shallow and meaningless insult. Canadians are very aware of how distinct we are from the US, and quite conscious of how pervading an influence US culture can be in overwhelming what makes us Canadian, but few if any consider that influence to be a good thing. The US has nothing to offer us that we don't already have.
Re:I'm guessing... (Score:5, Informative)
My company wrote a "letter of support" to the university, guaranteeing a grad student level stipend, the university send out the I-20, the student took that to the embassy, done.
Re:What again!? (Score:2, Informative)
The British Empire is still good for a thing or two, you know.
Re:I'm guessing... (Score:2, Informative)
The company gets a huge tax break for any worker they bring in for an internship, and they can write off the visa expense.
It also depends on the country of origin. I'm from Canada, and my visa cost $56
Re:Start with getting a visa (Score:3, Informative)
Canadians do not need a J-1 visa, just a 'J-1 visa status'. Basically, you need to get a DS-2019 (+some other documents) at the port of entry and you'll get the J-1 visa status automatically, without ever having to go to a US consulate to get a visa stamped. Everybody else does the latter.
Re:I'm guessing... (Score:2, Informative)
I'm from Canada, and my visa cost $56
My visa was over USD1000, you insensitive clod! Seriously, I am a professor in Brazil and my visa had expired. I could go to the embassy in Rio, where they would take something like 6 months to interview me. I had a conference I wanted to go, so I jump on a plane and fly across half of Brazil to get a visa in Brasilia, where it takes a day. Total cost, 120USD for tourist and business visa, 900USD for ticket, and 130USD for the hotel stay. Seriously, there are few people who would bother. This thing has SERIOUS long term implications for America. (Oh, by America I mean only the US).
Re:I'm guessing... (Score:3, Informative)
Even being legal doesn't protect you... (Score:5, Informative)
I am sure a college educated English speaker would be protected from any embarrassing questions about their legal status in those towns, right?
I don't know. As a completely legal foreigner I was certainly never exempt from being treated like someone trying to enter the country illegally everytime I crossed the border or dealth with the authorities (although I did once have trouble trying to persuade one idiot NOT to register me for voting when getting a US drivers license!).
While a certain level of caution is excuseable I used to find that they would regularly deliberately misconstrue whatever you say in the most convoluted and tortuous fashion possible in order to make you sound suspicious e.g. on returning to a visit to Niagara Falls a few months after just arrived in the US on a J1 visa they asked "what do you intend to do when the visa expires?" to which I replied "I don't know, I have not thought that far ahead - I have only just started my job here". Bad idea: apparently this is code for "I plan to remain the US, thumb my nose at your laws and be an evil foreign bastard" - and this was BEFORE the terrorist attacks. Apparently the "correct" response was "I will immediately leave and make no plans to return".
The sad thing was that at the time that was not at all true...but after several years of being treated as persona non grata US immigration moved me around to their way of "thinking" so to say.
Re:Don't bother with the paperwork (Score:5, Informative)
Sure, you can get a job mowing lawns or cleaning houses if you want to work in the US illegally, but don't expect a software company of any reputation to hire you with no paperwork.
Why do you want to work in the U.S.? (Score:5, Informative)
Work in the U.S. sucks. In many cases companies will offer you 2-3 weeks off on start. That's it. Yeah, they may attract you with a flashy salary, but then you'll have to pay for benefits, insurance, etc. and you're an at-will employee. Means that an employer can dismiss your ass w/o any reason. There is no such thing as taking 3 weeks of vacation at a time and then having 2 more weeks left over. Oh, and judging by the latest stats our European friends are just as productive as us, so I really doubt that you'll benefit from knowing how Americans do it here.
Silicon Valley may be a flashy name, but you must check your brains before moving there (trust me, I am a local). As a young person you probably want to meet young interesting people in nice social settings. Well, this is definitely not the place. The area is too expensive to live if you're young and there are not too many colleges around. Meeting chicks, especially the ones who are ready to party (if you know what I mean), is hard. So if you want to have some fun, SF area is not for you. Try Boston, Seattle or something more hip and less Indian than the Valley. Sorry if I offended anybody, but that's the truth. Also, every metro area is going to be expensive for somebody who is an intern. You must find roommates and have some stash of cash just to move in (first + last month of rent and a security deposit). You may try something in North Carolina's scientific triangle. It is more affordable and I hear that the quality of life is awesome compared to Silicon Valley.
If I were you, I would forget about moving to the U.S. Try to find a company that employes people who are passionate about technology and you'll learn a lot more than by working for a large company (in the U.S.) where your intern position will be one step above bean counting (if you are lucky). European countries are heavy on the next big things like eco technology, alternative sources of fuels, etc. This is where you would like to be. Just because you have a degree in IT, it does not mean that you can start working in a different industry. Judging by the articles that I read, places like Norway kick butt when it comes to leaping into the future. Finally, if you want to do something totally outrageous, see if you can go to a place like India to work there. As a Westerner who has worked in South Asia in the past, I can tell you that it is nothing like you have experienced in the past. Good luck.
Re:I'm guessing... (Score:3, Informative)
I don't think so. The company gets to deduct the salary and other expenses, just like any other employee, but the companies I have worked for never got anything special for hiring interns that I knew about, and I was in management.
Re:I am a professor in Brazil and my visa had expi (Score:4, Informative)
Consider Ireland (Score:3, Informative)
If I was you I would consider Ireland: no problems with immigration, real possibility of getting a job there with a good pay.
There you could practice your english and make a foreign experience while holding all of your "citizen status", you could stay there as long as you want and you can move back and forward in case.
An other option would be Spain, which is growing fast and is a nice place as well for young people.
Re:I'm guessing... (Score:2, Informative)
Re:What again!? (Score:1, Informative)
"I'd say the important question for someone applying for a Canadian visa is "which forms do I fill out?""
This is utter horse shiznod. I studied in Canada and am familiar with quite a bit of their immigration policies and they are not as lax as all the Canadians in this forum seem to be putting them.
To qualify for a working visa you are required to meet various criteria (education, language - understandable, work experience, etc). Less stringent than applying for an H1B outside the States but nevertheless its still not as plain cut.
Furthermore you will be surprised to find out that it was much easier for my sister to get a study permit for the US (she now lives and works in Wisc) than it was for me to get a Canadian Study Permit. I waited 3 times longer than she had to wait, I had to go through twice as many medical tests and the interview people asked the dumbest questions of my intentions of studying there.
This despite that the job opportunities are rosier in the States and it has a larger scale economy.
Re:I'm guessing... (Score:2, Informative)
No wonder American students are getting less and less competitive. They sit around expecting people to hand them jobs. Then when they can't find them, they blame the companies and college recruiters for discrimination and incompetence!
Back to the OP, I think it would be highly unlikely for a foreign student not studying in the US to get an internship here. Not to mention if you wanted to start in Feb, it's a bit late now because it takes a long time to process the visa.
Re:Don't bother with the paperwork (Score:3, Informative)
It's easy enough to buy a fake social security card with a valid number, and that's all the proof employers are required to ask for. Illegals in my neck of the woods (Silicon Valley) often hold down fairly responsible jobs. There was an incident a few months ago in which a child was killed in a traffic accident. The driver's biggest headache was not her liability (not clear that it was her fault) but that she was undocumented. Now, this was not some Spanish-only immigrant driving from a communal flophouse to her house cleaning job. This was a fluently bilingual suburban housewife driving to her office job in her SUV.
That said, I'd hardly recommend this route for somebody who just wants to do a 3-month internship in a professional capacity. The safety and legal risks are huge. For somebody fleeing poverty or violence in Latin America, the risks might be worth it (and the necessary connections easier to make). But for a software person? Forget it. Not too much chance of doing jail time (though perhaps they'd want to make an example of somebody who came here to do professional work), but you could end up barred from entering the U.S. again, ever.
Mod parent up (Score:3, Informative)
My employer has direct contact with several of the universities in the area (Boston). I recently (~two months ago) interviewed a handful of candidates and ended up hiring two. We only go through universities for finding candidates for our internship programs; we don't accept unsolicited résumés.
After working closely with one of these interns, I completed an evaluation for consideration as a full-time employee.