Are Software Developers Naturally Weird? 579
jammag writes "Well, c'mon, yes — let's admit it. As a veteran coder discusses as he looks at his career, software development is brimming with the offbeat, the quirky and the downright odd. As he remembers, there was the 'Software Lyrics' guy and the 'Inappropriate Phone Call' programmer, among others. Are unique types drawn to the profession, or are we 'transformed over time by our darkened working environments and exposure to computer screen radiation?'"
Less pressure to conform? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:4, Interesting)
Less social skills may translate to less social inhibitions in this case.
From my working experience with both programmers and other non-technical office personal, they're all equally weird, irrational and silly.
Even 60 year old men and women are as childish and immature by nature as they were when they were 10, they've only got 50 more years experience in dealing with it.
Yes! (Score:4, Interesting)
And some organizations do not put up with behavior at all that was mentioned in the article. A more professional manager would have a much different team an wouldn't have had the problem he had.
No, not that wierd (Score:5, Interesting)
If you think software developers are weird, you're not getting out enough.
Commission salespeople and futures traders are much weirder. Some CEOs are weird. Low-end rock musicians are weird. (Above the "club band" level, some sanity tends to emerge, or at least the self-destructive ones are filtered out.) Strippers are weird. Successful high-end call girls, though, tend to be chillingly sane when not in their work personas.
be thankful for HR... (Score:5, Interesting)
I usually find the HR department to be pain in the ass, but there are times when they are indispensable. When I first started working, I was managing a team of fresh college graduates. They all went out together after work one Friday for "movie night." The next week, one of the women who worked for me came to my office very upset. Turns out that after movie night, she'd gone to a bar with her fellow team members, then taken him back to her place and had sex. She was worried about pregnancy and disease because the sex had been unprotected. She was also upset that he was "being cold to [her]" the first day back in the office. At that point, I just said, "this is a topic for our HR department" and walked her and her "movie night buddy" to the office of the HR rep for our area. The resolution was to have one of them volunteer to be transferred to another area, but there was subsequent drama anyway. Social ineptitude coupled with inexperience and raging hormones is an unusually bad combination.
I also worked with a programmer who cursed worse than a sailor and "adjusted himself" more frequently than an entire team of baseball players. We used to take bets on how many times he would grab his crotch during a conversation, and if the meeting was all guys, we'd all adjust ourselves for laughs and to see if he'd pick up on it--he was completely oblivious. For whatever reason it went on for years without anyone ever doing anything about it. On the cursing part, he did eventually get called in to HR and scolded for his language, to which I am told his exact response was "Holy shit, I'm so fucking sorry." He still kept his job, though.
Re:Asperger's syndrome. (Score:5, Interesting)
In that respect, neither handedness nor syndromes seems to have any relevance.
Pedantic (Score:5, Interesting)
I think most people who are detailed oriented are considered eccentric. Good businesspeople, programmers, chefs, military strategists, and anyone who has to have things a certain way are considered weird.
Programmers just happen to be more detail oriented than most everyone else. One character in a program with hundreds of thousands is the difference between having something that compiles and something that doesn't. It takes a certain type of personality to accept this as part of the job description.
There are certain people who have it worse - civil engineers and doctors, for example. Once they have computed a load or prescribed a treatment, there is no way to edit and rebuild.
Re:Talk about slow news day (Score:3, Interesting)
While I do think this is a big part of the story - that people just think they themselves are weirder than other people, it would make sense that software developers are weirder than other professions. My impression of coders are that the people who get sucked into that field or that profession tend to dislike regular, non-internet social interaction than other people. Compound that with a profession that requires less social interaction than other professions and people will start acting how they want. I get the feeling that if you apply for a job in sales or human resources with most companies, they don't want to hear about the giant kit-kat bar you made last weekend.
That said, the three examples the article gave aren't very weird at all. The first person just seems to have a sense of humor, the second guy liked to talk, and the third person... well she was just stupid. There are a lot of stupid people in the world, in any profession.
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:3, Interesting)
Let's take this one step further
Everyone you know and everyone you will ever meet, are neurotic, to one degree or another
Once you understand this, then daily life interacting with others in the sand box becomes much easier .. d:/
Geeks are no different. We're just smarter than most others, or at least we like to think so
Yes. Computers are unnatural. (Score:5, Interesting)
Yes. Computing is warping our minds.
Computers are just so damn logical, working with them is completely removed from normal everyday life. It's well known that people anthropomorphize computers in order to deal with them in our own frame of reference, but conversely we also mentally shift our thinking into a logical form which we aren't evolved to deal with, so that we can work effectively with computers. The more closely you work with computers, the more this will affect you.
I don't think this is a new thing though. Mathematicians and people working in hard sciences have certainly faced the same sort of thing. For example, many early scientists (eg. Galileo) have faced persecution because they have found a mode of thinking that "normal" people have found objectionable.
It'll only get worse as technology progresses.
Re:Talk about slow news day (Score:5, Interesting)
Here's a tip: everybody loves to think they're unique and "weird." The most conventional, boring, person you know is going to describe how wacky their party was if you ask.
If you read the article, you'll see that this isn't what this is all about. The "song lyrics developer" placed song lyrics in the comments of his code. That was apparently "distracting" to QA, so managed had a talk with him. They asked him why he did it, he said that when he was writing boring code, that made it more exciting, so they came to an "agreement" where he'd stop commenting the code with lyrics and in exchange, he'd be allowed "to pursue more interesting side projects."
In other words, management thought that they exchanged the extra 15 seconds it takes every time he writes one of those lyrics comments to get him to do more work for them in the form of "interesting side-projects." Poor dude agreed because he likely felt his job was threatened, and what they actually did was make him less productive because he's no longer as happy in his work.
Now, it wasn't even a problem of offensive curse words in comments, which is quite common. He was just peppering the code with random lyrics. Any company with management that makes things THAT strict is making the work environment a serious pain, and it's not someplace I'd work at. I suspect that guy also started submitting resumes to other places and just agreed to compromise until he could find a better job.
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:5, Interesting)
Exactly. What do you define as "weird"?
The question if something is $absolutePointXOnAbsoluteAxisY can only come from someone, who does not realize, that everything in this universe is relative. Especially things like "weirdness". And twice so. Because 1. your own view of what is weird, is defined relative to your own position ("That's weirder than me, so I'll call it 'weird'."), and 2. your own position is also only definable through other relative positions. ("How weird are you?" will always be answered with something like "Well, less than that crazy guy. But more than that no-fun loser there.")
Additionally, I don't think weirdness is ever reducible to one axis, and so it's also a multi-factor value (aka. multi-dimensional vector), where things like weighting them based on their orthogonality to get to the magnitude, come into play. (In other words: What factors make someone weird for you, and how important are those factors?)
The thing is, that the importance of that question is dependent on your own self-confidence. :)
Basically, if you know you're cool and fun and all, then even if someone calls you "weird" you will say "Nah, you're just no fun.", not even trying to defend yourself. (For what? He is wrong, not you.
And if you are insecure and think you are a loser and a weirdo, you will believe them. You will most likely even act according to your expectations of yourself. Expect yourself to fail in harmonizing with others. (Harmony [the "rhythm"] is an essential factor in social groups. I love playing it like an instrument, when I'm able to.)
For all positions between those extremes, of course the result is something in the middle.
Sadly, most software developers grew up, thinking that it's somehow "uncool" to be able to create all those wonderful programs with their elegance. That social incompetence is to be expected when one "hangs in front of his computer all the time".
Seriously? Who says that? Have you ever checked? Has anyone ever checked? Are those who checked even competent to check it? Or is it all just a false social conditioning, based on prejudice and exclusion of the unknown, like with children in school? Something that still dominates your life right now, by making you insecure *for no freakin' reason at all*.
[optional part]
I was like that. EXACTLY like that. Worst of the kind. I had a huge fear to even *talk* to girls until I was 20+. Seriously! :D
But as you might know, you will feel like wanting to die when you live like that. Luckily I realized, that all those social rules where just made up. My definitions of what I am were just made up. I could change them, and become whatever I wanted.
And, oh fuck did I change!
I just decided, that from now on, I know what is how, have my own set of values, and define myself and what I am. Then I worked to get to that point.
And now I literally can't program, when I did not go out, and had fun, socializing and stuff. And when I'm out, I am not in the corner, in fear that someone could laugh at "that weird dork there". No, I'm in the freakin' center! :)
I have no idea why, as I'm not thinking that I'm someone especially great or something, but people somehow love me now. I get drinks for free, people applauding me, and girls looking at me with glowing eyes. But I have no idea why?? Hell, there are so many better looking, cooler and richer guys in the same room! But hey... Not that I don't like it.
And the best thing: Now that I have it, I don't feel any urge to try to get it anymore. It has become almost an afterthought.
[/optional part]
Conclusion: No. Software development does NOT make you weird. Not in any known universe! Insecurity, and a environment full of prejudice, since early childhood, make you weird.
I'm a software developer / game designer and I am also according to others one of the "coolest guys they know". (Again, I myself am never trying to place myself above someone.)
I see no reason why this should not also be true for anyone else on this site!
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:5, Interesting)
Software types are more analytical, (either as a result or as an cause of them being in their field). As such they see things that Joe Random doesn't even notice.
When the waitress says "If you need anything else, my name is Betty" Joe Random grunts and takes a bite of his meal. Programmer dude wonders what her name is if he doesn't need any thing else.
When the reporter says "For CNN, I'm Wolf Blitzer", programmer dude shouts at the TV demanding to know who the reporter is when he dons his lederhosen and cowboy hat and goes dancing.
Ouch, that hurts to think about, I'll stop now.
Computer types are so used to thinking about eventualities, undesirable consequences, dangling IF conditions, and protecting against them that they fall into doing so in personal life as well. A simple, carelessly worded question in normal conversation can render them speechless while the gears grind.
Actions or behavior without negative consequences may lead to new discovery, and therefore need not be avoided. Being a little weird may be a calculated strategy to see if those around them are hopelessly hidebound.
Developers... (Score:5, Interesting)
I don't have much respect for developers.
I am a simple laborer who couldn't afford higher education, but I have my geeky things, specially related to videogame design.
One day, I reunited enough will to combine my work with making a game of my own. It's still in early alpha but it's doing alright.
Thing is...knowing I have no full education background, I dealed with C and OpenGL and their quirky things (pathetic string support, stupid color handling requiring to learn GLSL to do something worthy, respectively), all by myself. This is not specially impressive, but I didn't do by choice. I had to learn the same way with art/pixel art/animation and sound/music as well as general technique to achieve effects. It wasn't difficult to learn to do the media, but the code is not as straightforward. So I tried looking for help around in order to do some specific things that were hard.
Every single programming question I deployed on the net was received with an elitist disregard, sending me to read tons of papers and stuff I don't really have an use for, specially because even if I try I can't understand it. They assume you have high education in MIT and you had to start from mainframes like they did or something. This is specially true on the IRC channel #opengl, where everyone seems to be too elite to deal with n00bs and giving incredibly obfuscated replies generally being more of a "don't bother me you fucking ignorant n00b".
Unfortunately I don't know anyone else who codes around me (this country is not specially literate on IT), since most of my people are laborers like me who'd rather watch TV and get drunk instead of venturing into a coding project. And I can't blame them because unless you reinvent the wheel infinitely you are doomed to be inferior to the top dogs there. They limit knowledge sharing with their arrogant and "I am better than you" attitude, and it's sickening.
There would be far more indie games and open stuff if they weren't so stubbornly elitist and shared that knowledge because it's going to die when they do otherwise.
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:5, Interesting)
Well said. I think geeks place more value in how they feel about themselves, rather than how others feel about them. Ask a random hundred what's more important to them, "how you feel about yourself" or "how others view you", see what answers you get. You could probably pick out most of the geeks real quick with just that.
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:5, Interesting)
There is a "normal". Its is not however, a statistical result. Rather it is closer to a Platonic ideal, an archetypical state of being that all aspire to, yet few if any achieve. Intelligent, sophisticated, gregarious, athletic, witty, educated, admired, adventurous, wise, inspirational, a pillar of society; in short everything the Modern Major General should be.
When people say "normal", what they really mean is "ideal". "Why can't I/you be more normal?!", really means "Why can't I/you be closer to perfection!!". The concepts of individuality and uniqueness is for most people, platitudes. In reality, they strive for unreasonable goals and live in perpetual disappointment with their own and others "shortcomings".
Our industrial society, saturated as it is with millions of identical items, widgets and products, cannot really accept habits or traits that fall outside the norm. Witness the rise of "disorders" like Aspergers or ADHD; habits and attitudes which cannot be accepted as a normal part of the human condition, and which must be medicated to bring them closer to the ideal or "normal". If you do not conform to the tolerances specified by what is seen on television, cinema or in the New Yorker magazine, you are a defective widget and must be either corrected or replaced.
Some programmers have traits or habits not usually seen in the general populace. Invariably you will find that the problem is rarely these traits in and of themselves, but rather the discomfort of others who when faced with such deviations from the norm actually become offended and will seek redress. For a long time, our society catered to this outrage and imposed conformity towards the contemporary ideal. Happily we've stopped doing this, and we're all better off because of it. However, there remain many who can become visibly distressed whenever the world does not agree with their own conceptions. Often they will fight to change the world rather than change their minds.
The truth is we are all individuals. And the real truth is that this is more than just a platitude.
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:2, Interesting)
I don't buy the whole non-socialization argument.
All the freaks I've met in the IT business know exactly how to project the image they want to project.
They just don't care, or sometimes actively intend to be controversial, hostile or otherwise unpleasant.
In fact, it's probably part of the guild's unwritten rules. "Act like a geek to keep the non geeks out." And it works. The non-geeks are not interested in the things geeks know and can do, just the same as the "unsocialized jocks" keep the geeks out of their private club or any other identity group.
"Are software developers naturally weird?" (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:1, Interesting)
I don't buy the whole non-socialization argument.
All the freaks I've met in the IT business know exactly how to project the image they want to project.
They just don't care, or sometimes actively intend to be controversial, hostile or otherwise unpleasant.
How do you know?
I worked with a guy last year. At lunchtime he'd wander off somewhere alone. After work he'd never come to the pub, the only time he did was on his last day. Ask him what he'd done at the weekend, "oh, chilled out, watched TV, played Warcraft, not much". He was 21 and doing a 12-month placement, shouldn't he be making the most of finally earning some money? The other placement students did (IT or otherwise).
Also, he was overweight and sometimes smelled bad.
Re:Asperger's syndrome. (Score:3, Interesting)
No, actually some of us make time for computer work, a social life, and Humans vs Zombies.
song lyrics weird?? (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:3, Interesting)
My tiny company makes money through outstanding engineering, both software and chip design. Our software algorithms geeks (self included) are not normal people. When I hire for this position, I'm looking for a personality disorder which causes otherwise bright intelligent outgoing people to be happy in dark corners hacking out brilliant solutions to problems few people will ever hear about. The trick is finding such people who can still work in a team environment.
So, normal software developers are not weird. They do simple things, like subclassing windows and putting together trees of data structures. But... the few who can do magic under the hood - yes, those guys are just a bit different.
Here's the lesson I learned from your post (Score:5, Interesting)
if the meeting was all guys, we'd all adjust ourselves for laughs and to see if he'd pick up on it--he was completely oblivious. For whatever reason it went on for years without anyone ever doing anything about it. On the cursing part, he did eventually get called in to HR and scolded for his language, to which I am told his exact response was "Holy shit, I'm so fucking sorry." He still kept his job, though.
Here's the lesson I learned from your post: some people are willing to change, they just need someone to tell them how they should change. They might even be grateful that you've helped them change for the better.
Now, ask yourself: whenever you find people you'd like to change, do you want to risk them never changing by not asking? How does that weigh against the risk of them being offended by you asking?
Experts everywhere are bound to be weird... (Score:3, Interesting)
You are "weird" if some narrow pursuit makes up the majority of your life. Be it programming, stamp collecting, keeping up with fashion, or memorizing baseball statistics. It naturally makes your interests rather narrow and much too extreme for average people to understand.
The non-weird people are those with a well-rounded life, and (generally) moderate or mediocre marketable skills (if any). I know plenty of normal people who make minimum wage... Very few (though some) who are in the top 5%.
And besides, we sysadmins are much more normal than you programmers (freaks!).
imagination--deep concentration (Score:2, Interesting)
I'm not a programmer, I'm a mathematician, but I notice the same thing in my field.
To those who say there is not a tendency toward weirdness in mathematical disciplines, I suggest the following experiment. First go to the weekly math colloquium at a local research university. Then, go to the weekly philosophy colloquium and see if you can discern a difference in the people who come. I believe you will almost certainly find that the mathematicians are less attractive and charismatic. You could argue that philosophy simply selects for attractiveness and charisma, but I believe you will have similar findings if many different subjects are substituted for phil.
To those who say that the strangeness of programmers is somehow reducible to various qualities of "geeks", this is clearly begging the question, as any good geek should know. The topic for this thread is very similar to asking "why are geeks the way they are?" but phrased differently.
I have spent large amounts of time wondering why mathematicians are weird, ugly, uncharismatic and so forth. My answer is that they live largely in their own imaginations, and spend correspondingly less time in the "real world." Therefore, not surprisingly, their real world appearance, manners etc gives evidence of a lack of attention. Conversely people in other fields are not selected for an ability to concentrate deeply, spend more time in the here and now, and reap consequent benefits in hygiene, social skills, etc.
The age of weird programmers is coming to and end (Score:2, Interesting)
It's the kind of memory programmers have... (Score:4, Interesting)
In order to be a good programmer, one has to have a very good memory for trivia. Why do you think Ken Jennings, a programmer, was the best Jeopardy contestant of all time? Computer systems and APIs are so complicated that if one cannot remember a good chunk of the APIs and how trivia about how parts of the systems work, it can be difficult to get anything done.
Having a good memory for trivia makes it easy to see all kinds of connections among things in non-programming life, namely in culture, or in day-to-day life in general. This usually leads to a special kind of creativity in which one brings together one's own set of personal behaviors from tying things together instead of just following a template that society provides for us. For instance, instead of trying to imitate the confident corporate person they see on TV, a programmer will choose their outfit based on utility and comfort, pulling together shoes, pants, gadgets, etc, based on utility and comfort.
Why I like programmers... (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:3, Interesting)
It's not about answering the question you want to answer. It's about answering the question the asker really wanted to ask but didn't have the knowledge to do so.
User: "How do I edit my Windows registry?"
Me[knowing how someone who doesn't know what they're doing can wreck a Windows machine that way]: "Why do you want to know?"
User: "I need to get my printer working."
Me: "Oh. You probably just need to get the driver you need installed. Here's how you do that..."
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:1, Interesting)
"I usually tell them what the right question is and then the answer for it."
Then applying that principle to this question of "Are Software Developers Naturally Weird?" ... the right question becomes, why do some people highlight others as Weird", while most other people simply accept the behaviors of others, even if others behave differently from them. Also why do some people seek to highlight weird in a derogatory way. What do they gain out of portraying others being bad and wrong for being weird?
The answer is the people who repeatedly highlight others as weird, and then seek to publicly condemn them for being weird, are themselves demonstrating a common tactic used by people with a Histrionic Personality Disorder. Histrionic people seek attention, often relentlessly. Their behavior is the result of a lack of parental attention, (in more extreme cases outright parental neglect while growing up). The child grows up into someone intensely aware of the attention of others and they seek to become the center of attention to make up for that parental lack of attention whilst growing up, which is an insecure feeling they always carry with them (but often try to hide). They become very good at acting in their daily lives to gain the attention of others. They are also accutely aware of anything which gives them extra attention. For example, the fashion industry and show business both have a lot of Histrionic people. (Histrionic people are very attracted to these industries and they are very good at seeking attention). (Its also why you can get tantrum's from them and even at times, the more extreme ones behave with a general prima donna behaviour, thats all part of gaining the attention of others). The media are also dominated by Histrionic people because they seek attention through their work and they then hold the most attention seeking people up as role models, which they are to people who seek attention. They want to be like the best attention seekers.
So the question of why do some people highlight others as weird", is answered simply by the fact that some people seek attention and any attempt to seek attention is also the act of seeking to deprive others of attention. So anyone behaving "Weird" naturally has a higher tendency to gain the attention of others and Histrionic people feel threatened by this behavior, so they seek to put them down and make them a laughing stock, whilst simultaneously becoming the loud ring leader gaining the center of attention while they condemn their victim. Its a win win move for a Histrionic. (It is this inherently hostile putting down of others that makes them over time very harmful to others around them. They can destroy some peoples self esteem ... until they learn to see through the Histrionic's behavior).
Collective histrionic behavior twists social views in many ways and as they seek to gain high positions of visibility in society, that inherently give them considerable influential in society. For example on television, in magazines, many work in the media, and hold up these famous attention seekers as the important people to be seen as role models. They are role models to histrionic people as they gain the most attention, but their deeply troubled behavior behind their glossy image they try to show, highlights just how mixed up they are in their minds. Histrionic people can't cope with quite moments. If they are stuck in hours of silence with no chance of attention, many can't cope and seek to suppress their lack of attention with drink and even drugs. The more extreme the personality disorder the more they seek to suppress their thoughts and memories.
Ironically the entire fashion industry is also driven by this behavior, because Histrionic people seek to lead fashion, so they label some clothes as unfashionable, whilst labeling the latest clothes as the only things to wear, until everyone is wearing them, then they seek to label this as out of fashion so they again can be seen as the tend setters.
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:3, Interesting)
How hard is it for you to be a charitable person and not get mad at them for innocently correcting a bad question?
As I've said in a number of sibling posts, I'm a librarian, I get bad questions all the time. However, none are wrong. People are giving me the information they have so that I can supply the answer, sure clarify dig below the surface to get what the person wants, even ask questions of your own, but never tell someone they are asking the wrong question or the get annoyed and you end up being unable to help, and string a confrontation.
Re:No, there are not (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:3, Interesting)
Having met people who have Aspergers or ADHD I'm quite happy with both conditions being classed as disorders. Someone with ADHD will do anything to get the attention of others and can't bear being out of the spotlight for 5 seconds. By anything I mean acting completely out of character and adopting different personas when around different people if they think that acting a particular way will get them the attention they crave. I knew someone with Aspergers at high school and he had no concept of emotion. Everything was 100% logical for him and he couldn't see how certain things he said and did offended or hurt others. He was completely unaware of the feelings of others.
I do think that ADHD is over-diagnosed, particularly in children that are just being difficult because their parents are too lazy or nice to discipline them properly. But to say it's not a real disorder is just being ignorant.
Weird, yes. Naturally, no. (Score:5, Interesting)
First, I am sick to death from seeing people try to claim some watered down form of a mental condition that excuses excessive behaviors they mostly wish they had and makes them seem special without having to put much efforts towards it or even understanding much about it. Understand this about autism/Aspergers and pretty much any state considered disordered as compared to the general population: meeting a diagnostic criteria includes having some persistent behavioral anomalies. Having some of the same persistent behavioral anomalies does not qualify one for the diagnosis. Very few of any who actually earn the diagnosis are capable of anything productive. And if one were to go with the behavioral criteria, the vast majority would earn themselves a far less appealing diagnosis or three, and which point they'd rebel against the process and disclaim any association with any disorder.
Now, we have in fact looked at 'weird' in psychology, but mostly as to what people think it is, rather than an objective state. I've looked at what kinds of people get that label and how. Programmers, or geeks/nerds in the technical literature, earn that label -- literally. They tend to start out more similar than most, and develop a specific quirk or three in order to exert individuality. They themselves keep each other within boundries of weirdness by approving or disapproving of others quirks, as often as not in how they're expressed rather than pure content. The effect is one of most people taking on the task of marking themselves an individual by developing an unusual, hopefully unique set of markings for their clothing. They appear to ignore the fact that the piece of clothing is a jacket collar. They appear to be unable to recognize that the collar is always on a Nehru jacket.
The defining word is "affectation". The evidence is in the desperation with which the concept is held and in how vehemently it is denied. A close analogy can be drawn with those who have strong anti-authoritarian rebelliousness early in life. It is not that they are anti-authoritarian, but rather than they are overly sensitive to it and dislike the fact that early in their life they are near the bottom of the ladder. They frequently end up at the other extreme. Likewise, the chronically similar act to differentiate themselves as soon as their situation allows, but only within a limited way, the rest remaining a recognizable part of the fairly closed group for which similarity of some sort remains more a badge than the differences. These too tend to evolve to the opposite end of the spectrum, common end states being either comparing swag t-shirts from conferences, or comparing their ties, the only major item of difference they would ever consider sporting having bought into management.
You may now feel free to mod me down as troll or flamebait just because I've answered the question with my own considered opinion which will no doubt prove unpopular. Refer back to "vehemence".
Self-reinforcing stereotypes (Score:3, Interesting)
No, I think you are transformed by your stereotypes. In the Anglo-Saxon world, but more particularly in the USA, people are often pigeonholed/pigeonhole themselves into categories, and the stereotypes of their group only serves to reinforce their traits. "Jocks" are more "jocky", "nerds" are more "nerdy", "popular girls" try hard to be more like popular girls, and so on. It's not just in high school either, it works for anything else too.
I think there's a culture in Anglo-Saxon countries (but again particularly in the USA) for people to trade some of their individual identity for their group identity, which makes people that are strongly defined by the group they feel they belong to, and who identify strongly with those groups. In other words I think that the Anglo-Saxon civilisation is more naturally geared toward communitarianism and self-segregation.
To contrast with this, in France (where I was born and raised), this phenomenon is practically non-existent, or only extended to social classes (e.g. "les bourges" or "les racailles"). As a result, people (of the same social class) tend to have a feeling of belonging to the same group as anyone else, and personal identity is therefore almost entirely solely reliant on individuality and personal traits, and generally there's a lack of self-awareness as to which pigeonhole one would fit in.
The consequence of that lack of segregation is that people in a profession don't seem necessarily much more different than people in another. That's how you can have more colleagues in IT who look like rugby players or bikers than colleagues who look like stereotypical nerds. A small confirmation of this was the admission from Irish engineering students that all the foreign French students they had seen in Engineering were much more 'normal' than Irish engineering students were.
So my answer to the question is, besides aspies, self-reinforcing nerd stereotypes, and a strong awareness that you're "just a full-blown nerd".
Creativity (Score:1, Interesting)
Creativity seems to be something that you don't just turn on and off. You have to do it an practice continuously. Apparently people in suits have a difficult time understanding that. However, they should not be surprised. I know people who wear suits who continuously play blackberry and "lets try to offend people with the Jag" on weekends, so it should be no surprise that creative people (people who take conventional ideas, and carefully twist them sideways, or make jokes about something, pressing the logical conclusion, using a miniature thought experiment to complete and continue the silly joke. When thinking about something twisted sideways, they gain insights. People in suits don't get that. They consider the joke to be just a joke (and stupidly, just a waste of time). They will even become condescending about the 'waste of time', and berate those who do these things. The creativity is lost on them. One particular experiment in the silly involved a man (a university professor) watching a cafeteria food fight. He did the math regarding a thrown object. The math took more than a week. Fellow professors thought it was an interesting. University officials thought it a waste of time. Students (business students) thought he was a nut. They didn't get it till he got the Nobel Prize for the silliness. Considering the first university lecture he gave was scrutinized by Wolfgang Pauli, John von Neumann and Albert Einstein, you would think he would be nervous. But he was a creative 'offbeat' genius. (Richard Feynman).
Bright = Weird (Score:2, Interesting)
Visual-Spatial (Score:3, Interesting)
Visual-spatial memory and thought are my primary driver.
For those who don't "have it," I may appear to be a completely weird person that they can't understand... someone who can look at things from 200,000 different angles and still say that there is no answer.
It's hard to find friends, lemme tell ya. :)
Art vs Science (Score:3, Interesting)
If you look at artists for all the disciplines, you'll find that almost all of them could fit the concept of weirdness.
For the good and the bad.
Divergent thinkers [wikipedia.org] are very often at the base of new (software) solutions to old problems or for a fresh new breakthrough..
So, yes, very likely developers look weird when compared to anyone else.
What about office staff?! (Score:1, Interesting)
You've also got to look at non-techie workers too though.
I've worked in many places where the secretaries are just plain bimbo's spending most of their day flirting (distracting others) or trying to get men to do their work for them.
Then there's the Sales guys who are just plain preoccupied with talking about the football results or how drunk they're going to get on pay-day.
Don't forget the old-timers waiting for retirement who spend most of their day figuring out how their pension scheme is going or how good their shares are.
If you think a programmer who puts lyrics in his comments is weird, then you've been a PHB too long.
Re:From what I've discovered... (Score:2, Interesting)
Too damn right. I've had enough of pretending to be normal. I'm sick to the back teeth of hearing about football and X Factor. The interesting ones are the ones with real interests who care about their interests. The rest can take a running jump.