Making Sense of CPU and GPU Model Numbers? 555
b4dc0d3r writes "How do you make sense of the various model numbers or naming schemes for CPUs, graphics cards, and the related chipsets? All I want is something that will run Oblivion and output full 1080 video to a TV. Last time I built my own computer I just went to Pricewatch, made a few easy choices, and everything came to my door. Do I really have to research the differences among Core i5, Core 2 Duo, Pentium 4, Pentium D, Sempron, Athlon, Phenom ...? And that's just the processor. Is there a reference somewhere? In short, how do you buy a computer these days?"
Re:Oblivion in HD on the TV? (Score:2, Interesting)
Don't buy a Mac (Score:1, Interesting)
As for the original question, I use Newegg and tomshardware.com for all of my info, with the occasional google usage. I start with a motherboard I want, (taking note of northbridge), and look it up. I always pick Intel, they are much better bang for the buck than AMD atm. Processor wise - last time I made a computer it was all Core 2 Duo, with the option for extreme or not - much easier. But now you have i3, i5, i7 which are the lastest generation, on a LGA 1366 I believe, the i3 is the lowest tier, and i7 the hardcore enthusiast/gamer/video editor tier. I don't know anything about the models, just look for cache size and speed, those are the main specs for a processor. For the video card, I go with Nvidia because its much more compatible with linux (and FreeBSD) if you like to use their binaries vs. open source drivers. They recently changed how they do they naming, the lower 200 series, I believe are re-casts of the some of the 9xxx series.
Re:It can be confusing... (Score:3, Interesting)
Radeon 4790? Where do you suggest he finds that?
I assume you mean Radeon 4890, which is at around $200 although at limited availability.
Still, I would suggest he gets the cheaper but more future-proof Radeon 5770. He might want to run DX11 in the future, or eyefinity.
Actually, if he really means Oblivion-level games only, and does not expect to start playing any newer stuff, even the 5770 is overkill and he should go for the $80 Radeon 5670 I see on NewEgg right now, or lower still...
Next on, your answer suggest that you don't consider sub-$200 processors as a valid market. Sorry to have to wake you up, but for most people (e.g. those wanting to run Oblivion and output to 1080p) an Athlon II X3 or X4 at under $100 is more than enough. In fact, the entire pc that fits OP's description should cost around $300-.
Virtualization (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Its extremely simple (Score:5, Interesting)
The problem is humans are not good at coping with decissions that involve more than three different factors. So in the end the best is to boil it down to the three things that are most important to you and rate the choices on those items. Or you can just ask for a fast one.
This is very true. First think about what's really important to you. Is it excessive amounts of raw power? Is it cost? Is it noise? (It was for me.) Is it low power usage? How important is compatibility with future components really? (Most likely you'll just buy a completely new PC again, right?)
What are you going to use it for? Web + mail? Programming? Some gaming? Heavy, state-of-the-art 3D gaming?
Most likely, you'll want a healthy balance of these things. People who assemble PCs for a living will probably know what you want, because they've sold the same PC to thousands of others already. If you have unusual wishes (noise is too often ignored IMO), then it's wise to do some research into that specific area.
Re:Set a budget (Score:5, Interesting)
I second.
Heck, one can get decent GPU for $100-150, meaning that by going cheaper with the rest of components, one can also get himself a decent gaming machine for about $400-600.
Now I can't even name a single PC component which is a must have and can't be found new for less than $100.
My Experience (Score:4, Interesting)
I recently built my own computer for similar purposes. I needed a box that would download things all day and output via HDMI to my TV, but I placed an extra constraint on my system: Linux compatibility, or at least a reasonable degree of compatibility. So, I researched available parts, using price as the first method of siphoning all the dreck. I live in China, so, for example, the processor's price ranged from a few hundred yuan (about 50 bucks) to about four thousand yuan (closer to $500). I decided not to pay more than 400 yuan for my processor, and right there, I cut out about 90% of the processors I had to research. I decided from then that I wanted a 64-bit processor and I would only look at the top 3 FSB's out of those processors, and I chose Intel because my previous experiences with Linux and AMD procs was somewhat dubious. Everything else kind of fell into place after simply choosing the proc, save for the GPU, which I chose for it's Native HDMI port, high-ish (1GB) dedicated memory and driver support in Linux. So that part was even easier.
Your situation seems a lot simpler than mine though, since you only have two constraints: Oblivion (don't know what it is) and 1080 video to a TV. Basically, what you need is any computer matching the requirements for playing Oblivion (I would go a little beyond recommended specs for running it) and with a NATIVE HDMI port. If you spend time worrying about complex names for different series of nanometer sized pieces of wire hypersolderized together, you will drown in the hopelessness that is marketing and advertizing and general rhetorical BS. Find out what specs you need to do what you want, if you're using Linux then check for compatibility issues in the forums of the distro you use or plan on using, and what you need to buy should pretty much be spelled out for you in pretty simple choices. If you're using Windows, you have a lot less to worry about since you don't really have control over those sorts of things, just take whatever has an HDMI port and enough RAM and cycles per second to run your game.
Re:It can be confusing... (Score:4, Interesting)
As part of some Vista capable lawsuit a while back, it was found that NVIDIA drivers caused the most BSODs. Even if you scaled ATI's marketshare at the time (I forget the month, but I looked it up- the Steam Hardware survey is as reasonable of a guess as you're going to get) to make the crash percentages ceteris paribus, NVIDIA drivers still crashed on Vista 50% more.
On Windows 7, I haven't had any driver related issues...
Re:Don't buy a Mac (Score:1, Interesting)
Mac is not dumbed down, and it's also not the "best" technology when it comes to performance.
It is simply a piece of hardware doesn't require extensive research, configuration and maintainance.
And it's ergonomic and well-designed. Please, don't turn design down. Architecture matters for you
when you buy a house, doesn't it?
Re:Building your own laptop (Score:3, Interesting)
Huh? I don't get it. I did not mention laptops, is there some reasoning you have that puts $5k laptops within the $300 desktop $5k server space that I talked about?
In case I was not clear, no, I do not build laptops, nor would I recommend it and it is a rather OT issue.
Re:Don't buy a Mac (Score:3, Interesting)
I would recommend looking at your requirements and then maybe buying a Mac if appropriate.
If you want to play games (which the OP does) then Windows is currently the way to go.
If you want to do programming/development (excluding for the iPhone/iPod) or if you like getting under the hood and tweaking things then Windows/Linux is the way to go.
If you want to do pro audio/video/graphics or if you want a computer that you don't need to look under the hood, then Mac is probably the way to go.
Yeah, Macs are 'dumbed down' as far as the OS goes and they're not the cheapest machines available but for some people they are perfect. A flat out recommendation to ignore them is not good advice.
Re:Don't buy a Mac (Score:3, Interesting)
It has gotten more and more difficult... (Score:2, Interesting)
I'm not an old man and thus only have about 10 years experience with computers, but in those ten years, components have become more and more complicated.
It used to be that the faster processors had the highest numeral (eg, Pentium 2 Pentium 3) and the highest clock speed tacked to the end of them.
But now we've reached the brick wall of that megahertz race and we're in a new efficiency race, where things are not so simple. The highest numeral isn't always the best, and neither is the highest clock speed- although it still helps.
This would be far less of a problem if the older components died out, like they used to, but even that's not the case anymore.
For example, the Pentium brand is STILL alive, because when Intel get a load of duff C2D chips with bad caches, they dust them off and sell them as Pentiums. This is a lot more economical for them, but it means that the old generations of chips won't die to clean up the market for new ones.
Things would probably be a lot clearer if the older components could some how be killed off once and for all.
I do it backwards (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Hardware virtualization (Score:4, Interesting)
Processor that faild virtualisation instruction are simply market with virtualisation disabled. Would you rather have them to trash all but perfect cpu, raise price and pollute more? If someone dont need virtualisation then this cheaper "defective" cpu will be good enough for his need. Everyone win.
No, the buyer looses because s/he can't reasonably know what the hell it is s/he is buying.
You want to remarket defective chips that can't support virtualisation. Fine. Give them a different name, so a reasonably intelligent and informed buyer can make an informed decision without being forced to research all the minutia of Intel product sub-codes.
As it is, this is deceptive market, and stupid of Intel. Wrapping it in a green blanket and calling it eco-friendly doesn't change this. And yes, if the choice is a binary one between having to ferret out if the chip I'm buying is defective and won't support virutalisation, or filling the landfill with the things, then please, fill up the damn landfill.
Better yet, take the third path: remarket the things, but be honest and label them clearly so people don't end up buying the wrong thing. We shouldn't all have to be experts in every technical detail of Intel chips to be sure we're getting the product we want, any more than we should all have to be experts in aviation in order to board an aircraft and know we'll reach our destination.
Re:Ars technica (Score:1, Interesting)
I tried to read the Ars article, but their frakked up website doesn't like my Ad-Block Plus. Also, their mods (think power-hungry,"muscle-flexing" peon giving their contributors a bad name) think of ABP users as leechers.
When Ars can guarantee in writing that their ad system will not be a vector for malicious software, then I'll turn off my ABP. Until then, frak em.
Re:Quite Easy (Score:3, Interesting)
Most PCs rarely use more than 200W. I'm using a 380W power supply, and it's more than enough.
Seconded. I have a rig that was fairly nice several years ago, with a 9800GT, core2 duo, 2 hard drives, and a mobo with onboard wireless. I was sure that it would need a 550 watt PSU, but i recently got a wattmeter and the PC only pulls ~160 watts while browsing the web. Fire up a benchmark program (futuremark) and it shoots up to an astonishing 230 watts.
Theres lots of misinformation out there when it comes to PSUs (although 550 watt isnt bad in this case, as it means energy efficiency is fairly good at my watt usage; 350-400w would have been ideal).
Re:It has got silly (Score:3, Interesting)
Right, because it's so damned hard to figure out? Spend a day or two at some nice hardware review sites and you will figure out very quickly what's good and what isn't. Anandtech, Tom's Hardware, and 3DGuru are good sites imo.
Re:It has got silly (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Only 2 components worth researching... (Score:3, Interesting)
>>Buy ULTRA or Corsair (if you can't afford a ULTRA).
I had two ULTRA's blow up on me the first time they powered on. No thanks, won't be buying from them again.
I've had good experience with Thermaltake and Antec PSUs.