Ask Slashdot: Business Software for Linux? 202
Delta asks: "I am currently looking into starting a company of my own and need a whole new area of software, to mange contacts, run billing systems, so I need software like SuperOffice and Point-of-Sale systems, but I want to run Unix! Can anyone recommend such software? And perhaps a good schedule prog? It's pretty obvious that I would need stability, I cannot have the system go belly up, as any bussiness would soon follow in such a case. Another advantage would be the ability to use the databases through a web interface, or being able to carry local copies on laptops and so on. All software under this topic is of huge intrest." Can Linux be used for those generic purposes in a sales-oriented business (read: Linux as cash-register?)
write it yourself (Score:1)
I took an old Paradox for DOS database that had 25,000 lines of code, wiped out 3/4 of that because a web database doesn't really need any user interface coding, and had a much better app to boot.
This is a quick and reliable way to go. Trust me on this.
wrong question (Score:1)
Applix a terrific product (Score:1)
Applix fills this niche perfectly. MY PHB uses Applix every day, at my behest, because "I don't need Office, much too complicated.
He has a dozen different mailing groups for his Board of Directors, it handles our capital campaign very nicely. The spreadsheet really excels (pun intended) at budgeting, the multi page/consolidation features are really well implemented.
Just my opinion, but then again, I'm not a sweaty-handed college student.
No, Corel didn't, but it's still worth big bucks, (Score:1)
That said, I'd like to point out that Pdox DOS uses relational calculus for its queries. The version of relational calculus that you are familiar with, SQL, is tuple (record) oriented. Pdox DOS uses the field-oriented relational calculus, Query by Example. I know both. Know one, know the other. QBE is a natural in the Linux market.
PdoxDOS is barely 500k of C code, screamingly fast and dead reliable. Rewrite for Linux, keep the stuff that insures referential integrity, dump the modes, make it work with ODBC so I can use PHP, and WALAA, instant web database. Then call Zenreich and Kocis to reprise what is easily the best computer book ever written >Paradox Programmer's Guide PAL by Example.
Anybody at Borland interested in recycling this wonderful workhorse? Anybody in Borland have any clue at all?
I'm well aware of this.... (Score:1)
I'd really like to understand what made you think that I was stating that the use of PHP and ODBC somehow obliterated the need for structure and/or rules, perhaps there's a misunderstanding? I'd appreciate if you'd e-mail me. (I'd e-mail you, but you're an AC)
I'd be all for this... (Score:1)
I'd be more than willing to help on the database/php side of something like this assuming it was well organized and such.
Re:Office 2000 (Score:1)
Enterprise Rent-a-car is the 2nd largest company in the world?!
Man....this must be a bad dream or something...
Look for Acucobol products (Score:1)
Re:If it can't connect to a bank.. boo (Score:1)
Use Linux Servers and Windows/DOS workstations (Score:1)
We do this for our custom written POS/Accounting package and it works well. This allows our "cash registers" to run dedicated (on 386's with WFW3.11, DOS tcpip sucks) and the other workstations running 95 or 98 to access the software while still allowing the workstations to run Office, etc.
Of course, the workstations crash periodically, but the servers run forever (or until you shut them down). In general DOS and Windows (less so) will run just fine if they are only running one app and it works right. We only require the "cash registers" and workstations to be up maybe 8-10 hours a day, so it works fine; a crash/lock up only causes minor inconviences.
Re:Burlington Coat Factory (Score:1)
How is having a staff of DBAs & dedicated servers or the redunancy you speak of any different than trying to run on WinNT? You don't want to run a business on questionable hardware anyway and you always want to make sure that you are backing up your data. That has nothing to do with linux. Burington may have already had a lot of their software written for a Unix platform (I seem to recall that they had their store servers on Solaris), so it wouldn't be too terriblly hard to port.
Re:your unix bias (Score:1)
That's ridiculous. Guess what a lot of chains have used or are using for such activies? Xenix or SCO Unix. Get a bunch of POS terminals and hook them to a server via serial lines and run curses based apps that require the user only to pick a letter/number/function key or scroll up or down with the cursor and press enter. The users don't have to know what OS the machine is running, just how to operate the applications that have been set up for them. They aren't going to be running shell commands.
Re:Burlington Coat Factory (Score:1)
;)
-l
As far as scheduling... (Score:1)
If you are looking to run it on linux I am not sure if there is a linux native version but the version we use runs on SCO OpenServer so the ibcs (sp??) module *MAY* work. I know the DOS version of SuperSked needs one of them keys that attach to your parallel port, but, as for the UNIX version I am not sure if a key that is used. There once was a message up on the console about a "Liscense Daemon" being restarted so that may be used instead of the parallel port key.
Now for the POS system: There was a review of a POS system in the Linux Journal a while back ( I think this year) called LinuxPOS which is mentioned in an earlier comment with URL.
I wrote my own. (Score:1)
When I get some time, I'm gonna clean it up and GPL it. Right now, it's just a bunch of loose scripts custom-tailored to my own set of accounts.
I'd like to graft an emacs front-end onto it too.
Cheers,
- Jim
Top site: www.hex.net/~cbbrowne/finances.html (Score:1)
http://www.hex.net/~cbbrowne/finances.ht ml [hex.net]
Re:wrong question (Score:1)
No I don't think so.
First case: multiple apps
If you have an existing server curently running several applications such as SMB, FTP, HTTP or SMTP, and you are not ready to invesnt into a new server
Second case: skills
Your staff is equiped with ABC OS skills, so you look for an ABC OS package.
Third case: cost
If the app you want only runs on an AS/400, then the total solution cost increases dramatically since AS/400 hardware isn't cheap no to mention the OS which can cost up to $10,000.
And finally most people run more than one app on their systems. If I chose a different OS for every app that I use according to it's performance, I would be stuck with Win98 because IE 5 is the best web browser, Linux because the X/Enlightenment is the best graphical environment and OS/400 because it has the best online help system.
Rich
Gantt charts (Score:1)
I am a consultant/contractor and I'm constantly sending out proposals and other documents that require Gantt charts. What software is available for me to do this with? Currently I've been manually writing them and then drawing them up on the gimp. There's gotta be a better way.
Re:POS software? (Score:1)
I've done what you're talking about on both platforms, pal, and believe me -- it went a HELL of a lot more smoothly on *nix (did one DBMS / POS on SCO, another on Linux, a couple in Win/DOS).
Don't speak up unless you've done it, please. It's an absolute pain in the ass to do something like this cleanly on Win/DOS, unless you just buy a turnkey setup, which still will probably bomb out on occasion.
In fact, if anybody knows the Git-N-Go (tm) chains here in the U.S. (which run NT/9x), you're probably familiar with waiting in line or waiting to pump gas while the semi-literate sales clerk reboots the register. I see it about twice a month; waited in line 20 min.'s while they figured out the register was locked up today.
In short, shutup.
POS from Linux expo (Score:1)
It had support for cash drawers, and most common barcode scanners, etc... IIRC.
Eljay General Accounting System Home Page (Score:1)
Re:AActually, I think Appgen already has it... (Score:1)
"Has anyone used this product?"
And, until that can be answered "Yes" by
an accounting department of a PUBLIC corp.,
it doesn't mean much.
Publicly traded corporations are fairly limited
in what accounting systems they may use. (This
is the USA only, Delaware Corps only).
I'd really like to know what RHAT uses for Accounting and Finance software.
Re:Something like quickbooks would be great for li (Score:1)
The wonders of modern technology! (Score:1)
:P
(It's friday!)
Re:*nix for business (Score:1)
One Big problem I have had with PC POS was not having enought serial ports. Consider all the serial devices you need to hook up:
Mouse (if it's not PS/2 Bus)
UPS
Modem (if it's not internal)
CashDrawer
BarCoder
CardStripReader (if it's not built into the keyboard)
SCO had a problem about sharing IRQs so just adding a extra COM board was little help.
When everything goes USB, POS PC's will be easier to manage.
Backbone?? (Score:1)
Cheers,
ZicoKnows@hotmail.com
Yep (Score:1)
But they already have programmers who know the Mac, and they still almost shut that division down to move those customers to Quicken.com. It would be nuts to spend the resources to port it to Linux, which has less of a desktop share, when they're grappling with all those other problems that I mentioned previously. I'm talking Quicken here, not QuickBooks or their other small business products, which they don't make for the Mac anymore.
As far as Intuit's products go, TurboTax is pretty vital to me, and potential integration issues with it are the only reason why I might end up not going with Money 2K instead of Quicken 2K. As to the biz products, I don't use them myself (although I do have first-hand experience with the nightmare that is PeachTree), but my accounting babe seems to be satisfied with QuickBooks instead of the competition.
BTW, the thing that irked me about the post to which I replied was attributing Quicken's absence of Linux products to some lack of backbone. That's ludicrous.
Cheers,
ZicoKnows@hotmail.com
Re: Business software for Linux? (Score:1)
-Z
This is how we do it.... (Score:1)
Re:This is how we do it.... (Score:1)
Re:wrong question (Score:1)
"This must run on old 486s (cheap hw) and stay up for years (users can't fix a crash and there isn't time for rebooting)"
Now this leave out quite a few os'es, no matter what the app is.
I don't know if the 486 thing is relevant, (maybe in the third world) but crashing a cash register is bad for business. I have seen it happen at a small pc shop using windows, and I left. Why wait when there are other shops?
credit card POS software (Score:1)
afaik it's oriented towards web transactions etc but i can't see any reason (barring a complete refusal on your part to do any software tinking) that it couldn't be used in conjunction with a vanilla magnetic card reader to make a 'real' POS machine.
----
Re:No, it wouldn't (Score:1)
> competitor to MS.
Is that why they bundle a customized version of Netscape with their package? And don't be ridiculous, no company would "rather go broke than use Linux". For-profit companies always prefer making money to not making money. If supporting Linux was the only was MS could succeed, they would.
Re:wrong question (Score:1)
This leaves DOS, UNIX (BSD/other) Mac and Linux as viable choices. Mac platform mostly hasn't had this type of software developed recently. DOS applications are often very reliable and proven, but they frequently lack necessary functionality because development has slowed to almost a halt on that platform. This leaves UNIX and Linux. Non-free UNIX is too expensive to use and get support for a small business. This leaves *BSD and Linux, both stable and affordable (TCO) operating systems. Don't know why *BSD was left out, but it is clear that OS choice _is_ relevant.
Re:These guys have given up on the GUI (Score:1)
Re:write it yourself (Score:1)
Re:MultiValue DataBases... (Score:1)
Re:Burlington Coat Factory (Score:1)
web-based Quicken clone (Score:1)
Re:Many options for Unix. (Score:1)
Many options for Unix. (Score:1)
As for databasing, you should probably write your own, if at all possible. The FSF has some great database routines for C programs. Couple that with a MySQL setup on the server
Java or Perl and HTML might not be bad for a Web-based intranet client. However, IMHO, Web- based clients generally aren't robust enough due to security and other limitations...
Lets not forget that FoxPro runs on SCO and (I think) AIX. And you can get a stripped-down version of SCO for free....
Re:your unix bias (Score:1)
Home Depot Does Too (Score:1)
Hey, look at me, I'm lazy! (Score:1)
Sounds a bit like if, given an assignment in school, you ask your prof/teacher for relevent references instead of just spending the 30 minutes to check your library index for an answer.
A slightly different idea (Score:1)
The company I work for is a reseller for SalesLogix [saleslogix.com], a sales automation tool.
It's used to track contacts, accounts and oppurtunities for sales, includes a reporting tool (either Crystal or IQ Reports).
The database uses either Oracle, MS-SQL or Interbase, so a Linux Oracle database is possible, but you do need a Win9x/NT to run actual server.
It has features built in to syncronise changes with remote sites (other stores) and remote users (salesman on the road with laptops).
As i said, all the client software is for Win9x/NT, but I'm sure if a lot of people want a Linux version, they'll look into it.
There is also a WWW interface for it, but this needs MS-IIS and ASP to run.
As for the POS side, it can be completly changed and new screens/code can be written for it, so it shouldn't be much to do that.
Ah well, just my 0.02 euros.
KevF
Excel and Access (Score:1)
Re:Many options for Unix. (Score:1)
C programs. Couple that with a MySQL setup on the server
including Burlington Coat Factory, which has a Linux-based solution, have done.
Bah! Screw this! Writing a databse in C or any low level programming language is like going back to 70s! If you just take the Access manual and rtfm for an hour, in 10 minutes you will be able to build a relational Access Database with queries and automatic reports and stuff. This is an excelent database application for simple and strightforward needs. Otherwise, use a real SQL server like Oracle if you need to develpo a fairly big DB with lots of simltaneous connection, etc. But for simple needs Access is just fine, no need to reinvent the wheel!
SAP R/3 (Score:1)
Re:These guys have given up on the GUI (Score:1)
Re:Ask HomeDepot... (Score:1)
POS (Score:1)
However, the big problem with Linux at POS is devices. Printers, 2x20 displays, flatbed scanners, handheld scanners, MSRs, pinpads, bizarre keyboards in odd ports. If you're pushing a free OS it doesn't make a lot of sense to have to buy all new hardware with everything USB (not that Linux supports that too well) to make it work.
It will take the big hardware vendors, IBM, NCR and Fujitsu/ICL to get behind Linux before Linux at POS becomes viable. Right now the number one OS shipped with POS hardware is still DOS. Win9x/NT/CE are distant 2nd-4th.
Rupert
Re:your unix bias (Score:1)
Rupert
AActually, I think Appgen already has it... (Score:1)
http://www.appgen.com [appgen.com]
My CPA sent this to me a few months ago and hi-lighted the Linux plug. Seems that they are providing what you are looking for.
Has anyone used this product?
It's worse than that... (Score:1)
ADP DOES NOT know how to design programs. I've used PCPers and HRizon. Blah!
I'd suggest again that you look at Appgen.
http://www.appgen.com [appgen.com]
Re:Ask HomeDepot... (Score:1)
Re:your unix bias (Score:1)
At university, their "sanctioned" POS system seems to run on.... WINDOZE 95!
Several times, I've seen "Press F3 to return to POS, any other key to quit back to Windows 95".
Then, there's always the cash register that displays the distinctive "Welcome to Windows 95" 'tips' dialog... (complete with My Computer, Network Neighbourhood, Inbox, Briefcase, etc icons!). I guessimate the tiny 6" monitor is running around 320x240 or something like that, but it's windoze alright (no apparent mouse... standard POS type keyboard ["Sandwich, 1.85" etc]). Wonder how they shut down "Oh. Press Drink, $1.50 and HotDog, $3 together, then press Taco, $3 until the bar reads 'shut down', then press Ice Cream, $1. Again Press Taco $3 until there's a dot that says "Shut down" and hit Ice Cream, $1 again." Hmm. Hungry Ctrl-Alt-Del's.
Then there's those POS that do run a Un*x variant or other...
Microfocus Cobol ? (Score:1)
Re:Linux Business App (Score:1)
So no, there is not "one single integrated solution for all of them". Not on Linux, AIX, Windows or a Palmpilot.
MS? (Score:1)
So truly, MS doesn't know how to write business software. Last I looked they ran their business on AS/400. and jotted down sales numbers on little scrap of papers (DOJ trial)
Do you really really think that MS accountants "balance the books" in Access?
StarOffice: Ok schedules, presentations, etc. (Score:1)
You can get StarOffice from Sun [sun.com]. I've used it on Linux and Solaris and it does what you need an office suite to do -- for free, since you only have to pay if you bundle it or integrate it with something you sell.
Caveat: I work at Sun, so if you believe in conspiracy theories and so forth, perhaps you should get a second opinion.
Re:Linux Business App (Score:1)
ON the other hand, there are probably a faily large pile of people out there running small businesses on the web, where the most commonly encountered activities are selling/supporting a product or service that they wish to ship themselves.
The most common tasks associated with that are contact management, accounting, correspondence, POS, perhaps label making and package tracking. If it's strictly a web based business, you can drop the POS, although the author of this "Ask
I myself would like to be able to accomplish all these tasks using Linux, but right now have to copy/paste from a bunch of Windows apps. So, who is going to get it right first with a single, well integrated application? Will it be someone who develops for Linux, or someone who develops for Windows?
Re:If you cant admit it, you'll fail (Score:1)
Web-based Accounting (Score:1)
For more information, visit the project website at http://www.webaccountant.org/ [webaccountant.org].
There's currently a wide gap in the realm of open-source web-based accounting software, and it's just waiting to be filled. I'm sure small business will benefit from the products that emerge as a result.
Re:your unix bias (Score:1)
or another way of putting it would be:
"Press F3 to return to POS, any other key to quit back to a POS"
Re:your unix bias (Score:1)
Waste of money? (Score:1)
That said, I've never been a big fan of Intuit's products anyway. I'd much rather see Computer Associates port their low-mid end packages (like Simply Accounting) over. I'd also love to see Canadian tax-prep software on Linux as well... Oooh. I think I smell an open source project coming on...
Re:*nix for business (Score:1)
Re:No, it wouldn't (Score:1)
re: Business software for Linux? (Score:1)
Re:No, Corel didn't, but it's still worth big buck (Score:1)
Re:credit card POS software (Score:1)
Thanks for the plug.
Wally world (Score:1)
Other businesses that use unix... (Score:1)
Cash Register & Sales Monitor (Score:1)
Erf. (Score:1)
"piece of
Apologies for a twisted sense of humour...
First sentence of above should have sarcasm tags. (Score:1)
POS software? (Score:1)
Propriety cash-register vendors *do* exist (Score:1)
She said they just about fell over when they found out that not only did this dumb retail bimbo know about Linux, but that she knew a lot of specifics about the advantages of the Linux OS...
Re:Ask HomeDepot... (Score:1)
Re:Let's here it for Applix! (Score:1)
-awc
Ask HomeDepot... (Score:2)
AIX vs Linux (Score:2)
The company is Information Management Systems, Inc. [infoms.com]
-- Give him Head? Be a Beacon?
Re:AIX vs Linux (Score:2)
Regardless, IMS is still a viable option if CompUSA uses it or not.
-- Give him Head? Be a Beacon?
A Java Solution (Score:2)
http://www.j-commerce.com
It has a complete POS setup that expands from mom and pop stores to good-sized chains. Best of all, it's got great interoperability, with ODBC and JDBC support, with other systems.
Steven, Senior Technology Editor, Sm@rt Reseller
Re:No, it wouldn't (Score:2)
Re:I'd be all for this...Me too (Score:2)
Re:Other businesses that use unix... (Score:2)
Of course we remember the recent announcement of Linux SAP R/3 [sap.com].
Let's not... (Score:2)
Come on. A little more development work me things.
Common Problem (Score:2)
But since Linux is used primarily for servers and is getting more popular for the desktop as well, you'd think someone would have a mind to develop and market an app which can seamlessly take data from the e-commerce side of a site, verify a cybercash deposit, into order fulfillment, over to write correspondence, UPS shipping labels, then add in a UPS functionality that allows you to feed the data back to the site so that customers can track thier package. This currently requires too much damn copy/paste using windows apps or re-entry of data to be fun. I haven't learned of any Linux apps which do all these functions and sorry if I'm ruffling feathers here, but I'm not going to switch back and forth between OSs to accomplish minor tasks related to completing the same job. The minumum shared data is of course, the customer demographic.
Is there even an accounting program out that just includes UPS label making as an integrated function?
Someone will slap me down here, either for asking for too much, not being a programmer, or expecting too little. I don't see a viable solution on the horizon for such a product, but I'd pay as much as $600 for it if it did all that. I wouldn't pay what the large companies want, which is in excess of $2500, plus a % of sales.
Re:Hey, look at me, I'm lazy! (Score:2)
Re:write it yourself (Score:2)
Proven CHOICE Biz Software (Score:2)
*nix for business (Score:2)
We need the following:
Probably a few other things, too, but I'm sure you'll think of them and give suggestions as see fit.
Accounting software: Needs Accounts Receivable, Accounts Payable, needs to be able to figure out who owes what and what is owed to who; print capability would be nice. Sounds like it shouldn't be too hard, but this is a pretty simle view; I probably left a whole bunch of stuff out.
You might want to integrate time tracking and sales commissions into this, but then it gets more complicated. Do things the Unix way: Write a program that does one thing and does it right.
Contact Management: What you do with this depends on how you want to manage your contacts. You'll probably want company-wide read access with a more tightly controlled edit access.
Cash Register: We need a mini-HOWTO on how to implement
Point-of-Sale system: This is probably going to be the biggest pain. It needs to know a lot of things. Info about the inventory (How many blue guitars do we have in stock?), the price list, the tax rates in each area where you operate. Plus, depending on the business, you might want it to work with touch screens. (Then again, you might not need that.)
-Ender
Burlington Coat Factory (Score:3)
Linux Business App (Score:3)
Linux Financial Stuff Summary (Score:3)
I think #2 lists almost everything mentioned thus far and includes the simple things up to the big boys with lots of modules. It needs more work, as AppGen gets no description while others get more reasonable detail.
Re:Linux Business App (Score:3)
While it's easy to chime in with easily identifiable solutions, most of these sound to be narrowly focused and that is the problem that the author laments. You're probably telling him what he already knows, that there is an abundant supply of narrowly focused applications for a broad number of tasks, but there is not a well integrated solution for all of them.
Can anyone provide direction as to a program that does it all, or of anyone who has integrated other programs to address all these tasks? If yes, then you can answer this guy's question and would be a help to me as I have been looking at the same problem.
GNU Enterprise (Score:4)
This is only vaporware at the moment, but we're duscussing business software and the needs around it on our mailing list. If you're interested in that topic, please join us.
Linux POS (Score:4)
There is is another company that did the same thing but I have not been able to find the for about 1 year.
Good Luck
Bryan
Get a life get Linux
Point-of-Sale Software (Score:5)
Samco [samco.com] has an extensive offering of business accounting applications that work with Linux, including POS. Check out the screenshots [samco.com] of their POS module. J.S. Software [js-software.com] provides accounting and POS software, and they support Linux. LinuxPOS [linuxcanada.com] from Linux Canada is also available.
Funny how all three of these companies are Canadian. Don't worry about accounting tax differences too much, though--Canadian companies (have to) create software with other countries' tax laws in mind.