The TouchStream - Yet Another Keyboard? 22
omen asks: "I know the subject of keyboards seems to come up every week or so, but the FingerWorks has recently come to my attention. Before I shell out $330 for the TouchStream Stealth, I was wondering if anyone has any experience with it. Is the gesture system useful? How hard is it to get used to 'zero-force' keys? How well does the 'two finger' mouse work? Any thoughts on the Qwerak layout?" This keyboard looks to be another incremental improvement on ergonomic keyboards, but are these keyboards really good enough to justify their prices?
It looks awful fancy... (Score:1)
chances to try them.. (Score:2, Informative)
I'd thinking that something this different from what people are used to would really do well to have some kind of trial offer. I'm certainly not going to shell out $45 just to try the damn thing out.
Re:chances to try them.. (Score:1)
Re:Missing features (Score:1)
what do you mean by that?
mouse emulation is complete, inkluding a mouse wheel. AFAIK, IAAO (==i am an owner).
Re:Missing features (Score:2)
it's wonderful (Score:1)
The guestures are most useful under windows (in fact so good that my collegues "just let me try it for a sec!" returned it only after i applied some physical force), but some of them (curser, shift, control and some others) are also useful on linux.
i'm hoping for the roll-your-own tools, though (the firmware is upgradable).
it took a while to hit the right keys at the right time, but the kbd has a builtin heuristics that can correct what you have typed, which works pretty ok for english text.
the "two finger" mouse is actually a "four finger" mouse... double clicking, dragging and the mouse wheel have their own gestures. this is the best feature of them all, if you ask me. from kbd to mouse in 0.0ms
another plus point is the size, at least with the LP. you can fold it up and take it with you, even better than the happy hacking keyboard. and no need to install drivers anywhere.
on the downside i shelled out some $60 shipping and some $100 taxes to order it to europe, which sums up to $450... well, i guess we have to live with this usa against the eu thing...
what else? oh yeah the qwerak... don't know about that, but in my opinion they should do something about the position of programming related keys, not only the a-z. dvorak is not very useful there, either.
did that help? oh, i forgot! i'm not related to fingerworks, just in case you though so
bye!hop
Strained Eyesight (Score:2)
I know this has been mentioned in other discussions on keyboards on Slashdot, but I think it bears repeating...
Would it kill these companies trying to sell keyboards (especially non-traditional ones) over the web to include some large enough pictures that you can actually see what the keyboard might be like to type on? There's no way I'm going to plop down $100 or more for a product I can only get a 250 or 300 pixel wide view of.
QWERAK the Inclement (Score:3, Informative)
About a year ago, I bought a Goldtouch keyboard [goldtouch.com] for the machine I do about 60% of my work on. This keyboard caught my eye mainly because the cursor keys are rather more rationally arranged than on the standard IBM 101 layout. I used to have a persistent problem of hitting Page or Home when I meant to hit an arrow key. No more. And 101 keyboards are just too damn big.
Took a little getting used to, but I now much prefer the Goldtouch keyboard. Except I had a hell of a time whenever I switched to my secondary machine. Finally had to get a Goldtouch for it as well. It was either that or trash the first one.
And my mutant keyboards were still QWERTYs! Forget QWERAK or Dvorak.
YMMV. Especially if you're a hunt-and-peck typist, with fewer skills to unlearn. I'm a touch-typist, a skill I learned on an actual typewriter (that's how old I am). One with blank keys, to break me of the habit of looking at the keyboard.
Still, I wonder who really needs the extra 30% throughput that non-QWERTY keyboards supposedly offer. Aside from professional keyboarders. I think the rest of us need the extra time to stop and think!
Re:QWERAK the Inclement (Score:1)
Speed: People who do serious data entry almost always benefit from these optimized input devices. Personally, I almost never use a numeric keypad for anything other than FPS games. Try watching an accountant use one sometimes; it's pretty impressive.
Pain: the staggered layout of qwerty keyboards was influenced primarily by mechanical considerations. The result is actively painful and harmful for a large number of smart, talented people. I know dozens of people who put up with constant low-level pain simply from this stanard interface (qwerty typing) to a very disconnected activity (computer programming). I know several people for whom the pain is not `low-level'.
Personally, I just use qwerty, and count myself lucky that typing never gets above `infrequent mild pain'. Still sucks, though.
Re:QWERAK the Inclement (Score:2)
I would hope somebody who's suffering harm from use of a keyboard would look at all the possible causes, rather than focusing on a single "obvious" one, like use of the QWERTY keyboard. As I said, I'm pretty ignorant of RMI issues, but what I do know that the "experts" are far from unanimous.
For my part, I get a lot of relief simply by not typing as fast as I can. I once typed for a living, and can still go pretty fast. But as I get older I try to pay more and more attention to my comfort level.
Which is the basis of a lot of self-care: pay attention to your own body. It knows more than you do!
On that same basis, I've come to prefer an adjustable keyboard. As I said before, I bought the Goldtouch keyboard because I was impressed by the layout. But I also find that if I adjust it right, typing feels better. Which has to be a good thing.
I'm also vaguely sceptical of the Dvorak layout for these same reasons: it isn't necessary a good idea to type as fast as you can. Well, perhaps that Dvorak makes up for it with "natural" motions or whatever.
But I'm left more skeptical of QWERAK than ever. If you're right about Dvorak being better for you, QWERAK would seem to offer the worst of both worlds.
Aesthetics (Score:1)
Re:Aesthetics (Score:2)
Umm...wow....I haven't seen one of these yet... (Score:1)
it's about time (Score:1)
Re:it's about time (Score:1)
i got it and i tried it and can't use it (Score:1)
I own one (Score:1)
On the good side, we have the gesture input. It works flawlessly. There is a copy of the list of gestures on the Fingerworks site, but in short you can do a variety of things with certain finger movements. Examples include cut, paste, scrolling (similar to mouse wheel), cursor movement (similar to using the cursor keys), home, end, and many more. They are simply the best part of the keyboard. I don't have the keyboard at work, and I miss the gestures when I don't have them available.
Also on the good side has been Fingerworks support. I've been a bit of a whiner about a few things since I've gotten the keyboard. Mostly, I have complained about usability issues that I'll mention below. They've always listened to my whining and have come up with great suggestions that are usually quite helpful.
On the not quite as good side, we have the keyboard. To give a bit of background, I use a MS Natural keyboard normally and I really like it. I am used to the "ergonomic" slope of such a keyboard. The TouchStream has the same sort of slope. (It is at a slightly different angle, but it seems ergonomically correct.) I generally type in about the 60-90 WPM range, depending on subject matter. I usually have very few typing errors. (I'd better proofread this post now that I've said that.)
My only problem with the keyboard is making sure my fingers stay on the home row. I have gotten much better over time, but it did take a lot of getting used to. If you buy this keyboard, you cannot assume that you will crack it open and throw away your other keyboard immediately. It has been a few month process to feel at all comfortable with the thing. I have a bit large hands, I've always wondered if this contributes at all to my trouble.
With Windows, you can use a regular PS/2 keyboard and the USB Stealth at the same time without a reboot. In Linux you can probably do the same thing, but the wizard in Mandrake doesn't let me turn on two keyboards at the same time. (I ought to not be so lazy, but I just haven't had the time to tackle the issue yet.)
As an Emacs user, I've also found that making my keystrokes work has been a bit of a hassle. Trying to do a Ctrl-C Ctrl-V Ctrl-C is easy on a regular keyboard but takes some practice to master with the TouchStream.
If you are a patient person who is willing to patiently relearn how to type a bit, you might just love the TouchStream. If you are an instant gratification person who will be unhappy if you can't type correctly in the first 15 minutes, you might just want to see if you can borrow one from a friend first.
I bought one - then sent it back (Score:1)
I used it for 8 hours a day over a period of 6 days and just couldn't get used to it. The main problem was that the keys that I'm used to which could be reached with a stretch of two adjacent fingers couldn't be reach on their keyboard layout - the keys were just too far away. The 'board did attempt to 'guess' which keys I was going for (it knows that f rarely follows t for example) but most of the time I found myself editing and correcting my code. The site and support said that it may take two weeks to get used to it, but the fact that the keys were further away seemed, for me at least, to be insurmountable!
However, I really loved the mouse control. Very natural and easy to use for both left and right handers. The gestures were spot on, and had support for common programming tasks. I would definately go for the gesture pad if I was paying
Although I sent mine back, I am waiting to see when they support mapping of the keyboard (they say its on the way) - as its all implemented in software anyway - and will try 'em again when I can change the locations of the keys.
Their tech support was very helpful and willing to work with me, a big change to the regular vendors.
Cheers,
'sling