$20/hour can mean a lot of different things. If it is a unionized government job with benefits in a low cost of living area-it wouldn't be too bad. I can easily see how that wouldn't go far in New York City or Silicon Valley-even for a single guy.
The national average for all "white-collar/technical" professions is $27.15/hour ($56k). However, in most metro areas, it is around $30 ($62k). Out of college, you should expect about 15% less than average or between $48k and $52k with some prior experience--although many, many people will be more than happy to offer you $26.5k. The point is, you should be able to hit the mean within three years. Don't let ANYONE tell you otherwise. If you are offered less than 15% below the aggregate mean (that is, everyon
Dont work out on low wage offers. They are companies, and in a salary negotiation situtation your boss is always trying to screw you no matter how nice a guy he is. It is his job. If you get a too low offer, tell them what you expect, and why you expect that. If they say stuff like, it is a "standard contract", everybody makes the same here. Tell them they are lieing and there is no such thing as a standard contract. In business world you have to know, everthing is up for negotiation.
I agree with everything you said except the last bit.
There can be a standard contract for the company. The hiring person's boss might say.....you cannot offer more than X amount, no negotiating. In fact, that is a fairly common practice.
There can be a standard contract for the company. The hiring person's boss might say.....you cannot offer more than X amount, no negotiating. In fact, that is a fairly common practice.
And because of thier inflexability with negotiations they probably hire average or less then average people to work there. I would try to avoid a place like that if possible, that policy is a red flag to me....
You obviously haven't had to look for a job recently (since 2001) or you wouldn't act so casually toward getting a job. I graduated Suma Cum Laude with 2 degrees, had some great jobs, and had to settle for the same amount that I used to make on internships. And I jumped at the chance, DESPITE a 75 mile commute EVERY day! If you need a job, take it! Get comfortable/experienced. Climb out of depression. Then look for another job later.
Then it is a sad commentary on our education system that you don't know it's "Summa Cum Laude". Hopefully, it was just a typo.
Aside from that, I basically agree. The job market is tight. But things seem to be turning around. Right now I definitely would not advise anyone to decline a job offer because you expect something better to come along (you should already have a better offer before you reject one). In the next few years that will probably change, but
I don't know...but I'm betting neither of those degrees was in Latin. So it seems to be no commentary on our education system...just on one person's Latin spelling ability.
> If they say stuff like, it is a "standard contract", everybody makes the same here. Tell them they are lieing and there is no such thing as a standard contract. In business world you have to know, everthing is up for negotiation.
I *did* work for a start-up where we were all paid the same.
When I was hiring there, someone taking the "you are a liar" approach would have ended the negeotiations immediately.
I got some *excellent* experience there that helped me jump whole salary levels later. The work
You are right, you should never say they are lieing and tecnically they might not. It would be better to tell yourself they are lieing and keep arguing you case, until it seem irrevocably lost.
Really? "No Standard Contracts"? *looks at his CP1 standard contractor contract* Hmm, this 80 page contract must be a figment of my imagination.
Anyway, the base rate formula is listed in it as well. It is Degree(s) + Number of years working = pay grade
So for example, a Masters in Engineering + 1 year (for a graduate) = ~ $19/hour
In my case, Associate of Science + 9 years = ~ $26/hour. If I were to finish my Bachelors I would add about $4/hour more to my rate. And for each year I work I am adding $
In my experience the standard contract is real enough, but it is more of a template: You can change specifics you disagree on, but it might depend on how important your employment is for the company (how unique your skills are).
...especially because of the proliferation of fair employment bills and the like. Canada actually tried to implement a Universal Classification System across ALL government position in the entire frickin' country.
Of course, after $1 billion or so, it failed. But in the meantime they did standardize a hell of a lot of salaries. You can negotiate what level you start at based on your experience, and occasionly get a double increment if you have a good year, but otherwise the increments are standardized.
FYI, in Soviet Russia there were about 16 or so levels that are still used today in government and state-owned organisations. The system is called "Unified Tariff Scale". It might not be the most efficient system, but it works.
They are companies, and in a salary negotiation situtation your boss is always trying to screw you no matter how nice a guy he is.
You are bitter and quite wrong. In some cases, the boss works for you, but the upper management is trying to pinch the pennies. I know, I've done the "boss" thing.
Oh, and around here, many private companies model the government, so you can easily calcualte anyone's pay given their job and years of service. There is no flexibility, and there is a "standard contract."
I don't know a good rate... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:2)
There can be a standard contract for the company. The hiring person's boss might say.....you cannot offer more than X amount, no negotiating. In fact, that is a fairly common practice.
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:2)
And because of thier inflexability with negotiations they probably hire average or less then average people to work there. I would try to avoid a place like that if possible, that policy is a red flag to me....
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:0)
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:1)
Then it is a sad commentary on our education system that you don't know it's "Summa Cum Laude". Hopefully, it was just a typo.
Aside from that, I basically agree. The job market is tight. But things seem to be turning around. Right now I definitely would not advise anyone to decline a job offer because you expect something better to come along (you should already have a better offer before you reject one). In the next few years that will probably change, but
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:0)
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:2, Insightful)
I *did* work for a start-up where we were all paid the same.
When I was hiring there, someone taking the "you are a liar" approach would have ended the negeotiations immediately.
I got some *excellent* experience there that helped me jump whole salary levels later. The work
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:2)
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:2, Informative)
Anyway, the base rate formula is listed in it as well. It is Degree(s) + Number of years working = pay grade
So for example, a Masters in Engineering + 1 year (for a graduate) = ~ $19/hour
In my case, Associate of Science + 9 years = ~ $26/hour. If I were to finish my Bachelors I would add about $4/hour more to my rate. And for each year I work I am adding $
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:2)
There _are_ standards... (Score:3, Insightful)
Of course, after $1 billion or so, it failed. But in the meantime they did standardize a hell of a lot of salaries. You can negotiate what level you start at based on your experience, and occasionly get a double increment if you have a good year, but otherwise the increments are standardized.
Re:There _are_ standards... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:There _are_ standards... (Score:2, Funny)
Re:There _are_ standards... (Score:0)
Re:I don't know a good rate... (Score:1)
You are bitter and quite wrong. In some cases, the boss works for you, but the upper management is trying to pinch the pennies. I know, I've done the "boss" thing.
Oh, and around here, many private companies model the government, so you can easily calcualte anyone's pay given their job and years of service. There is no flexibility, and there is a "standard contract."