to some here, i am the lowest form of scum. i am a windows vb programmer. that makes me 1. evil and 2. stupid. evil because i support microsoft. stupid because, as we all know, vb is a horrible language, right?;-P
you know what? you may be right, but you don't pay my paycheck. i have to eat and pay rent, you know? there's a market for vb programmers. i fill a market, shrinking or not, the market exists. i go to work and get a paycheck. end of story.
i really think i do cool stuff. i'm working with metrics my company is pushing as an industry standard. i crunch data into purty colors using (shake in horror now) microsoft office web component chart objects. it's easy and straightforward. i'm happy and content. doesn't mean i'm a monkey in a suit. i still deal with thorny programming problems. but, of course, i live a rodney dangerfield existence: "i get no respect." you go on with your bad selves and snicker at me. doesn't change a damn thing. smug attitudes are just mental masturbation that makes you feel better about yourself at the expense of winning any converts. and winning converts is the whole issue here.
my boss says "linux is an unproven platform. maybe in five years." before you all reply to his statement with derision and scorn, just remember that it does no good to chastise people like my boss, as you only further the image of the linux geek as an ivory tower, scornful, holier-than-thou type that wins no converts and drives average joe blow users away. instead, take his words at their face value. if you think his words have no truth, then work on dispelling the rumors and innuendo in the press that foster this attitude amongst your average corporate middle management types. don't like dealing with dilbertesque management types. fine! not a problem! don't! remember what the whole issue is here again in this story?
as far as home use, the scene is currently fragmented. "real" geeks use linux and do "real" computer science. the rest of us are just hobbyists and morons, apparently. until, if, and when linux becomes as accessible to average joe blow "how do you click a mouse?" types, windows will be around forever. if you want to accelerate the acceptance of linux and do away with microsoft, the next time a computer user says something mindblowingly stupid to you, you will not snicker and scoff and say RTFM, you will smile and reply helpfully.
and until the linux world makes a serious, concerted effort to make the linux gui and work environment and installation process as braindead as windows, yes, i said braindead, linux will not expand out of it's "i'm an ubergeek" niche. linux will seriosuly dent microsoft when someone can use linux completely, satisfactorially, on a daily basis, in all aspects of use and NEVER HAVE TO TOUCH A COMMAND LINE INTERFACE FOR A SECOND. or even know one exists!
remember, the world of morons does not cater to your computer science genius. YOU cater to and serve computer using morons. accept that or be happy with linux being relegated to the smaller, rarefied world of high-end computing.
Actually, I think RedHat has hidden the command line in its latest release (at least, as hidden as the DOS command in Win98). I guess you are supposed to be able to use the whole system without typing a single command. Ok, I haven't tried it, and since I'm used to using shells, I wouldn't even try. But I'm sure you'll soon be able to use a non-console-based system, just like win98.
Now, as you said, Linux is for geeks. I agree with that, although I would add that it's *not exclusively* for geeks since you can use it for typing letters etc too.
Anyway, I *love* linux because you can really play with the system. Yes, this is the "geeky orientation" you were talking about. I don't mind linux becoming more mainstream with some more userfriendly distros, *as long as* you are still able to play with it (with some less friendly distros like Debian or Gentoo i.e.).
And the OpenSource/Free nature of GNU/Linux makes me think it will always be possible. And that's what's really great about it.
BeOS did it and it died, or was killed -- that's still to be speculated.
but, as an operating system was produced that catered to both the "idiot user" and "geek-elite", it further cements the reality that Windows is in no way "superior" - but simply ubiquitous.
my personal belief is that the future of "personal computing" is in true idiot-catering machines like PDAs. the hunk of silicon my leg is resting on will be the realm of gamers and ueber-geeks. it'll die slowly, but it will be superseded.
I don't believe I've ever had a more difficult couple of paragraphs to read. Please, learn to capitalize letters in places other than when you're yelling. Can't so easily separate sentences in your crap.
I'm not a good writer so I'll copy your comment, and replace VB with MCT...
The only reason i use Windows is because i teach Windows NT/2000 courses as a Microsoft MCT. And the reason i teach this, is because it pays well (and it's easy to teach!).
I'm good at teaching, but making money as a linux teacher is not that easy.
in all aspects of use and NEVER HAVE TO TOUCH A COMMAND LINE INTERFACE FOR A SECOND. or even know one exists!
I just wanted to make a comment about this. I would love if linux people made things braindead.. and also that you didn't have to use the command line. Personally I love command line stuff. That is my preferance. My big beef at windows is that I don't get enough use in the command line. After that when there is command line stuff its obscure and you gotta buy some big thick book... where really microsoft should have all that capability easily accessable and published on the web or when you buy the OS. At least with linux if it has a capability I can go out and find it for free on some linux documentation website either linux.org or some other reputable site. What I'd like to see for linux is somewhat of what this man talks about, but remember You don't have to get rid of the miniscule tweaking ability when you make the interface thats braindead easy. My dream is that it will have both. One day when I'm fealing lazy I can just start it up install.. do whatever and be done in like 10 minutes... The next day when I've got some pep in me I want to analyze everything and tweak it to my personal preference in every single miniscule detail.. but thats my dream..
[...] linux will seriosuly dent microsoft when someone can use linux completely, satisfactorially, on a daily basis, in all aspects of use and NEVER HAVE TO TOUCH A COMMAND LINE INTERFACE FOR A SECOND. or even know one exists! [...]
[... the footer:] C:\>tracert life.liberty.pursuit-of-happiness
no comment.
Life would be so much easier if we could just look at the source code.
-- Dave Olson
windows vb programmer speaks (Score:5, Insightful)
you know what? you may be right, but you don't pay my paycheck. i have to eat and pay rent, you know? there's a market for vb programmers. i fill a market, shrinking or not, the market exists. i go to work and get a paycheck. end of story.
i really think i do cool stuff. i'm working with metrics my company is pushing as an industry standard. i crunch data into purty colors using (shake in horror now) microsoft office web component chart objects. it's easy and straightforward. i'm happy and content. doesn't mean i'm a monkey in a suit. i still deal with thorny programming problems. but, of course, i live a rodney dangerfield existence: "i get no respect." you go on with your bad selves and snicker at me. doesn't change a damn thing. smug attitudes are just mental masturbation that makes you feel better about yourself at the expense of winning any converts. and winning converts is the whole issue here.
my boss says "linux is an unproven platform. maybe in five years." before you all reply to his statement with derision and scorn, just remember that it does no good to chastise people like my boss, as you only further the image of the linux geek as an ivory tower, scornful, holier-than-thou type that wins no converts and drives average joe blow users away. instead, take his words at their face value. if you think his words have no truth, then work on dispelling the rumors and innuendo in the press that foster this attitude amongst your average corporate middle management types. don't like dealing with dilbertesque management types. fine! not a problem! don't! remember what the whole issue is here again in this story?
as far as home use, the scene is currently fragmented. "real" geeks use linux and do "real" computer science. the rest of us are just hobbyists and morons, apparently. until, if, and when linux becomes as accessible to average joe blow "how do you click a mouse?" types, windows will be around forever. if you want to accelerate the acceptance of linux and do away with microsoft, the next time a computer user says something mindblowingly stupid to you, you will not snicker and scoff and say RTFM, you will smile and reply helpfully.
and until the linux world makes a serious, concerted effort to make the linux gui and work environment and installation process as braindead as windows, yes, i said braindead, linux will not expand out of it's "i'm an ubergeek" niche. linux will seriosuly dent microsoft when someone can use linux completely, satisfactorially, on a daily basis, in all aspects of use and NEVER HAVE TO TOUCH A COMMAND LINE INTERFACE FOR A SECOND. or even know one exists!
remember, the world of morons does not cater to your computer science genius. YOU cater to and serve computer using morons. accept that or be happy with linux being relegated to the smaller, rarefied world of high-end computing.
Re:windows vb programmer speaks (Score:2)
But I'm sure you'll soon be able to use a non-console-based system, just like win98.
Now, as you said, Linux is for geeks. I agree with that, although I would add that it's *not exclusively* for geeks since you can use it for typing letters etc too.
Anyway, I *love* linux because you can really play with the system. Yes, this is the "geeky orientation" you were talking about. I don't mind linux becoming more mainstream with some more userfriendly distros, *as long as* you are still able to play with it (with some less friendly distros like Debian or Gentoo i.e.).
And the OpenSource/Free nature of GNU/Linux makes me think it will always be possible. And that's what's really great about it.
Re:windows vb programmer speaks (Score:1)
Re:windows vb programmer speaks (Score:2)
Re:windows vb programmer speaks (Score:1)
but, as an operating system was produced that catered to both the "idiot user" and "geek-elite", it further cements the reality that Windows is in no way "superior" - but simply ubiquitous.
my personal belief is that the future of "personal computing" is in true idiot-catering machines like PDAs. the hunk of silicon my leg is resting on will be the realm of gamers and ueber-geeks. it'll die slowly, but it will be superseded.
Re:windows vb programmer speaks (Score:1)
-DrkShadow
Re:MCT replies (Score:1)
The only reason i use Windows is because i teach Windows NT/2000 courses as a Microsoft MCT. And the reason i teach this, is because it pays well (and it's easy to teach!).
I'm good at teaching, but making money as a linux teacher is not that easy.
btw I still have some OS/2 systems running...
cheers
My dream!! (Score:1)
I just wanted to make a comment about this. I would love if linux people made things braindead.. and also that you didn't have to use the command line. Personally I love command line stuff. That is my preferance. My big beef at windows is that I don't get enough use in the command line. After that when there is command line stuff its obscure and you gotta buy some big thick book... where really microsoft should have all that capability easily accessable and published on the web or when you buy the OS. At least with linux if it has a capability I can go out and find it for free on some linux documentation website either linux.org or some other reputable site. What I'd like to see for linux is somewhat of what this man talks about, but remember You don't have to get rid of the miniscule tweaking ability when you make the interface thats braindead easy. My dream is that it will have both. One day when I'm fealing lazy I can just start it up install.. do whatever and be done in like 10 minutes... The next day when I've got some pep in me I want to analyze everything and tweak it to my personal preference in every single miniscule detail.. but thats my dream..
Re:windows vb programmer speaks (Score:1)
[... the footer:]
C:\>tracert life.liberty.pursuit-of-happiness
no comment.