Finding the Right Online Credit Card Merchant? 90
"I have personally used Cybercash and Ibill for business to consumer type of online transactions and have successfully brought these into production use, but I am about to start a new project where this decision will be needed and would like to know... Which online merchant do you use and why? Also, which merchants do the major players (Amazon, et al) use?
Please spare me the hype about B-2-B and the 2/5/7 trillion dollar industry that it will become. It may become a big deal, but you can bet that the major companies are the ones who will be landing these types of contracts, not you and me. I still think the B-2-C industry is viable and there are many facets that have yet to be explored. There are opportunities for individuals and small companies to "merchantize" Web sites, as long as it is not prohibitively expensive from the online credit card merchant."
American Express refuses to do business with iBill (Score:2)
PayPal, perhaps? (Score:2)
And, since I gotta, use me (JArtis1@aol.com) as a referrer if you *DO* go that way...
Merchant Account and Secure Payment Gateway (Score:1)
Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:4)
What can I say? I think you're wrong in assuming that small B2C sites are viable in the long term, and you're going to be wasting your time unless you're offering something that cannot be found elsewhere. And let's face it, this isn't likely. Most specialised market sectors already have thriving international mail order areas, and you'd be competing with those.
Only a few of the major players around today will be the ones to survive the B2C backlash which has begun. Amazon probably will since it has a decent customer base and a good brand name, but smaller sites, such as yours I assume, will find it hard to compete against larger and/or more established competitors that can make savings you cannot.
On top of that the security issue is a major one. As a consultant I've often seen companies involved in managing online financial transactions that could be hacked into by my little sister, let alone someone who knows what they're doing. To be truly secure you either need to go with a large, established player who has a decent reputation or, even better, develop your own. Not easy, but secure and you know nobody's going to be selling your customer's information but you.
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Jon E. Erikson
Similarly (Score:4)
I'd like to find one that isn't for the sort of 'dumb webadmin' where they run all your shopping carts for you. I want a proper one that I can invoke from my own server, presumably by https that will leave my site feeling proper and professional.
Certainly I'm not overly impressed with some credit card systems online. The worldpay one is ugly and kept spawning new windows and using javascript refresh's to the point that even I (who regularly have about 50 windows open) was struggling to keep the plot. I've had other ones that dont properly track users and due to the fact that my modem connection broke midway through ordering they billed me twice (even though i was using a fixed IP dialup at the time i think). Surely that sort of inefficiency is inexcusable - especially considering 5 months later they STILL haven't refunded the money. Not wanting to name names [uk2.net] there are better places to get domain names like www.freeparking.co.uk.
there is no privacy (Score:1)
Thus, there cannot be a credit card that will protect your privacy.
bizrate could probably help you (Score:4)
Online bank... (Score:2)
Because of the global nature of the net, currency variations will kill this idea quickly. Say I put money into my deeferbank, in UK pounds. When I buy something, I can quote my bank details & do the encryption dance. The website I have just bought stuff from then gets sent the money in local currency from deeferbank. This is necessary for the small business who don't want to have to accept 10 different currencies online - deeferbank takes care of it all. So, at deeferbank, I am now exposed to the various vagaries of the currency markets. That is not the area for a dotcom to be in.
So I am shocked that some of the major banks haven't jumped on this already.
The world needs a new currency, which for the sake of argument I will call the eQuid.
You buy eQuids at the prevailing exchange rate, similar to the Euro. Online, everyone is therefore equal, small business are insulated from the worst swings in currency speculation, and consumers get to pay the price that the website stated, without any weird FX shift stuff when the bill finally arrives. Every site knows what an eQuid is, and where they are brokered.
So, there we have it. Introduce a new currency for online trading; it's the only way to ensure a level playing field for small and big business alike.
Strong data typing is for those with weak minds.
Various options (Score:5)
1) traditional merchant account (about $30 a month) + lower discount (% of each charge, usually 1.5%-3%) + per-charge flat fee ($.25 to .35).
All the major players have decent methods for integrating their system into your site, everything from hosting the whole shopping cart to various flavors of "your cgi page calls our cgi page, we do the transaction, we redirect back to some cgi of yours with the results". The hackery involved is trivial.
After having problems with one provider who had an annoying habit of randomly double-charging customers, I settled on Anacom [anacom.com] and they've been flawless. They've also been around a while.
Option 2 - charge without a Merchant Account. You pay about 1% more on the discount, but unless you're doing $3000 a month in sales or more, you still come out ahead. ProPay [propay.com] seems to be the leader here, but I have no personal experience with them [some of my SelfPromotion.com [selfpromotion.com] users have recommended them, though.
3) Indirect, using a web-bank service like PayPal [paypal.com], which just announced a business service. The rates seem a little better if memory serves, but the downside is that people have to be paypal users to use it. My advice is that you should offer PayPal as an OPTION along with (1) or (2) above.
Best,R
So many choices, let your customer decide? (Score:1)
I'll do it (Score:1)
Go on, you can trust me.
Small companies get B2B (Score:2)
I must first of all comment about B2B and small companies. We are small and most (80%) of our customers are B2B. In fact these are the businesses we target as they can actually afford to build a "REAL" website.
On the CC Front, we have a reseller agreement with a local merchant account company. One of our employees specializes in this area. We have connected our customers sites with both CyberCash and AuthorizeNet. We actually prefer AuthorizeNet. They have a virtual terminal customers can use to run cards manually, a real plus. I have read reports about up time problems with Authorizenet but I have had very few problems. AuthorizeNet is also more cost effective than CyberCash.
Re:Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:3)
Firstly, I don't think Amazon is going to survive long term. Yeah, they'll still be there in another 1-2 years, but to me that's short term. I don't think Amazon is gonna make it another ten years. Anyway, we'll have to wait and see how it plays out. They can't continue to hemorrhage money and stay in business, no matter how many customers they have. It's simple economics. Once the VC cash is spent and there's not profit, there's nothing but Chapter 11.
Secondly, while I don't think that the B2C model has much of a future on the web, I do think that the web offers smaller merchants and individuals an opportunity to reach a larger market with their unique wares for less money than any other currently available method. You're right though, the company or individual must be offering something truly unique in order to survive. However, in the case of individuals or extremely small companies (2-5 people) their survival needs (in terms of income) are modest compared to the big guys, like Amazon. So, it will be easier for an individual to keep an ecommerce site going as long as the balance sheet is positive.
While we're at it, I'll touch on the security issue. Yeah, security is paramount. You must protect the information that the consumer has provided to you from theft by others. This is really a liability issue. You don't want to get sued. As for your statement that no one else is selling your customer's info, well that's just preposterous. Banks, credit card processors, and credit reporting agencies are selling your information all the time. Why do you think you keep getting all those cold calls from companies you've never heard of, trying to sell you crap you don't need? It's because you have a credit card and everything that you've ever bought with it is available to the highest bidder.
You have no privacy, get over it.
Credit Cards... (Score:2)
Credit Cards! Greedy corporations! (Score:1)
The Internet is not about the buying, selling or processing of any objects or services! The Internet was designed for the FREE exchange of Information and Ideas; a community for users which has become polluted by the greedy, money-grubbing evil capitalistic corporations which seek to destroy our Internet!
Fight it! Don't use credit cards! Don't buy things online! We need to run these big corporations out of town and return the rule of the Web to the individual people!
Re:Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:2)
You are about as ridiculous as a "let's open source Natalie Portman [olsentwins.com]" post.
QuickCommerce (Score:1)
Ones to avoid... (Score:3)
These are, netbanx.com and planetpayment.com.
Reasons:
Netbanx: thoroughly unprofessional, aimed at the idiot using Frontpage or Actinic Catalog, no answer whatsoever at technical support (that's both email and phone, folks), took 2 MONTHS to set up the account, obscene charges, takes 60 days for Netbanx to release payments to the account holder.
Planet Payment: have been trying to set this account up for over 5 MONTHS now, have been sent usernames and passwords for their 'payment gate' only to find that they don't work - to be issued with some more, again not working passwords, very US centric, and obscene requirements (we had to fax copies of the director's damn PASSPORTS to them!).
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jambo
system.admin.without.a.clue
Why use CC? Use Pay-pal & E-Gold? (Score:2)
Re:bizrate could probably help you (Score:1)
Re:Various options (Score:2)
1. Ability to handle international transactions.
2. Integration into my own site.
3. No monthly fees.
4. Freedom from worry about sales taxes.
Brian
"A witty saying proves nothing."
You may have Karma... (Score:1)
The Divine Creatrix in a Mortal Shell that stays Crunchy in Milk
NEWS! (Score:1)
"31337 h4xx0r" josh1 has made a quantum leap in online computing!!!
Allegedly, on 20th July 2000, the slashdot troll and compulsive masturbator discovered an amazing new feature on his new Windows 3.1 computer - that of "cut and paste".
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Strong data typing is for those with weak minds.
There is no good deal for CCs on line (Score:3)
So, choose who you want, but you won't get a good deal.
Re:Credit Cards... (Score:2)
That's not a smart business decision, at least not right now. The majority of people are comfortable using credit cards and would prefer them over a service they aren't familiar with. A business owner can't afford to say "I hate credit cards; I'm not going to let my customers use them."
Re:Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:2)
I think you're wrong in assuming that small B2C sites are viable in the long term
Why on earth not ? I think the key here is "frictionless". OK, so that's yet-another piece of Marketroid-speak, but there's a core of truth in it. On the web, the little guy is nothing like as disadvantaged against the big guy as for IRL commerce. If you have a product, web commerce might be just the way to sell it. It's really not that hard to find a product niche that's narrow enough to make you a serious player in that field and the costs of getting on-line are now small.
I think we're going to see a resurgence in small scale manufacturing or importing. One or two people make a product that's distinctive, or can buy a cheap Chinese version of it and sell it with Western marketing (ie marketing by people who understand the Western consumer, not necessarily Western-style). The web hosting gets outsourced, and maybe even much of the fulfillment. Easier than running a physical shop, and you don't have to spend all day sitting behind the counter waiting for customers.
A useful parallel is Japanese outsourced manufacturing in the '70s. Much of the component production or module assembly was done by small family businesses, working in a space the size of a garage. Traditions were such that even large corporates weren't afraid to buy from a tiny supplier, if they could make a product worth buying. In the West we threw these people out of the manufacturing chain from Ford's day to their eventual extinction in WW2.
Re:Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:1)
Hey I did'nt notice but your user ID is quite high for a long timer. Anyway.
It's not that hard to get karma, even when I go on a flame spree, I make more positive Karma than negative.
shameless pitch (Score:2)
Integration is via a very simple thin API (using Baltimore libraries to protect card details in transmission if its a remote site) - we have language bindings in C, Perl, Java, TCL (I think), ColdFusion and a COM object for ASP's on win32 platforms.
Assuming that you want a managed service then we charge is a flat 1% of transaction revenue (on top of whatever your aquirer charges) and provide secure online authorisation, settlement, credit and reversal functionality - the ability to process a large number of different card types (MC, Visa, Amex, JCB, Delta, etc...).
In addition the bureau provides fraud detection functionality (card velocity checking, blacklists, max/min order values etc...)
If you're interested then take a look at
http://www.commercelink.co.uk/
(appologies for the ugly site - its being rebuilt)
or drop me an email
cheers
Tom
How does PayPal do it? (Score:1)
I'm asking because I'm looking for a way to do something similar myself -- to be able to process CC transactions without requiring my (very small) customers to each get merchant accounts...
Thanks.
Re:Similarly (Score:1)
Try Quickbooks (Score:1)
You can set up a web interface, or charge through the Quickbooks 2000 accounting package.
A legit, registered installation of Quickbooks 2000 or 2000 Pro is required to use this!
It was easy to set up, and I got approved in less than 24 hours.
Just my 2 cents, check it out here. [quickbooks.com]
Re: High user id (Score:1)
Check out datacash.com in the UK (Score:4)
As far as I can tell, we're the most clueful PSP in the UK. I think we're the only ones to have done a proper re-implementation of the banking protocols, and our solutions are implemented using Perl running on Linux. Our client-side code is all open sourced using the X11 license, and we provide Perl, C, and Java implemetations for Unix and NT, as well as more than one shopping cart implementation. And we have some really cool stuff lined up, including eFalcon fraud detection and some other things I can't talk about just now.
My work address is what you might guess (the local part is "paul"), so feel free to mail me any questions, though where appropriate I reserve the right to pass them on to the enquiries address in London!
--
Re:Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:1)
Re:Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:2)
If you were being asked to invest, it sounds like you'd say no. Which is fine. But you are really talking about the short term viability of B2C, not the long term. There are consumers, there are businesses, therefore, B2C: one does not need to aspire to becoming Amazon; all you need are enough customers to keep you profitable. As a consultant, I'm sure you realize that efficient online marketplaces (called B2B) are what enable efficient B2C. So first forget about that remark you made about "more established competitors can make savings you cannot" -- for the long term. You would have to deny that B2B decreases transaction costs, aka the "economies of scale" in the physical world. The whole point of B2B is to break that down, and B2C will therefore benefit. The huge merger activity we are seing is evidence to the contrary - B2B has not worked yet. Not yet. All the B2B investors think that it will. Long term - we're talking five, ten, twenty, fifty years. Not tomorrow.
Second, the "major players" will never, ever, I repeat, never ever be able to provide worthwhile personalized service (despite AI and buying circles). Big organizations will be focused on the profitability of individual customers if they attempt to maintain a customer relationship rather than being an anonymous storefront. There is - and will be - tremendous opportunity for small B2C outfits organized around real personalized services for specific markets - as small as they wanna be - who tap into online marketplaces and specialize in custom, small quantity one-off manufacturing (remember that efficient B2B thing) to do what no Amazon could ever do. In this way the internet means the destruction of the mass market in the long term, which as B2C written all over it. But long term. Probably not in the next few years.
But you're right to criticize individual B2C outfits today, as B2B is so obviously where it's at, except for half.com, who claims they are C2C (and zero to $300 million in 9 months proves... um, something.)
Serious Advice (Score:3)
On two points:
First, Whoever you go with, read the terms and conditions before you sign up. They do differ, and if you're in the US, your protection against unfair contract terms is very weak indeed (by the standards I'm used to). A couple of hours patient and careful reading (using a photocopier to blow the small print up to A3 helps lots) and comparison will pay dividends. It's rarely harder to understand than source code, and usually a lot easier.
If there's anything you don't understand, that's what lawyers are for (and, incidentally, pitching up with a prepared list of questions will endear you no end to your lawyer and take quite a lot off the bill.).
Second, If you're in the UK, or for that matter anywhere in the EU that has already implemented the Data Protection Directive (I think everywhere has), then you have an obligation to make sure (no further than asking, nicely, for a warranty that this is so) that the card supplier has proper data protection in place.
I've had more than a couple of these across my desk in the last three months, and most of them refer to the last Data Protection Act (the 1984 one now nearly completely defunct) and none at all - prior my ministrations - spoke at all of the need for someone in the relationship to take care of the obligation to process data fairly.
As usual, this is general advice - and on the first point about as general and obvious as "don't forget to eat, sleep and breathe" - not specific recommendations for your circumstances (which I'm almost certainly not licensed to give in your jurisdiction). Anyone daft enough to rely on stuff they find on the web when making decisions that might cost them money or liberty is probably dim enought to try suing in spite of a clear disclaimer, so I'm not really sure why I bother with this.
Re:Check out datacash.com in the UK (Score:1)
GoEmerchant is easier. (Score:1)
From the processors point of view... (Score:4)
There are a number (over a dozen) small companies like ours that offer credit card processing and do it better (in many cases) than the big guys. You get better rates and MUCH better customer service will a smaller company.
There are other things you need to watch for that credit card merchant providers don't tell you:
1) Many merchant accounts have a ratio of USA to International credit cards they can accept (example, you must processes 5 US cards for every 1 international card to maintain the lowest rate).
2) There are always hidden fees, make sure you understand them. The common fees including a minimum monthly amount, statement fees, address verification, voice processing, chargeback research, mailing fees, keyed vs non-keyed rates, etc....
3) There are a lot of people that advertise low merchant rates but they are quoting "Merchant is present, you see the card and you have checked the person's ID" rates. The fine print might state that the "MOTO" (mail order-telephone order) rate is a full percent higher (and more in some cases)
4) Make sure your gateway uses some form of encryption. Many gateways out there, including some very popular systems, provide binary files for their API and you have no way of knowing how it works and if it is secure or not.
Plug:
We private label our API seprately and as part of our instant e-commerce builder at http://www.n2plus.com. Lowest rates around. E-mail me directly if you have more questions, I've been processing credit cards on the net for 6 years as a business.
Re:Similarly (Score:2)
Moderate up--Online Merchant Accounts explained (Score:2)
For those who haven't tried running a retail business online, here is a basic description of how it usually works.
For you, the retailer, there are many important issues involved. You have the shopping basket application, secure CGI gateway, Merchant services, order processing and tracking, inventory and payment/order integration into your backend accounting package. This amounts to a lot of work especially for a smaller retail operation. There is a lot of responsibility involved (read liability) in handling credit card information. There is a lot of somewhat difficult programming involved integrating your frontend into the merchant account backend and providing a secure ordering environment. And last, but certainly not least, entering the transactions and inventory changes into your accounting/inventory software.
When looking for a good merchant services company there are many things to consider besides what fees are involved. Many merchant companies are adding extra value by providing extra services that make things easier for you. Maintaining your website, filling orders, maintaining inventory and keeling you accounting books current is quite a bit of work. Messing with CGI and worrying about order security are somthing you should look to your merchant services provider for.
With all that said, the best, easiest system I've been thus far is GoEmerchant [goemerchant.com]. They provide the secure payment gateway and merchant services. They can even host your website with little extra charge. They will custom format emailed sales reports so you can easily import them into your accounting package backend. This product is realted to Cybercash. No, I'm not a salesman, but I've done a lot of research after having tried it the hard way with traditional merchant services. Just check these guys out along with the other services that are appearing to make life easier for Online retailers.
Re:GoEmerchant is easier. (Score:1)
Anyone know any good credit card places with good CGI interfaces?
Re:How does PayPal do it? (Score:3)
Hi Dan!
Funny you should mention this. The question of whether PayPal is liable in the event of a fraudulent auction is very much in the news (here is the article on MSNBC [msnbc.com].
Short version: some wise guy auctions off hard drives on Yahoo! to a steady stream of customers. Encourages auction "winners" to pay by PayPal. Those who paid by check got their mail back from the U.S. Postal Service saying no such address exists--those who paid by PayPal got zip.
PayPal is emphasizing that they are a means of facilitating exchange between two parties--they are not a credit card, and they are not a bank. Their terms of service explicitly deny any responsibility to either party in a transaction if the other fails to do something (like ship the goods).
In other words, PayPal is covered legally. How PayPal will fare in the court of public opinion may be another question. And yet another question is whether PayPal will be able to escape the attention of the U.S. government. What PayPal is doing, after all, looks very very much like a bank processing EFT (electronic funds transfer). The courts are going to laugh at Indianapolis regulating video games--but they won't have any problem at all with the idea of the federal government banking authorities regulating an e-business that looks, walks, and sounds like a bank.
I'll reply in another note on a slightly different thread.
My Quest for a Merchant Account (Score:1)
I can never find any information on how to use the account. The pages just had nothing but marketing, you order then you are suppose to give it to your programmers.
One thing I suggest is make sure to ask for documentation so you can see how good or bad their service is.
Re:Various options (Score:1)
Check it out there receiving money fee is 0.6%.
Jonathan
Re:How does PayPal do it? (Score:3)
Hi Dan!
The way PayPal works is that each person is depositing money with PayPal. You can deposit money with PayPal by writing a check, by charging your credit card, or by giving PayPal permission to charge your card. PayPal permits you (the whole point is to encourage you) to trade PayPal play money with your friends--such as on auction sites. PayPal promises that any time you want your money back, they'll send it--by crediting a credit card, or sending a check, etc. The result is that PayPal is the merchant that is charging the credit card--not the seller in an auction. Both the buyer and the seller are PayPal customers.
Note that PayPal is free. How do they make money? MSNBC notes that they have racked up 2.4 million customers. If each has $50 in PayPal credits, that's $120 million of no-interest capital that PayPal has to play with. Given the number of semi-pro computer hardware merchants on EBay that are hyping PayPal, I'd bet that they have even more money than that. Even at a meager 5% return on investment, that's $6.0 million per year in revenue. Not bad for a B2C e-commerce business.
I have looked into the same thing. I'm a (very minor) official of the U.S. sanctioning body for one of the horse sports. Our competitions are organized by local promoters--each promoter will typically run one or two events a year. A lot of organizers want to take entries over the Web--but accepting credit cards is a stumbling block. (More precisely, paying a $35 monthly fee 12 months out of the year in order to accept payments in the month of August puts a lot of people off.)
The financial and technical solution is to have the sanctioning body act as the merchant--the money is paid to the sanctioning body, which in turn transfers funds simultaneously to accounts managed by the local organizer. This is much more palatable for the credit card processors--they get a large organization processing hundreds of thousands of dollars per month. BUT--it requires a measure of trust between the local organizers and the sanctioning body. That's why I said we have the financial and technical solution, as opposed to the political solution. (The organizers pay fees to the sanctioning body--they fear, probably correctly, that some day some bright light is going to realize that the sanctioning body could just take the fees right off the top. They want their money, and they want to determine how much gets paid to the sanctioning body at what time.)
If this looks at all like your situation, I think the financial and technical part is easy. The really big question is the political one--is there a strong bond of trust between the small not-quite-merchants and the parent entity? If there is, then the solution works. If there is not, I'd strongly recommend not pursuing this--just a little bit of mistrust can lead to terrible squabbling.
Signio... (Score:2)
We also use Wells Fargo for the acquiring bank which doesn't do a per transaction fee.
http://www.signio.com/
http://biz.wellsfargo.com/products/merchant/int
Re:PayPal, perhaps? (Score:2)
Re:GoEmerchant is easier. (Score:1)
I use paypals (Score:2)
There is no cost to it, but it does take 3-5 days to transfer money in your paypals account to your linked bank account.
I'm not complaining, but are trying to use the float to make money. I'm not blaming them, I'd do the same myself.
iBill (Score:1)
I highly recommend iBill. We have been using them for over two years now and they have worked out very well for us.
One of the best things about iBill is that they offer 24 hour voice support for merchants. They also offer a great variety of payment methods in addition to credit card. You can also allow your customers to pay via a 900 line and bill it to their phone, as well as online check payments. Everything is managed through one central interface.
Further, they have a new affiliate program, so you can do revenue sharing on your Web site without much of a hassle. This is a great way to drive more traffic to your site, and it's all administered on their end (no cutting checks for partners).
Another cool thing is that you don't need an Internet merchant account to get started. BUT, you can upgrade to this later and keep all the code you have developed and without making your customers migrate to a new payment method.
We process a few hundred thousand dollars worth of transactions a year and have looked at the other services, but they just don't seem to offer the same flexibility that iBill does. Case
Some advice based on experience (Score:1)
We recently went through a similar decision at my employer, a retail web site. We evaluated several options, including CyberCash, CyberSource, and ClearCommerce.
The thing about CyberCash and CyberSource is that they just act like middle-men between your system and back end credit card processors like Paymentech or VisaNet, who actually interact with customer banks. In addition to the per-transaction charges you get from the back-end processor, you'll also see per-transaction charges from CyberSource and CyberCash, so if you've got really high volume it could turn out to be rather expensive, even with sliding payment scales.
ClearCommerce is a little different: it's a software product that lets you interface your system directly with the back end processors. It's also significantly more expensive up front; however, I'm told that it pays for itself (compared to CyberCash or CyberSource) after a few years. We went with them at my employer, and I've found it to be ok - the Java API (the one I'm most familar with) is clear, and they were able to provide both higher level documentation (in PDF format) and javadoc documentation (which suggests to me that they "get" java development.)
The impression I've gotten from talking both to salesmen and to developers at other e-commerce companies is that a lot of vendors go with CyberCash, but once their volume gets to a certain point they switch to CyberSource, and then on to something else like ClearCommerce.
Re:Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:1)
Field Report: Intuit (Score:2)
But, in my experience, it is not going to be the organizations themselves that will be the deciding factor, but rather the software. (At least in the public sector). If you are a developer, or designing your own, it definatly is the company.
*Carlos: Exit Stage Right*
"Geeks, Where would you be without them?"
Re:Credit Card Merchants in CANADA ? (Score:1)
Matt.
http://www.fairtunes.com
It depends on the country, but... (Score:1)
With regards the argument concerning B-2-B and B-2-C and their futures, I think you're all forgetting one very simple fact. The world, and the Internet is a great deal bigger than the USA and/or Canada. There are still plenty of oppurtunities out there because there are some pretty immense markets out there that are in countries only just waking upto the Internet.
You can argue that the big players in the US and Europe are going to take a lead in those countries, but unfortunately the business minds of the new economy appear to be xenophobics, and so as long as you don't mind talking to people who don't speak English as their first language (and yeah, there are some out there apparently), you can still make a killing (although if you choose Russia, you may be subject to one instead unless you know the right people).
--
Re:Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:2)
Hmmmmmmm... consider the post WWII development of:
East Germany/West Germany.
North Korea/South Korea.
China/Taiwan.
Just how many would you LIKE?
Setting up my website right now... (Score:2)
<shameless plug>
I'm in the process of setting up on-line ordering on my website [pjrc.com] right now. Most of the website is technical resources for building electronic projects using embedded processors. A recent addition, that we expect to need the on-line ordering for, is the open source MP3 player [pjrc.com], which today is a primitive first generation design, but hopefully soon I'll have a nicely redesigned version.
</shameless plug>
Fortunately, my partner is an accountant, which has really helped. She set up a proper visa merchant account with our bank. It cost $100 up front. They take $0.65 per sale, plus approx 3%. There's a minimum $15 monthly charge, so hopefully we'll actually sell at least $500/month. The visa charges are entered using a touch-tone phone, so we didn't have to buy any equipment. They offer a terminal, for (I think) $450. With the terminal, we would get a per-sale charge of $0.07, and a little lower percentage of the sale, about 2.5% as I recall. They let you buy and add the terminal anytime you want.
It looks like there's a free software package called CCVS - Credit Card Verification System [redhat.com] which allows your linux (or unix) box to emulate a terminal (requires a dedicated modem)... but there's a catch. It needs to be loaded with an encryption key. Redhat sells these keys for approx $1000. If anyone knows someone who can provide a key for CCVS for less, please contact me [mailto]. Robin found a similar windoze based program, where they wanted a monthly charge and some percentage of the sale, on top of the percentage taken by the bank! Not cool, but I wouldn't run a windows server even if it was affordable.
Setting up the SSL stuff on the webserver is relatively easy, but you need a cert. VeriSign [verisign.com] charges $350, so we went with Thawte [thawte.com], who only wanted $125 (even though they're now owned by Verisign). Again, robin did most of the work there. I generated the CSR from the server software, and she faxed them copies of our LLC papers and other business stuff. About a week later we got the cert. The cert lasts for only one year, you it looks like we have to pay $125 every year. I hope they don't jack their price up to Verisign's level!
Robin ran a test charge onto her credit card a couple days ago, and it seems to be working very nicely. The merchant appears as "PJRC.COM, LLC", which I think is much cooler than "ibill...some number".
For the on-line shopping cart, I looked at a couple of them, but they didn't have that look and feel that I want for my website, so I've been rolling my own. It's turned out to be a bit more coding than I originally thought, but still not too bad, and I'm really happy with the results. When the order is confirmed, the code just sends Robin and I an email, and makes sure the data stored in our database really matches what they filled out on the form.
I'm putting the final finishing touches on the cgi scripts right now, and hopefully it'll be on-line later tonight!
Credit Card Processing via the Internet (Score:1)
Re:How does PayPal do it? (Score:1)
Who we're going with (Score:1)
Signio has since been purchased by Verisign and is now called Verisign Payment Services.
The reason why Signio came so highly recommended were for several reasons:
Obviously you're going to need a Merchant account. Singio has partnered with numerous banks and financial institutions.
Anyway, they seem to be top-notch.
-k
Comment removed (Score:4)
http://www.ccslide.com/ (Score:1)
Has anyone had good/bad experiences with them, or is it a scam?
http://www.ccslide.com/ [ccslide.com]
Re:BAHAHAHAHAHA (Score:1)
AuthorizeNet and other experiences (Score:2)
AuthorizeNet has done pretty well and has reasonable response time on their support. However they did have a several hour outage last week for unknowns reasons. They never told us what happened before, during, or after. (I assume an NT-powered database crashed and took half the day to reboot/restore.) Other than that it's been real nice. They have several interfaces you can use, although the documentation isn't complete yet. We're using the one where we accept the credit card info (for recurring billing later) over our secure server and then send it to their secure server gateway with an https POST. They process it and send back a simple delimited response about how well it went. This is easily implemented in perl, and I'm in the process of rewriting our current interface to their system as a perl module.
Avoid IBill, Cardservice is mediocre (Score:2)
Shortly after IBill I switched to Cardservice. I was a lot more impressed with the flexibility of their system right off the bat, and I would still say that is one of their best qualities. The problem that I had with them was that the person who set up my account, Michael Wentzell, did so improperly such that all of my transactions were creditted to a different user's account (funny thing, though, they had no problem deducting the montly fee from the account that was supposed to have been creditted). After a month of not recieving any credits (it was supposed to take around 48 hours after a sale, but I wasn't sure of this) I called Michael Wentzell up to see what was going on. He said that he was sorry about the problem, that he had found it, and it would be fixed within a week. Well, it wasn't fixed. I called him back about two weeks later and he told me the same thing. This game of me calling him and him telling me it was fixed now went on for several months until I got sick of it and went over his head to Cardservice's corporate headquarters. It was an absolute nightmare trying to get them to fix this as they refused to take responsibility for the problem or even help me figure out what the problem was. I kept getting bounced between Cardservice and Authorize.net (Cardservice resells Authorize.net's services) because nobody at either place actually wanted to help me, it seemed. Well, I finally got ahold of somebody at Cardservice who said they could fix the problem and she yelled at me for not reporting the problem right away (apparently, in her mind I was responsible for their salesman's lack of action)! Anyway, that finally got straightened out and I was too sick of dealing with people like this to try switching again. Their service works OK now that it works (it's down sometimes), and at least porn doesn't magically appear in my customers' carts. I don't know what their other salespeople are like, so maybe Michael Wentzell is an anomoly.
Re:bizrate could probably help you (Score:1)
Re:AuthorizeNet and other experiences (Score:1)
Making money from the float (Score:2)
Re:Online bank... (Score:1)
So at some point, I'll need to convert from eQuids to local, and I'll still take the exchange-rate risk AND there have now been 2 exchange commissions instead of 1.
Re:PayPal, perhaps? (Score:1)
More critically, the extra layer loses accountability. Someone used PayPal to set up an account on a credit card number stolen from me. Then payed out the maximum (probably to themselves). Paypal refused to tell either me *or* my credit card company who was paid.
Re:Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:1)
Internet Secure CC company (Score:1)
Re:How does PayPal do it? (Score:1)
Re: (Score:1)
Re:Credit Cards... (Score:2)
Re:Try Quickbooks (Score:1)
Re:Try Quickbooks (Score:1)
Re:My two cents (minus 14% transaction fee) (Score:1)
The reason I ask: Recently a customer of a B2C site I help run, used their webcertificate.com account to pay for merchandise. The transaction was supposed to look like a regular MasterCard (or so I understand) to our shopping cart, but it reported errors. However, our payment processor (Verisign Payment Services) received and authorized the transaction.
Any idea what might've caused the errors? We use Shopsite Manager SC [shopsite.com] from OpenMarket [openmarket.com]. We contacted the customer and "did the right thing", but I'm curious about services like webcertificate.com. Thanks for any clues!
THIS IS THE PROBLEM !!! (Score:1)
Credit Card Auths on the internet (Score:1)
Re:Long-term viability of B2C model (Score:1)
I have to agree with this statement. I am a partner in a small (7 people) B2C company that started in bricks and has expanded into clicks. Our cash needs are small, and while we'd like to get some VC, it's really not necessary for us to stay in business. We are building this company the old-fashioned way (go figure!), slowly and carefully. We have been profitable since our third month in e-commerce and we continue to be profitable. Barring some unforseeable catastrophe, I have no doubt that we will continue to be in business for the long-term.
Beware of business plans that fit on cocktail napkins.
Credit Cards In Australia (Score:1)
alternative to cc (Score:1)
Recommendation (Score:1)
Of course, *I* think the best part is that they run exclusively (well, not counting their own in-house code) on free software. All their servers run Red Hat, and they use Apache for both of their websites and (I believe) Postgres as their database.
You can probably drop a line to customerservice@trustcommerce.com [mailto] if you want a quote.
(Usual disclaimer is attached: I'm not a customer, I've just seen how they do business and am impressed. More importantly, they run on the kind of powerhouse servers that geeks like me have dreams about...)
Re:How does PayPal do it? (Score:1)
Re:Similarly (Score:1)
As for being ugly, it's actually quite customisable, if you make the effort.
Re:Why use CC? Use Pay-pal & E-Gold? (Score:1)
Using paypal is only slightly better than sending a cashier's check in advance; and e-gold a couple of steps above that (which may be better than a cut-all-costs CC provider, of course...).
Re:Why use CC? Use Pay-pal & E-Gold? (Score:2)
As a consumer (and someone who has had to stoop to selling credit card packages from time to time) I also have to note that a lot of credit cards aren't nearly all they claim to be. Sure they protect the people in the better programs but often they screw over anyone they don't think would have enough $ to make a decent lawsuit against them.
Re:Signio... (Score:1)