CD-ROMs with Books -- Worth Your While? 61
An anonymous submitter sends: "I'm working on a new book which would have the Open Source/Linux/BSD/etc community as its target audience, and the editors are very interested in having a CD-ROM included with it. I personally feel that a CD only adds a few bucks to the cost for negligible benefit, since the code is probably outdated by the time you get it. What are your thoughts? Do you get something out of having the code on CD, or would you rather have references in the book or online and download the software yourself? (And lest you wonder why I'm posting as AC, this is a serious question, not a PR attempt.)" I have several technical books with CD-ROMs. I've never used any of them. I'd rather the book have an accompanying website to provide code and errata. But maybe other people feel differently.
One word: (Score:1)
More words (Score:1)
Book on the CD (Score:5, Insightful)
Put the code on the website, most everyone has internet access. If you are concerned about those who do not, have a mail in offer for the CD and charge for the price of shipping & handling.
Re:Book on the CD (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Book on the CD (Score:2)
mail-in offer bad idea (Score:1)
Even in a networked world, it's good to have CDs. If I go on a long trip, I always bring debian-powerpc-nonus disc 1 or 1, so I can boot off of it in case something goes wrong and I can't get to a solid network. I have to burn my own image, of course, but if I had an Official Debian GNU/Linux CD that came with a book I'd probably prefer that, just because it would deteriorate slightly more slowly.
And there's a lot to be said for having a frozen image of how the code looked when the book was released. Updates, and even full code, on the website, yes, but also, if it's like a book that describes a specific version of GCC or something, having exactly the version that the author used has its advantages (and disadvantages).
Worthless (Score:3)
Go with the website. (Score:3, Insightful)
Maybe the topic can determine the level of the audience. If your book has an animal on the cover, go with the website. If the title includes "in 21 days" then go with the CD.
Re:Go with the website. (Score:3, Funny)
What if your book is How to Make Your Man Behave in 21 Days or Less Using the Secrets of Professional Dog Trainers [amazon.com] ?
Re:Go with the website. (Score:1)
Yeah. . . Well. . . (Score:2, Insightful)
1) Some people dig that kind of thing.
2) CDs would probably be a lot cheaper to make, although they would still be a rip-off to purchase. We already know that CDs are cheaper than tapes, a secret that the record industry failed to keep.
3) CDs are more portable, and it would be nice if you could save the CD-book to your hard drive.
4) CDs obviously can present better visual and audio media. A CD-Book would kind of be the DVD for the literature industry. . . More features and knick-knacks, deleted chapters, yadda yadda.
Of course, this doesn't mean that people won't copy them and threaten to destroy the industry's efforts at the multimedia market.
Meanwhile, I find that CDs included with books can help only if they can easily illustrate what the book says. A good example is the character creation CD that was sold along with 3rd edition D&D players' guides. Include more useful information and programs on the CD.
Re:Yeah. . . Well. . . (Score:1)
I'm taking courses at the University of Phoenix, and my wife is on a schedule one class behind me. Usually she uses my textbooks as soon as I'm done with them.
Recently, however, my dog had a bout of gastrointestinal discomfort and expressed her opinion of the book (and mine, for that matter) all over pages 3-128. The book was a loss, but the whole thing was in PDF format with the included CD, so we tossed the book and let my wife read from the monitor for her course.
If that's not an appropriate use for technology, I don't know what is.
Depends on the target audience (Score:2, Interesting)
My experience (Score:5, Insightful)
When I was younger, I bought a Java book that came with a CD. In those days I didn't have high-speed internet, and (more importantly) I didn't really have much understanding of how to research things, or find out which packages were best for me.
I would recommend that if your book takes the attitude that your readers are experienced and savvy, a few words on locations to find the software would be much more valuable than the value-added-CD that comes in the back. But if you're targetting a crowd that perhaps isn't as comfortable navigating, finding out which versions of software to trust and rely on, then I would say definitely include your "Picks" for which software packages are trustworthy, up-to-date, et cetera.
Chances are, the advanced user wouldn't trust the CD, so code out-datedness wouldn't be as crucial, whereas the beginner would be satisfied not having bleeding-edge code.
These are just my opinions - I know that I typically no longer use CDs that come with the books I buy, but I also know that if I were a beginner (particularly modem-based) I would probably swear by them.
Re:My experience (Score:1)
Re:My experience (Score:1)
Mostly, don't bother (Score:2, Interesting)
Apart from that, anyone who does open source or other types of coding already has net access, so it is not worth even a few bucks. For just source code and maybe some binaries, just make sure you have a good web or ftp site available.
I have dozens of CDROMs that came with books that I have never touched. The one exception was one that had a 50MB source tar that I didn't feel like waiting to download from a slow site.
Competition (Score:3, Interesting)
Usually more than a few $$ (Score:2, Interesting)
My 2 cents (Score:2, Interesting)
However, whenever I hit a snag I reach for that book. As much as I love technology there is nothing easier than looking in the index of a book and finding (hopefully) what you need quickly and easily.
I've done it 4 times today alone.
CD great for dialup readers. (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:CD great for dialup readers. (Score:2)
I'll second that. If the volume of useful data (ie, I don't already have comparable files) is greater than about 80 megs, the CD is still worthwhile to me. At 56k, a full-sized ISO can take over a day to download! Sure, I can drop in on a friend's workplace, local college lab, inet cafe, lax library, etc., but when I don't even know what I'm getting til I've got it, that becomes an annoyance.
Speaking as someone who lives where cable/DSL is not very cost-effective (or dependable) even where it is available, the time to download is just too precious. I'll happily pay the extra buck for the book with the CD. Even if I never use it. Especially if I never use it. Who wants to spend the time downloading at 56k, only to decide it wasn't worth it.
And put me down as a second on including a searchable PDF of the book.
Website (Score:2)
Put the book on the CD (Score:5, Insightful)
Everything else I prefer to have on a website. Of course if the website ever becomes defunct and I go to look for it I'm not a happy camper.
Re:Put the book on the CD (Score:1)
Well put. Please allow me to amplify your remarks...
I have purchased several books that provide their complete text in HTML format on CD (Design Patterns, The Perl CD Bookshelf, The UNIX CD Bookshelf, etc.) and I use them quite often. There are two issues that are important enough to me to make me seek out such books:
I'll agree with most of the other posters, though, in stating that I rarely use CDs that contain only supplemental material. But having the full text of a book in electronic format is a huge benefit.
Nahhh (Score:2)
In short I think the CDs are added to justify selling a $70 text book for $128. $58 multiplied by all the text books I had to buy... Well I'd have less college debt right now.
Actually, if you believe in free software... (Score:5, Insightful)
Secondly, I have a broadband connection, but I find I reach for the CD first because it's right there and it's easier/faster/etc.
Lastly, I have a book which doesn't include the source code on an media, but does include it online - the problem is that it doesn't include COMMENTS! The code printed in the book does have comments, so I can only assume they are trying to make the online code useful only to those that have the book - the reality being that it's almost less useful.
It adds a buck. It is useful for 10% of those who buy it, and it is a marketting gimmick. There really isn't a reason to not go with it.
But PLEASE include the text of the book on CD if you can manage it! PLEASE?!??!
-Adam
Re:Actually, if you believe in free software... (Score:2)
Depends what's on the CD (Score:4, Interesting)
1) when the subject material requires access to an application larger than 20-30 MB (big enough so that downloading the latest version isn't practical for some people)
2) a searchable reference. Whether the reference is supplemental to the book or is the exact same material as the book, having it in a searchable electronic format can be very nice.
Books with CDs (Score:3, Insightful)
My problems with CDs in books are:
Re:Books with CDs (Score:2)
Re:Books with CDs (Score:2)
How soon they forget. Just two weeks ago SlashDot ran a story on Flexible CDs [slashdot.org] which you could easily stick in the back of a paperback book since its just a flexible as paperback book cover.
I think a CD is better choice since if you think about the bandwidth requirements of running a website where EVERYONE will be able to access the software versus the minimal one time cost of a CD, I think the CD will be cheaper and will increase sales as long as you don't increase the cost of the book by more than the actual production cost of the CD (which likely would violate the GPL anyway if you're distributing any GPL s/w on the CD).
Depends on the book (Score:4, Interesting)
Why? Well, what use is a four year old copy of Python when I can download a current version just as easily? I'd have been happier if that one was a couple bucks cheaper, just as I was happy about the blurbs on the back of Philip & Alex's Guide to Web Publishing [arsdigita.com] and Mac OS9 Missing Manual [oreilly.com] saying that avoiding the cd keeps costs down while allowing you to get more up to date software. As a paying customer, I appreciate that sort of consideration for my needs and my wallet. So to me, it's kind of a tradeoff among several factors. In no particular order:
Deciding what way to go is a matter of looking at factors like these & others, and evaluating what you're trying to provide for your customer and what their expectations are likely to be over time. If the digital material is just a supplement to the book, and can be easily downloaded, then most customers will probably appreciate it if you save them a few bucks & don't include the CD. On the other hand, if the book is really a supplement to the discs, and the digital material is difficult or impossible to download (for bandwidth, copyright, or other reasons) then including the CD media is a good idea. Find out where things seem to balance and make your decision from there.
Website (Score:1)
Nutbunnies go on the attack (Score:3, Insightful)
CVS tarballs and examples from the book... (Score:1)
Now, if the CDs had CVS tarballs instead, then it shouldn't be so much trouble to update everything. Just plop the contents down somewhere, and pull source on top. Don't forget to use -z6 though, else it still might take a good long time before you have something buildable.
And yeah, sample code from the book, that's worthwhile, always! Saves the trouble of typing it in by hand, fixing errors (there's always at least one when copying from a book by hand), etc. ad nauseum.
It's up to you... (Score:3, Insightful)
Another alternative is to offer to send a CD for a few bucks more, and let the rest of the readers use your website. That's probably the best for the readers.
foreign market (Score:3, Insightful)
just a thought.
I prefer no CD at all.. (Score:1)
CDs -- not usually, but... (Score:1)
Index it (Score:2)
And vice versa - there is room for a complete index on the CD: Every word of the book: Chapter, verse, and page number. In some neat searchable format and in plain greppable ascii text! Other than that, I second the adivce given so far: Don't bother for advanced readers, for beginners it might help. Add whole text of the book on the CD, again in searchable format and/or plain text.
Ruins returnability for me (Score:2, Insightful)
I favor books that don't have the CD for this reason, as a bonus it tends to save a few $$ too. I rarely return a book (maybe 1 in a 100) so it's more a matter of feeling denied my wallet vote than an actual monetary loss.
Pros and cons of having a website instead (Score:1)
On the positive side, with a web site you could easily keep the code up to date and make corrections to bugs and errors, it might reduce the cost of the book and even speed up production if you don't have to develop a cd, and the book is easier to return. Its also nice because if the cd has been taken before you get the book (like if its from the library) then the source is still available.
On the other hand, how long will you keep the web site up to date? Will the money for the man hours, hosting costs, etc. that will go into the project fade after the book has been out for a year or so? How about in 5 years? If so, then the book without the source code available could be pretty much useless. In that case, a cd at least could still be useful where the web site might be gone.
Reasons why CD's with books are usleless (Score:1)
2. Blank CD = 30 cents
Book with CD = $20 (or more) extra
if its not too much more costly ship. (Score:1)
This will also allow them to put any notes or applications writtin around the book to be stored near by and with relavence....
Maybe put a copy of the book on the cd. sometimes when i most need the book it is at home while im at a friends house or work. and its not uncommon for me to take CDs with me in my bag o-goodies.
Only if it's Linux. (Score:1)
I *prefer* CDs.Time's precious.Sites are dated too (Score:1)
I admit, you usually have to go the site for corrections & updates.
HOWEVER. Many times, publishers & authors do not validate their links. Or they'll put Popups and garbage on their site that I (a paying customer) don't want to deal with. Another is trying to download the files or source code. It's got some dynamic & obscur link through Akamai.com or what not that uses http "index.html"s to protect the files. I'm personally tired of 404 error cause the resource has been moved.
If you make something available for your customers to download, that is part of a book - say source code - make sure you don't move it around. Make an FTP server with an Index by ISBN numbers or Authors then Titles.
There's nothing more frustration than having to manually type in a ton of code cause some webmaster wanted to "re-architech HER/HIS" website so it's trendy. We are geeks and we are not *fashionable*.
it's worth the extra $1 or .50 cents to have it in your hands. That's cheaper than photo copying 25 pages of text or downloading a distro or having the material on your computer to search.
So ask yourself How much is your time worth to find it? when you looked where it was supposed to have been. I'm sure it 's more than the $1 to have the CD on hand. If you want to use it as coaster, that's your choice -- not mine.
No... (Score:2)
It seems like books with a CD attached seem to cost about $20 more than books without.
Maybe they should offer an extended warranty too.
Don't put stuff in the cd that isn't in the book (Score:1)
Tax! (Score:1)
Depends on the nature of the content (Score:2)
Take the simple example of a HTML/JavaScript reference I have; the book is basically a list of the various HTML tags and JavaScript commands grouped by type with a description and usage guide. It also comes with the entire book on CD in a searchable format, so if you want to do some obscure thing with the TABLE tag say, you can search on TABLE and get a complete template to cut and paste as required, complete with documentation of each sub-TAG.
I don't know where the book is, but the CD is in my laptop carrycase's CD box next to the O'Reilly Perl Bookshelf CD...
The costs of CD in books (Score:1)
Now, to your first question. Wouldn't it be nice if there were a searchable text version of each book available on CD-ROM in the back of the book? Yes, it would be nice. Unfortunately, it's not economically all that viable. The cost of printing and binding in a CD-ROM increases the manufacturing cost of a book by about 50%, believe it or not. And remember that the publisher receives less than 50% of the cover price of the book, with the rest going to retailers and other middlemen. As a result, most books containing CDs end up being priced at $5-$10 more than books without CDs. (Simply to recover manufacturing costs, a book with a CD needs to be priced about $3 higher; usually, the publisher tries to make a little profit as well, especially if the CD assembles some real added-value information.) But how many of those CDs would go unused? For every reader who would love the CD in the back of the book, you're taxing others who might not. This is why David Pogue's Missing Manual series waggishly includes a picture of a CD on the inside back cover of each book, with the title "The Missing CD" and a reminder that you just saved $5, and can go to www.missingmanuals.com for the utilities and other goodies that might otherwise be on a CD in the back of the book.
Came up recently (Score:1)
this box is at work, so it didn't really matter, but at home where I'm stuck with 56k, this would have been the only option.
If you are thinking about including enough files that are big enough, definately put the CD in. I don't buy books just because they have CD's, but sometimes it's nice. Depends on the topic, obviously anything including a distro NEEDS it, anything with examples or small stuff it's just much easier to put the website.
As far as the pdf discussion, maybe more people need to look at the GNU Free Documentation license: http://laespiral.org/fdl.html I think anyone publishing ANYTHING related to Linux or GNU Tools should use that, include the cd with the manual or put the link on how to get it. 90% of the time it's easier to just pop open the book, but what if I'm not in the same location as the book? Plus, my Unix CD Bookshelf that I keep at home takes up less space than the book set.
Include it if you need it, but open your documentation to distribute.
my 2 cents