Distance Education - Pros and Cons? 42
xvrd asks: "I'm Swiss and got an Associates Degree in the US. Now (back in Switzerland) I'm thinking about getting a Bachelor Degree. Going back to the US on a student visa is not an option for several reasons and the programs offered in Switzerland either don't offer the flexibility I want or the classes I'm looking for. After some research I found some online colleges that looked trustworthy and offered interesting programs (Kaplan would even let me transfer all my credits). I've looked into the following colleges:
Kaplan Colleges,
University of Phoenix Online, and the
University of Maryland University College. Before enrolling anywhere I'd like to ask the Slashdot community about their thoughts on Online Education. Any experiences you want to share? How does HR look at Degrees completed entirely online?"
Depends (Score:5, Insightful)
The unfortunate thing is, none of the correspondence/online degrees are from highly regarded schools yet. This is changing slowly - some good schools are beginning to teach online and correspondence courses, but none of them allow an entire degree program that way.
If you're a working stiff looking for a degree for pay/promotion reasons, then probably any would be good but Kaplan is probably the least desirable. However, if you plan ever to go on in academia or really expect your degree to be worth more than just a one-time pay raise, you may consider the investment of a traditional degree.
Re:Depends (Score:2, Insightful)
One of the many benefits I found is that it really boosts your network of colleagues over the world which may come in handy in many ways (like finding a new job and helping you out with problems during your thesis etc.)
So I would definitely go for a real university instead of a virtual one.
Open University (Score:2, Informative)
The degrees - both arts and scientific - you get from the OU certainly are not "toy" degrees - they are run and marked by top academics, and given full weight by (UK) HR deptartments. For example, the OU regularly wins prizes for the quality of its students. It also has taken great pains to combat the disadvantages of distance learning by encouraging online collaboration.
Drew
Open University (Score:2)
The Open University generally caters for those who have regular jobs and want to study for a degree in their spare time. Needless to say, that takes a long time and a great deal of motivation and self discipline. Accordingly, as an employer I'd have a lot of respect for anyone who managed to do it successfully.
Re:Depends (Score:4, Informative)
Their distance learning program looks pretty impressive, they have a number of full undergrad degree and Masters degrees [rit.edu] available online. I've been toying with the idea. Not MIT, but not at all a second rate school.
Re:Depends (Score:1)
Click here [rit.edu] silly anonymous freshperson.
What do you want? (Score:2)
However, in my experience, one of the most important aspects -- perhaps the most important -- of education is peer interaction. Whatever you learn from a textbook and a lecture, you'll learn ten times as much hearing your fellow students' questions, struggling with them over the assignments, and just chatting and exchanging ideas. Education is deeply social.
An online setting can accomplish some of this (as we are now!), but it's no substitute. If you do go the distance route, make sure that you're doing lots of work on the interpersonal side to make up for that missing piece. Be aggressive about getting online with your classmates. Find other people at a similar level or with similar interests in your area. Don't get isolated. Interact.
Re:What do you want? (Score:1)
However, in my experience, one of the most important aspects -- perhaps the most important -- of education is peer interaction.
What you get in this area depends strongly on how the school's online program is setup. I got my undergraduate and first Masters from a large mega-university (the University of Florida). In my early thirities I got an MBA from an accredited online school. The level of classroom-type interaction was even greater in the online program than the traditional one. I've never been a very talkative, out going person but in the online program I found myself interacting much more than in a regular class.
I do agree that you get much less social interaction in the online program but at that point in my life I was interested in the knowledge and the degree not the social, after-hours type interaction that many seem to think is an essential element of higher education.
There is no substitute for a teacher (Score:1)
Here comes the relevant bit. Experts from the employment agency looked at the options including self-studie, evening school, online studie and tutoring. Online studie was dismissed first for the simple reason that unless you already know the subject matter and are just tuning up or are simply brilliant you will need that teachers aid. Now the point of online is that the teacher is supposed to be there, when I looked it was still phone based. The experts just had never seen it work out. I took the experts advise and took a evening self-studie class where there was a professor who helped each in turn. I passed with flying colors.
You are looking to continue a course so perhaps you already know most of it and only need to prepare for the exam, then it may work for you.
My Experiences. (Score:1)
Virginia Tech (Score:2, Informative)
be careful (Score:2, Insightful)
The Maryland school mentioned might be affiliated with UMD -- but it's not clear whether they're two different schools or not. U of Phoenix is like the Internet equivalent of DeVry. I see commercials on TV for both, and they look like clones and use similar pitches. As for Kaplan, I've only ever heard of them back in high school for SAT prep materials, which are typically useless, IMO.
Re:be careful (Score:2)
Re:be careful (Score:2)
Re:be careful (Score:2)
(I work for UMUC -- best job I've ever had!)
UMUC has much experience working with students in Europe and all over the world.
FWIW -- U of Phoenix (our "competition") is a for-profit corporation, not a not-for-profit. You cannot use federal financial aid there. They do seem to offer courses at a number of physical locations around the US.
Look before you Leap (Score:1)
Online (Score:1)
(I would even bet that 90% of the time you could put down some completely fake school and no one would even bother to check.)
I would never do this sort of thing, and I would reccomend no one else do it, but my point is:
If you can get an online degree from the univ of maryland or phoenix, who is going to know whether you got the degree completely online.
As long as the degree is they are offering is just as valid as the ones the people who live in the dorms get, who cares.
All HR cares about is the piece of paper.
Re:Online (Score:1)
All HR cares about is the piece of paper.
On my resume I list my MBA from a school in Michigan without mentioning that it's from an online program. I'm sure that some day I'm going to run into the one in a hundred HR guy who's actually paying attention and wants to know how I could have gone to a school in Michigan while working in Florida.
how many HR managers care? (Score:1)
It NEVER had anything to do with my college degree or the pedigree of the school I attended.
That being said, do I regret spending that small fortune on a degree that obviously nobody cares about? Not at all. When I stopped having to deal with HR managers and started my own firm, my alma mater and degree became useful in that clients and potential clients that I would meet at conferences and such WOULD ask and recognize my school and realize that I wasn't just some chump that new a bunch of technologies that were taught in some technical school. I had a brain and new how to use it.
With that in mind, it comes down to what your purpose is for attending these distance learning courses. Forget about HR, they dont really care. But if it's just for yourself, I see no reason why not. BUT, look into how the CE credits are furnished. Who is the university furnishing you with CE credits? What is their reputation? And what do those CE credits count towards?
Example: what is the difference between CE credits offered by Kaplan Online vs. Columbia Univ.? Big prestige difference, but technically, you might learn the same stuff in both.
Just some food for thought
Re:how many HR managers care? (Score:1)
Re:how many HR managers care? (Score:2)
Nothing like over-qualified, bored workers spending all day sending out resumes.
Re:how many HR managers care? (Score:1)
What surprises me is how many companies still request (and look at) college transcripts after you have an established professional career. This falls into the category of bureaucratic policies that have overextended their usefulness.
A friend of mine had an associates degree in CS from some DeVry type place that has since gone out of business. He has 20+ years of experience and is one of the best programmers I know. Currently, he is out of work. Several companies here in Huntsville will not hire anyone without a degree, no matter what the qualifications. A few that would accept his associates degree won't hire him because he cannot furnish official transcripts.
Re:how many HR managers care? (Score:1)
Substutution homework. (Score:1)
Hmm. (Score:2)
Can I get a Computer Science Degree in the Science of Computer Science Technology?
(BTW, the name of that college *isn't* a typo)
Re:Hmm. (Score:1)
Could be a viable option.... (Score:4, Informative)
The important thing to note is that in an online setting the mode of teaching is different than a traditional classroom. The professors are more akin to "facilitators" that guide you through the education process, which will typically involve a lot more reading/writing than a classroom based program (at least this has been my experience at Regis). Since you don't show up at a pre-set time to hear a professor in a lecture, you learn from reading, applying what you have read to individual or group projects, and/or on-line research activities, and getting feedback from the on-line professor.
For me, the online choice was the only one possible due to Monday-Friday travel related to work. I have found that is the case with many, but not all, of the classmates that I've had online. Some individuals that I have met dislike online education because of the lack of physical presence of other students, others prefer it over a traditional classroom setting, because they have more time to aborb knowledge over the course of a week while reading on-line forums/books/etc., vs. capturing a significant amount of information during class times.
Just watch out for fly-by-night operations, or "degree mills" - before you join any program I would suggest making sure they are fully accredited by a regional accrediting agency (I believe there are 5 regional boards in the U.S., such as the North Central Assocation of Colleges and Schools).
In addition, search the alt.distance.education newsgroup for information on specific schools/programs that you are researching. You can find a lot of interesting related web sites in that forum.
How do HR departments treat online degrees? Depends on the organization. If the degree is from an accredited university that also offers the same program in a traditional classroom setting, this shouldn't be an issue. If you are interested in more "pure" academia - going back to get a PhD from a traditional university - I get the sense that you might face some resistance, but I think that attitudes are slowly changing. Again, the newsgroup offers a lot of information/opinions on this.
Good luck with your studies.
Online or traditional correspondence? (Score:2)
After an argument with higher calculus I dropped out of university, got a job, and later picked up my studies part-time by correspondence - the traditional mail, books and paper kind.
If you are a good learner and/or have time to dedicate to your studies (a couple of hours a day, preferably), I think this is an excellent way to go.
I completed my degree through UNISA [unisa.ac.za] (the University of South Africa). They offer a number of excellent courses in all faculties, including postgraduate studies; have over 110,000 students, are recognised worldwide and examination centers in many countries.
Some of the faculties are most suited to international students than others. The computer science department, for example, accepts most tutorial submissions online. I see their home page has links for online registration and payment as well.
UNISA will allow you to transfer credits from recognised institutions (up to a maximum of half the total needed for your degree).
This is a bit of a shameless plug, but if you're going to get a qualification, it is worth getting it from a known, recognised and respected institution.
Some information on requirements for foreign (non-SA) students [unisa.ac.za]
as for distance learning (Score:1)
find has to be the University of London-External Programme. But it probably requires a fair amount of discipline.
There are different types . . . (Score:1)
The Cable TV classes were in a small studio, the professor would have powerpoint like slides, an ELMO (Kind of like a video overhead projector, he could write on tranparent plastic with a marker like a blackboard) and a phone hybrid for call in questions. I was the tech for this (Switch between sources, audio, video, make sure the cable company had us, ect.) This seemed to work well and we had students throughout upstate NY. They still had that interactive student-teacher relationship.
The other sort was PicTel (Video Conference). There would be a traditional class but would have students particapating from other sites. There were cameras, monitors, and mikes at all sites. The coolest thing was that the teacher would wear a infrared device and the camera would follow her around the room as she talked. She also had an ELMO so all sites could see what she wrote clearly. They also were able to ask questions in real-time.
I got payed for being the tech support for these classes, a good gig for a student at the time ('96 -'98). I think the students got more out of this kind of arrangement than any of the Net based courses. It was more expensive and sometimes buggy (Video COnference hung up on sites sometimes) but I think it was worth it.
I don't know if they still do it but I did interview at a company that was doing something similar with more corporate classes.
My experince with distan ed (Score:1)
ACCIS (Score:1)
Re:ACCIS (Score:2)
I'm in ACCIS. They've been great. I've also got friends in it. You can email me brent@bmetzler.org if you'd like more details.
-BrentI've done a bit of both (Score:2)
First, note that not every distance degree screams "DISTANCE." I went to the University of Waterloo [uwaterloo.ca] on-campus for one of my Bacholer's degrees, and am completing my second Bacholer's via UW's Distance Ed program. Degrees completed by UW's distance ed. program simply say "University of Waterloo".
Personally, I feel I learn more on-campus than through distance. On-campus learning allows a lot more room for discussion (with the prof and with other students) which I find very valuable. Plus, because on-campus classes require me to be in class at set times, I find it a lot easier to keep attending and keep up with the material.
Distance Ed is a lot more flexible, but this can be dangerous if you procrastinate. It's much harder to stay on top of all the material when it's completely up to you to do so. However, if you get through that, you can turn it into an advantage during interviews -- it's a great example of self-motivation, independant work, perserverance and organization.
The University of London (Score:3, Informative)
Just my two cents. And, for the record, I'm an American and former expatriate in Europe.