Protecting Our Parents' PCs? 778
Frustrated Son asks: "I assume that many Slashdot readers must serve as the IT staff for their parents. My folks get my old machines and just enough software to be productive. I try to protect my parents from the forces of evil by installing automatic OS updates, virus checkers, spyware blockers, pop-up blockers... But still I find that my parents end up with unwanted applications and dangerous software. What software or strategies do you use to protect your parents' PCs? Is it possible for inexperienced users to surf the net in safety?"
Get mom an iMac (Score:5, Informative)
No thanks necessary, it's what I do. :)
(and yes, I know he said PC. I consider this a PC solution.)
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:5, Informative)
It's also nice that kde 3.2 runs even faster than 3.1 and that when we upgrade the kernel it'll run even faster still... What else can you ask for on old hardware.
An upgrade to windows xp would have required a serious hardware upgrade and I don't know how long it would take to download all required patches over her internet connection.
We did consider a mac (the new ibook g4 with wireless internet would be awesome for her) but while below $999 she doesn't want us to spend that money on something she doesn't use that often anyway. If money is no object osx is the way to go.
Only on slashdot.... (Score:5, Funny)
I can just picture the whole scenario. A note hanging on the kitchen wall:
"Notice! On March 18, parents will migrate to the new service as discussed in internal family-meeting on February 06. Should parents still have any questions, please feel free to contact the sys-admin (your son).
And, oh yeah, can I have some more pocket-money?"
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:4, Funny)
I will come and fix your computer when you have problems, if and only if....
You do not open any Email attatchments unless they are from me.
You do not download any free software unless it is cleared through me first via phone or email.
You do not click on anything suspicious! You computer already has all of the updates and software it needs, and it is not at the mercy of attackers (any more than the rest of the MS machines I guess. :P), and you don't need to know the weather all the time and have 50 million things in your task bar, etc. You will use default screensavers and wallpapers, and use only default windows color schemes, etc.
Should you think you need to upgrade you will do so with hardware approved by and installed by me.
Do not put any disks or programs in your computer that you got from "a buddy at work" or anything like that.
And last but not least.....pay attention to file names!!!!!!! Something called MS_Word_Document_doc.exe IS NOT A WORD DOCUMENT MOM!
And no you cannot install Kazaa.
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:3, Funny)
I'd call you a control freak, except I know that, essentially, that's the only way to be safe from viruses and spyware. It just seems like The Totalitarian's Guide to Home Computing or something.
(And then it makes me think of systems of government, and wonder whether giving people unlimited freedoms is a good thing or not. I'm all for it, in theory. But I see that, applied to computing, the consequences are things like viruses. There really are people that need to be protected from themselves... or
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:5, Interesting)
Regarding my folks PC, they live in Ireland, although I'm in the UK, and after many a long tech support call, I'm seriously considering putting Fedora on their box, setting them up a webmail account on my server (spamassassin, clamav, several DNSRBLs), and installing Firebird, OO.o, some basic utils (GPDF etc), and locking down the desktop as much as possible.
That way, if they want stuff installing they can just mail me, and it's 2 mins with apt-rpm to set up whatever they want (I'm online about 12 hours a day on weekdays anyway).
In the mean time, there's far less chance of them breaking things with a mis-click here and there, and far less maintenance required because no more trojan cleanup is required, and my younger brother and sister are pretty much completely protected from porn spam.
I'm seriously tempted
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:5, Interesting)
I've told everyone "I don't do windows!" I have caved in once or twice but only to set up a wireless network and then it was only to install a wireless card. Now when people get the latest virus I just sit back and say "That sucks..." I mean, I kindof feel bad for them but if they don't listen to my suggestions to buy a mac/ use linux (I've offered help) then it's what they get. They know it's a problem and choose to use it anyway.
What's problem? (Score:5, Informative)
Dood, I know this is /. and that we be abunchazealots, but still...
You can run Windows in a secure fashion. First thing: Disblable useless services (like Universal PnP, Remote *anything* and so on). Second: Setup separate user and admin accounts.
If you as a third move install third-party software for netuse (Opera, Mozilla. That kind of stuff), you'll need some pretty clueless people in order to screw the machine over.
The fourth and probably best move you can ever do, is setup a systempartition with only the system and applications (move documentfolders elsewhere), and take a Ghost-snapshot. Then if they somehow manage to screw up, you're recovered in 5 minutes with absolutely no hassle.
That's four simple goddamn things you need to do, and your Windows is bulletproof enough for any standard needs.
What's the problem? No really, what is the problem?
Yes, Linux may be better (for some things), but sometimes stuff like work ++ creates things called software issues, and VMware really is more of a hack than a solution unless you have the extra memory.
Re:What's problem? (Score:3, Funny)
Ah, you mean like parents and Windows users?
That was the problem.
Re:What's problem? (Score:5, Insightful)
Then we have to go through and manually disable all of these services.
Then we have to set up separate accounts and hope that they're not going to run anything that requires using the admin account. We either have to not give them the admin password, or give it to them and pray that they don't just use it for everything.
Then we have to download a third-party browser and somehow keep them from using IE.
And finally, we have to buy and install ghost and set up separate partitions and make sure ghost works with them.
How is this "simple", again? You can install Mac OS X, and have it be in a fully secure yet completely ready to use state in twenty minutes, most of which is just watching the pretty animated progress bar move from left to right.
Re:What's problem? (Score:3, Insightful)
If you as a third move install third-party software for netuse (Opera, Mozilla. That kind of stuff), you'll need some pretty clueless people in order to screw the machine over.
Though be careful with something that has pop-up blocking installed. I've been trying to switch my family PC over to Firefox as the default browser, but the pop-up blocker frequently blocks necessa
Re:What's problem? (Score:3, Insightful)
Ok. Forgot Firewall. But I think it get's turned on by default, unless you tell Windows otherwise.
Opera can be configured (very easily) to only allow requested popups. Works very well. Have yet to see it fail. And you don't have to use the pop-up blocker at all, if you for some reason fancy pop-ups.
Back in the day (Score:5, Interesting)
Back in the days of the Windows 95/98 systems there was this program called Trialblazer which would intercept any disk access done via DOS or Windows API calls, and make backups of any files which got screwed over. The end result was you could jump into the Trialblazer next boot and revert every setting back to whatever you had snapshotted, and everything would work exactly as normal.
Some of the best tests for it were installing a whole set of viruses and spyware, and deleting large quantities of the Windows directory. The next reboot would just restore it back to working condition.
Basically it ends up being like Ghost but where all the backed up data is stored on the same disk.
Of course these days we have Windows NT-based systems, which Trialblazer never supported (the guy who was writing it probably rightly decided rewriting an entire application to intercept a completely different set of OS calls was too much work.)
But these days, there are hardware devices you can get these days which are PCI IDE devices of the same type. You plug the card into the PCI, you plug the hard disk into it, and somehow they do exactly the same thing. Whereas this smacks of evil hardware RAID solutions, using this sort of thing as an idiotproofing system sounds like a damn good idea to me even now. These people don't need disk writing performance, they just need the machine to work, and this sort of backup makes that relatively easy without needing much user intervention at all (you have to perform the original snapshot when the system is working, and how many times you choose to do that is up to you.)
Re:Back in the day (Score:5, Informative)
The problem with Windows XP System Restore is that you are at the mercy of what files Microsoft think are important. Suppose you manage to download a trojan which destroys all your game directories. Those directories aren't under System Restore's control so it can't roll back those changes.
Solutions like TrialBlazer managed the entire disk as if everything were the same thing. Although you could easily make a D: which wasn't under its control, I guess. I can barely remember whether it did every hard disk or just the system one.
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:3, Interesting)
Seconds to infection.. (Score:5, Funny)
I formatted and reinstalled, disabled as many services as possible and filtered TCP and UDP as much as I could prior to connecting to the net. I dove in and went straight to zonelabs. I stood with my finger on the cable while the download completed and soon as the dialog showed 100%, yoink!
I installed Zone Alarm, locked it down, and went back online to start the patching party. Zone Alarm blocked the first connect (port 135, which virus was that again? there are so many..) in 43 seconds. I checked. I left the Zone Alarm control panel up to show my cousin's husband when he came home from work since it continuously updates the number of blocked access attempts. Within six hours, ZA had blocked 983 attempts. And now, three weeks later, their system is still running fine. Not that they would notice if it wasn't, but still..
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:5, Informative)
My Mom is clueless, and even though I gave her a IMac, she needed tons of help. She would ask everyone she knew for help, not just me. All her kids, sons-in-law, neighbors etc.
Statistically, 90% of these people had PCs and didn't know what to do with a Mac. Even though the Mac was easier to use for a newbie, it's *harder* to use for an experienced PC user. So all these people kept telling her that her computer was "hard to use" and that she should "just get a PC".
Since I didn't want to be her full-time tech-support guy, and constantly have to fight with the in-laws I eventually (after a couple years of this) told her to follow their advice.
Now she has a PC (probably filled with spyware and all kinds of awful stuff) but I don't have to answer the phone, or defend her choice of computer every christmas.
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:3, Interesting)
So let them do all of her support tasks. When my mom got bad advice from her neighbor and trashed her harddrive, she came to me to fix it. I finally had to "law down the law". I don't fix mistakes made by her friends, neighbors or relatives. She looked hurt, but I made it stick. She's stopped asking me for support.
So if you buy your mom a Mac, and her neighbors say to get Windows, then make her neighbors provi
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:4, Insightful)
These trolls are annoying. If you ignore my opinion regarding what is going to serve you best and purchase something more difficult to use and maintain, don't call me asking me to help you use or maintain it.
It's that simple, don't bring in the ``helped give you life'' bullshit. I'm not obligated to help my mom do everything she ever asks, especially when she has specifically ignored my advice and continues to go down that path.
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:3, Insightful)
Worked just fine for my grandmother. She'd never used a computer before in her life, so something as easy to use as an iMac was perfect.
As a side note, Safari with popup blocking turned on is as good as Mozilla or Firef
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:3, Interesting)
The only other trick is explaining if a site has pop-ups that you actually want, you have to click the little "unblock site" icon.
And thunderbird has its problems. I still don't find it as nice as OE (OE has better IMAP suppo
No on Mozilla, stick with Safari (Score:5, Informative)
Stick with Safari, it comes with Mac OS X, it gets updated automatically like the OS, and frankly will get better support when a company blows it and produces a page that doesn't render correctly. Apple is actually somewhat helpful on that last point when the offending site is somewhat important, say online banking, they may contact the offender. I believe Safari has a built in reporting mechanism for bad pages.
Re:No on Mozilla, stick with Safari (Score:3, Interesting)
I would say Get Better Parents (Score:5, Funny)
Dad's a Programmer, Mom's an Admin.
It's where I learned it all the first place, I guess it helps having technically savvy parents.
GIRLFRIENDS on the other hand... I just dont let her on the net except to check email, and then I have vigorous virus checks, She knows "under penalty of loosing the laptop" that she is not to open any attachments, She doesnt have any need to get any from the people that work for her(email is only to send information TO them). But I still get the Weekly, "how do I send this email again?" she is about as technically UNsavvy as I am on the other end of the scale.
Re:I would say Get Better Parents (Score:5, Funny)
Dude! Don't dilute your gene pool!
Re:I would say Get Better Parents (Score:5, Funny)
Bad Idea (Score:5, Interesting)
So, go ahead and marry someone intelligent, just not too technical.
Re:Bad Idea (Score:5, Informative)
Lucky for me, my wife has a degree in Communications, and is about as non-technical as they come.
Re:Bad Idea (Score:5, Interesting)
It's a crock of shit. I happen to have Asperger's syndrome (i.e.: "high functioning" autism), diagnosed and all, and my parents are not particularly technical. There are also plenty of completely non-technical people who have autism and related conditions, I am helping one of them with his computer, he is as clue-resistant as my NT [autistics.org] co-workers. The idea that autistic people are statistically better with computers and technology than the general population is a myth.
In addition, the idea mentioned in the grandparent post that you should not have children if you have a slightly elevated chance of having a child with a disability smacks of eugenics and is reprehensible. Even on the off chance that it does happen, a disability is not the end of the world, although it can be the beginning of a different world.
Re:Bad Idea (Score:3)
But the article didn't say that. It said there was a statistically significant difference. Big difference, and plenty of room for lots of "completely non-technical" to be affected.
Re:Bad Idea (Score:5, Insightful)
Grandma Runs Linux. (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Jesus Fucking Christ (Score:3, Funny)
This is good advice - my parents followed it (Score:5, Insightful)
I kid you not, within 4 hours of getting online with DSL my mother had gotten a serious virus that Anti-virus was saying had infected kernel32.dll. OUCH. I didn't know exactly what had happened, but the computer was basically DOA until a certified geek could get working on it. I was NOT about to walk my parents through the process of formatting a drive and reinstalling the OS over the phone.
The earliest chance I had to look at this problem was when I came back for Christmas. So I told my parents this and suggested that they consider getting a new computer - and I recommended a Mac. My dad was totally against the idea, until he saw those new flat-panel iMacs. Then he actually thought they should get that OVER the eMac, which was much cheaper. =) That's what they came home with.
They took it home, set it up, and didn't once call me for help. They called with some internet setup problems, but it was actually the provider's server being flaky. My mom has been really happy with the new machine. She's talking with family via iChat, has figured out email and web just fine, and is even figuring out things I never really taught her. Just a couple weeks ago, she called asking me if she can burn more songs onto an iTunes CD she created. =) I had only introduced the programs like iTunes to her, but never really showed her how to use them, so this was rather surprising to me.
Anyways, they are much happier with the new machine, and honestly my mother in particular feels empowered by the fact that she can do this stuff. I would recommend that everyone at least consider the option. I know it's a bit more expensive, but chances are they'll get more out of the machine as well.
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:4, Informative)
I've trained them to log in as administrators only when they specifically need to do something. The system itself downloads Apple updates and notifies them. About all I did was set up a firewall, and a script to let me know what their current IP number is. I do tech support either through iChat AV or via OSXvnc-server and Chicken of the VNC.
As Wes Borg would say... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Get mom an iMac (Score:5, Informative)
You can fix that pretty easily, at least under Mac OS X 10.3. Go into her account, run Printer Setup Utility, double-click on any printer she may need. Control-click on the dock icons that pop up and select "Keep in Dock". That way she can just press those icons to see what the printer is printing.
Now go to go to System Preferences->Accounts and make an admin account by. Log into that admin account and go to System Preferences->Accounts. Select your mom's account and click the "Some Limits" button. Click "This user can only use these applications" then click the allow all button. Click the locate button and navigate to Applications->Utilities->Printer Setup Utility and deselect the checkbox. Close the System Preferences.
Now she can't change her printers. She can still see what's printing because the printer is in the Dock. To really be safe you can also make that printer into a desktop printer just by control-clicking on the Dock icon, selecting "Show in Finder" and then option-control-drag it to the desktop. You can also lock her ability to remove items from the Dock by selecting that option in her account settings so that she can't accidently remove the printer from the dock.
OS X (Score:5, Informative)
Well, the solution is pretty simple actually. Since OS X [apple.com] does not have the virus/worm issues that Windows has, is easy to use and set-up, does not have the malware issues that Windows has, I purchased iBooks [apple.com] for my mother and my sister to use. They are cheap, quite effective, durable as can be and since they live many hundreds of miles away from me, I am not always having to do tech support over the phone (or video iChat). Quite frankly, I really don't have the time these days to do computer support so this really is the best solution. Additionally, I would much rather spend the time I have to interact with my family on more fulfilling topics than computer support.
One addition... (Score:3, Insightful)
In addition to this, make sure to not set them up as an administrator.
I'm not saying you shouldn't leave them with administrator access, just make sure that it isn't their day-to-day user account.
Just Say No! (Score:5, Insightful)
I run into the same problem at my college which distributes laptops to all students. I have come up with a motto that has made life easier for a great many people...
"JUST SAY NO!"
No matter what it's asking, just click no. I've never run into a time where this can cause a problem. If it comes back a few times, (do you want to go to this encrypted page), read it. Then if you're really sure, click yes.
Re:Just Say No! (Score:5, Funny)
Spammer's note to self: Make great big "No!" button in phony system-error popup.
Re:Just Say No! (Score:3, Funny)
Its come full circle.. (Score:5, Funny)
Ahh, the life cycle.
Re:Its come full circle.. (Score:4, Funny)
Ain't payback a bitch?
Re:Its come full circle.. (Score:5, Funny)
Grampa: You already put me in a home.
Homer: Then we'll put you in the crooked home we saw on Sixty Minutes!
Grampa: I'll be good!
Ghost the system (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Ghost the system (Score:5, Interesting)
Once a week, my mom clicks an icon that reboots her machine and restores a ghost image from a DVD.
When the PC reboots again, she presses "1" to start windows, and all her email and stuff is where she left it, on the BSD machine.
I would install NT4 SP1. (Score:5, Funny)
I've mentioned Linux, and how nice it is, and once she became frustrated with Windows, I'm sure she'd agree
VNC (Score:4, Informative)
I also installed Mozilla Firebi...fox on his computer so that he does not install anything he really neads.
Firefox! (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Firefox! (Score:3, Insightful)
It's what I did...
Siblings (Score:5, Funny)
That's what my two younger brothers are for! I just had to teach them enough so that I could send my parents to them.
No. (Score:3, Funny)
Education (Score:3, Insightful)
VNC (Score:4, Insightful)
Another trick that I find useful in XP is to set them up as a limited user, and encourage them to use it for day-to-day stuff (like in *nix), give them the password for the administrator account, but make sure you stress that it should only be used to install software.
first things first.. (Score:4, Insightful)
just little things, like DON'T use ie on pron sites. don't install little helper applications they didn't spesifically went on to look for(bonzi buddies&etc - just not using ie puts this down pretty well though).
then lock down the computer from any outside access(firewall) but please, don't make it so that the firewall gets in the way since they will figure out how to disable it if it is very annoying(the whole point of why it was there was to remove annoyances, so if it is set to so aggressive that it really becomes an annoyance with a person who doesn't even understand the "allow connection blabla" dialogs it isn't fulfilling it's purpose).
though, these tips are quite obvious. just get it around into their heads that it is good for _them_ to use something else than ie for almost anything if they don't wish to get popups in the middle of doing some spreadsheets.
Re:first things first.. (Score:5, Funny)
Re:first things first.. (Score:3, Funny)
Not a conversation I've had to have with my parents. Thank $deity. I do not want to go there.
Yeah, I'd be ashamed if I thought my parents were closet IE users too.
Re:first things first.. (Score:3, Funny)
The first thing I noticed was that half the icons on his desktop were Internet Explorer shortcuts named "100% Hot Young Sluts," "Barely Legal Semen Sippers," etc. Whatever-- my job is to fix his computer, not to be judmental about his affinity for Shaved High School
Swap parents! (Score:5, Insightful)
They're users... fix their account type! (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:They're users... fix their account type! (Score:3)
Create a plain user account, tell them if they want to install anything
to call you and stick to your guns. I would not give my mom root. why
give your parents administrator?
Re:They're users... fix their account type! (Score:4, Insightful)
Secondly, most of your viruses that come in through IE or OE (as well as anything that relies on exploits and comes in without any assistance) can do quite a bit of damage even when users don't have access to damage the machine directly.
Hours of my life wasted. (Score:4, Informative)
They still got infected. I still got calls. LOTS of calls. "Slow!" "Hijacked homepage!" "radioactive monkeys!" etc.
Then I got them a used G4. Works a charm. They're happy, I'm happy, the web is safer for them and from them.
Caution notices (Score:3, Funny)
I'm thinking of replicating this for other tricks that some people try to pull.
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
-1 Troll (Score:5, Funny)
Rule of thumb: I'll support you for free if you buy a Mac. If you buy a PC, you use the Yellow Pages. Problem solved.
Sure you can (Score:5, Informative)
This includes updating virus protection(AYG, so they don't have to worry about keeping it paid), running windows update, a full defrag, and I make sure their OO.org and mozilla are up to date.
Hakkuna friggin' Matata. :)
What i do (Score:5, Informative)
My mother has actually started taking a few basic computer classes, which have yielded an improvement in her basic usage skills.
I've got yer widgets right here (Score:3, Interesting)
How I fixed my father's PC woes (Score:5, Interesting)
What software or strategies do you use to protect your parents' PCs? Is it possible for inexperienced users to surf the net in safety?
I demoed him my laptop (with Debian). He liked it, so I got rid of WinME that had become riddled with spyware and installed (this was about a year ago) Woody, a GNOME2 backport, a 2.4 kernel, Firebird, Thunderbird, OOo, and Shoreline firewall with rules to deny all incoming connections expect for SSH from my personal machine's MAC address. Never had another problem. In fact, his job issued him a laptop (Compaq w/ XP) that he hardly uses because he finds Debian so much easier. To keep him up to date, I log in remotely and do the apt-get upgrade for the security updates.
I also did something similar for my brother with an old Dell P-II laptop he had with Windows 2000 that kept getting viruses and spyware. Only, since my brother is on the road alot, I taught him how to do the security updates himself.
The number of support calls I get from my family has dropped from one a week to almost none.
Windows is fine (Score:5, Insightful)
She doesn't have to learn Linux, no one has to spend $$$ on a Mac, and she can still watch those stupid WMV video clips her friends send her links to.
Chances are your parents already have a Windows PC, just keep it and install the right free apps and you'll be all set.
iBook (Score:4, Interesting)
They have yet to have any major problems with it and my mom is astounded that she is achieving things with her computer that she never thought she could, like organizing her photos and e-mailing them off to friends.
Educate them (Score:5, Insightful)
In short, stop underestimating people just because they didn't grow up around personal computers. A little bit of time and help can go a long way.
Education (Score:4, Insightful)
I implement many of the same things as listed in other posts: Non-admin accounts, Firefox, auto-updating virus checkers etc. The point is that all these are solutions selected based on my product knowledge, what I try to give my parents is a good understanding of the first principals involved.
This has equips them to deal with issues in a timely way, solve their own problems, be empowered over the computer as opposed to being intimidated by it and most importantly, not call me every time something happens, but instead call me to boast about how they solved X, Y or Z.
Default: User (Score:3, Interesting)
It's always surprising when a desktop just pops up in a window on my computer, esp when I'm on thehun.net, but there's no mistaking who it is or if there is a problem or not. Thank god they can't see MY screen.
I usually get a phone call 5 seconds later with a message of "sorry it was a mistake" or "yeah, X won't install." where X = Kazaa or some other P2P app.
On the other hand, I'd be interested in hearing what kinds of monitoring (packet sniffing) people do on their parent's machines to make sure they aren't cheating on each other or younger siblings aren't goofing around with Yahoo/AIM/ICQ/ETC. I'm not so much interested in the privacy issues as I am in finding out who "bigcack4u" is on my mom/sister's Yahoo friends list.
Education should be your number one tool (Score:5, Insightful)
Rules of educating someone:
A Tale of Two Parents (Score:5, Interesting)
1) When my mom needed a computer for college homework, around the time my sister decided my cast-off P100 was not sufficient and *she* needed a college computer, too, I told her that the smartest thing to do was get an iBook, because Apples are well-built and have a better-than-Windows interface. Or maybe I suggested it first to my sister, point is the same -- soon *they* both had iBooks, and since I was looking for a laptop at the time and was likely to be Mom's tech support (however woefully unequipped I am for that), I ended up getting one too. So, three iBooks, extra memory soon in sister's and mine (it was cheap! $35 for 256 megs, 3 years ago), airport card in Mom's and mine. (Sister didn't need it as much, college ethernet etc.)
All three of them are still working great, have been updated infrequently but without incident, no virus problems, no dead screens, etc. The occasional lockup, the occasional crash (only on my machine that I know of), but mostly, good workhorses. Once in a while my mom calls to complain that her Mozilla icon has disappeared (why? I do not understand what could have happened to it -- couldn't have gotten far on foot
It's not my *favorite* laptop -- I dislike the keyboard, esp. the lack of a real page-up / page-down key, among other shortcomings -- but it seems the most robust. Strong hinge, a screen that's survived some rough treatment, a battery that's on the way out but still working as well as one can expect in a 3-year-old battery.
(The other reason it's not my favorite is that I like Fluxbox, KDE and Gnome at least as well as I do OS X, and Linux distros come with a lot more included software that I actually use -- so I like the Toshiba I'm typing on more than I do the iBook; maybe I'll put Linux on the iBook and like it better
2) Dad, on the other hand, pays for cheap, low-end computers, then keeps paying and paying and paying
Ah, well.
timothy
Deep Freeze (Score:3, Interesting)
Of course, this doesn't work well with XP (needs updates for those nasty worms), but in that case you'd just have to make your family members underprivileged users.
My aunt is getting a new computer and High Speed. I'm putting strong consideration into turning their old box into a 'nix server/firewall... maybe with a proxy that blocks
What About The Reverse? (Score:5, Insightful)
"I assume that many Slashdot readers must serve as the IT staff for their parents."
Many of us are the IT staff for our kids! And I don't mean 4 year olds, I'm talking teenagers. Not all teenagers are as computer literate as we'd like to think -- my older step-kids, 11 and 15, have been exposed to tons of computer technology over the past 9 years, but still have much less knowledge than I did at age 10 (1980). I know 60 year old men who know more than young "geeks" that work for me in IT
I think a lot of it has to do with personal interest and motivation. For most average users, they just want to do what they need to do and don't care about Windows or Mac OS X. A computer that needs constant attention from an IT guy is a less useful computer
I'm not trying to push buying a Mac, but this is exactly why I switched to an iMac for home a year ago. It was comparable in price to an equivalent PC from several other manufacturers (HP, Sony, Dell, etc.), but I haven't had nearly the OS problems that I've had with the same kids using a PC. I just got sick of spending 8+ hours per month at home fixing the same I.T. problems we see at work.
My kids generally get my old machines, too. My Mom doesn't just because she's not that interested in it.
It's honestly easier to guide their use of the iMac because I'm home, so if I gave another family member (Mom, brothers, sisters, etc.) a computer, it probably wouldn't be a Mac. The biggest problem is when you look for software and the vast majority of the software is not compatible with the Mac at all. It's too easy for a newbie to buy a quickie piece of software at Walgreens and never realize it's not Mac compatible -- then they get mad at the fact that they have a Mac.
With my kids, I just steer them in the right direction when we're shopping for software. We've been able to do all of our home stuff on our Macs (iMac and PowerBook G4), and about 85% of my I.T. stuff on my Macs (some I.T. things are easier in UNIX/Linux than on Windows, which is nice).
Protection of the innocent is a non-issue on a Mac because I'm a dedicated parent. I don't need filter software, I just know what they're doing and control access times. The rest of the crap we deal with on Windows every day is non-existent in the Mac world.
Yeah, it's nice being a Mac-owning parent...
Interesting Solution for Windows (Score:5, Interesting)
Setup your parents as limited users, but create a user called 'Installation' that has Administrative rights.
Make sure the visual theme for 'Installation' is so horrid to use (high contrast works well usually) that they will never accidentally use it. Lock down the theme with a policy.
Review their software and remove bad software that requires root access (ie, Administrative rights) to run.
Install nonMS alternatives for the core net Apps. Install alternatives for IM apps if necessary. Install alternatives for major content apps (like QT or Real) if you don't want them installing it themselves.
In other words, give them the power to install things, but make it inconvenient, and make sure that they don't have to install much themselves because you already covered all the bases with software you approve of.
That's my solution. And my Mom is still spyware and virus free for two years, with only a dozen or so 'help!' calls. Father's computer is, unfortunately, less healthy... but he bought a Compaq against my recommendation, so I give it up as a loss.
Firefox (Score:4, Insightful)
Don't block the popups, cut 'em off at the source (Score:4, Informative)
But where everything comes together is with the last two important pieces of software. I used to be a strong supporter of The Proxomitron, but it's very difficult to find now, and is no longer supported, so I've switched over to Privoxy which runs on most platforms, incidentally.
Privoxy is a local proxy that does filtering on all web content that you view, removing things like some ads, and all unrequested pop-ups. It filters virtually all malicious content I have seen.
A personal firewall is important to have now, and there are some reasonable free ones around. The ones I like take a bit of configuration, but they sure beat Zone Alarm [zonelabs.com]. The two I use are Kerio Personal Firewall [kerio.com] and Sygate Personal Firewall [sygate.com].
Sadly, both these products used to be completely free, but the same is no longer completely true.
Essentially, it is important to use a good browser, mail client, local proxy and firewall. With those in place a virus scanner is often somewhat redundant, though one of those might be a good idea too.
On the spam prevention front, I find Popfile [sourceforge.net] to be an invaluable tool. It is, however, a wee bit advanced. I suspect that most parents wouldn't quite grok it. I've heard good things about SpamAssassin [spamassassin.org], though, and it might be worth the effort of teaching parents.
Move away. (Score:4, Interesting)
My mom refused to get a Mac. My brother in law, an educational consultant specializing in Lotus Notes talked her out of getting a Mac.
Guess what? He talked himself into supporting his mother in law. SUCKER!
Fortunately, he's fairly clueful, and does a reasonably good job of keeping the machine's virus defs updated, and keeping spyware at bay. But I haven't convinced him yet on how Mozilla will save him many hours of headaches each week.
Oddly enough - the #1 problem seems to be ongoing issues with her crappy HP printer driver. Which is also the #1 issue with my wife's iMac! (seems as if the only way to fix it sometimes is to uninstall and reinstall the damn thing.) Note to self: next time, buy ANY printer brand but HP. well, last time it was buy any printer brand but Epson. hm.. . . .
Let them do it (Score:4, Interesting)
There's always Linux... (Score:3, Interesting)
My parents had the luck of having me network their house before I moved out after college. So the Cat 5 went to every room. Originally my parents had two Windows 98 machines that I stuck behind a linux firewall which certainly made life pretty easy for them for a while. But was Windows got targetted more and more, my parents were getting fed up with the maintenance they had to do to keep their systems up. Finally, this year my Mom said, "We'd like to try Linux. We don't want to buy new PCs to run Windows XP, so can we try Linux"? Of course I took them up on the offer
The plan was that my Mom would get the Linux PC and my dad would keep his Windows box for now. That way if they wound up not liking Linux or not being able to use it, they'd still have access to one machine they were familiar with. But, I had a little surprise for them. I took my mom's machine
back to my place and found that it was a little too slow for RedHat 9. No matter, I had two Pentium II 233s in the basement that weren't being used at the moment. So, I took both of them and the iMac-wannabe cases I didn't need any more and threw together two new systems.
I installed RedHat 9, but left off the bundled versions of Mozilla, OpenOffice.org, Xmms, and a few other apps. Then I worked on custom compiling the kernel to get smoother operation out of the boxes (including the pre-emptive kernel patch). The latest Samba went on for file sharing and interoperability with their Windows box. I also designed a few very professional looking icons for the OpenOffice.org suite, and "M" icons for Mozilla and Mozilla Mail (to mimic the "e" for Explorer). I layed out a custom Gnome Panel with all the possible buttons and drawers they would need. I installed the latest CVS W.I.N.E. and brought over a few of the Windows apps that they still wanted. I built the latest MPlayer for video and Xmms with MP3 support. Put a nice logout/shutdown button on the Gnome Panel at the far right and imported all the old Windows documents (Word, Excel, IE Favorites and some BMPs and GIFs). The simplest, but nicest (according to my dad) touch was some really nice desktop backgrounds of scenic shots from Australia that I took myself. To make things easier for them and myself, I also set them up with ssh connections to my server at my house that automatically log in with Public Key Authentication and set up tunnels for the x0vncserver and ssh. This makes remote support of their systems very easy. All they have to do is click on an icon when their dialup connection is up and I have access to their machines. They also have access to my private Jabber server and mail server over the tunnel as well.
I started on the project in late October and polished it through to X-Mas. My parents were only expecting one computer, but I brought both of them and boy were they happy. I told them that they could try them out for a few months and if it didn't work out, I had no problem helping them look for new Windows XP machines. I also told them that I coud provide "tech support" any time they needed it as long as I was near a computer. So far, I've only had a ew remote support sessions because the machines are easy enough for them to do most of what they need. After I got them set up with a Netgear TCP/IP print server, RedHat's printing setup mechanism got things going in less than 15 minutes. So my dad has been working with OpenOffice.org's Calc spreadsheet app and printing out what he needs. He told me, "This is just like Office"!
My birthday is coming up at th end of the week. I got a birthday card from my folks that they printed up using Mozilla on Linux to access a web based card designing app hosted by American Greetings (I think). So far it's ony a few months in, but my parents are happy. About the only problem they've had is the occasional IE only web site. They love the fast performance and stability of their new systems compared to their older
My parents use linux and they're computer clueless (Score:5, Interesting)
They use it ever since, I did an upgrade with 9.2, they thanked me because "it became faster" (new kde). They also thank me whenever a virus wave hit their friend, because ALL OF THEM are hit in some ways every time and SOME OF THEM even disappear from the net for weeks "until their computer is fixed".
The praises I get for a simple install once a year, and a few updates here and then: PRICELESS!
Some less-disruptive ideas (Score:5, Informative)
This is all a long winded way of saying that *if* for some reason you're in a situation were you need to leave the machine in basically "pure Windows / MS" form, here are some ideas:
If you're cheap: Keep virus protection current (look to AVG or Panda if you need something free). The google toolbar for IE is a decent popup blocker and will take care of most of the spyware popups as well as make searching easier. Install both Ad-aware and Spybot Search & Destroy... manually update and run them when you visit, and use the Spybot "innoculate" feature. If they've got XP, demote their user accounts so that they aren't administrators, and either install all software for them or teach them to change accounts to do it themselves. VNC is nice, but the built-in remote assistance also works, and the full-blown remote access built into XP Pro works well over low-bandwidth connections when configured properly.
If you / they are willing to spend a few bucks and don't have a complete allergy to commercial software: Norton Internet Security isn't a bad package (if you turn off the parental controls crap) and will do most of what you need. The Antivirus and firewall are reasonably solid and very easy to use, as is Norton Antispam, which takes care of popups and browser-based spyware installation as well as mail filtering that's well-integrated and easy to use with Outlook and OE.
-R
New to computing? Go straing for The Right Thing (Score:5, Insightful)
For a man who doesn't know what the shift key does, the learning curve is equal in all common operating systems. There was no legacy here, nor any acquired bad habits to take into account. So I installed Redhat on his machine.
The first major advantage, for the both of us, is that I can do everything on his machine remotely. We live some 3000+ km apart, so dropping by to do an update or fix a problem is not an option. However, as long as sshd runs and he can connect to the net, there is no problem that can't be fixed remotely.
The second major advantage is that we could skip most part of the security litany. No Outlook there. No MSIE. No spyware that comes in easy click-here-to-install rpms. Mozilla is secure enough for clueless use all by itself and, if he ever tries to run Netsky, all he'll get is a question he can't answer.
The third major advantage is that he is protected against himself. He can't ruin the system no matter what he does. Yes, he does have the root password, but he has no concept of what root is and no wish to find out. A little bash scrip backs up his home directory on CD every once in a while and that's all it takes to keep that system sane.
After eight months, the net result of this is only positive. All the probems he has had so far are of the kind he would have had on Windows too. Of all the problems mentioned in the main article, he has had none.
My short advise is: if your parents are new to computers, don't waste their learning efforts on Windows. Go straight for your favourite OS, as long as it has a good-looking and well-functioning GUI on top of it.
I just had this conversation 4 hours ago (Score:5, Funny)
Oh, and not give them the admin password.
Want to install something? Too bad.
Yes, this seems harsh, but you don't know my inlaws. I've already fixed their win98 machine once. Symptom: so much malware that windows would freeze when trying to open IE -- I opened the taskmanager to see what was running and there were three pages of processes. Most of which were adware and spyware, and a few viruses. Many many hours later it was good as new.
Later we get another call. Laurie is in her room crying, mom wont talk to dad, dad is screaming and swearing: the computer is broken, it's our/her/their fault, it wont print, and on top of that the land phone line wont work. We tell them, after an hour of his ranting, to call the fucking phone company. He does, the tech shows up, pulls the USB printer cable out of the phone jack and leaves.
Well, they've called again. Opening IE freezes up the computer, and we've been informed that they have visited us enough and it is time to visit them, now (they live four hours away in the anus of Texas) and we should fix the computer while we're there.
I may bring a gift.
Reformat the hard drive and install Linux (Score:3, Insightful)
Either that or don't give them an account with Admin access to install programs on their Windows system.
Re:Safer PC (Score:3)
and only I have the root password: a 56 character password with uppercase, lowercase, numbers and special characters all encrypted with my gpg key.
my mom can get at it, but i've told her I can do everything remotely and she really doesn't care othe
Re:Duh (Score:5, Insightful)
Exactly what I was going to recommend (Score:4, Informative)
Set them up with Spybot S&D to clean up stuff that does get through. If for some reason you haven't yet explained to them about not opening attachments, make sure you do.
I was reluctant to switch my mom away from IE because I was concerned about her having problems with non-IE websites. I installed Firebird on her computer (for my own use) this past X-mas when I was visiting. She asked me what the icon was and I told her it was a browser with pop-up blocking and immediately she was ready to switch. I explained about the possibility of incompatible websites and she didn't hesitate to say "I don't care about that. I'll use that IE for sites like that if I have to."
She's been really happy with Firebird. I feel kind of stupid for worrying that adding a new browser would unnecessarily complicate her life--it did exactly the opposite.
At the risk of people calling me an anti-MS zealot, let me just recommend having them use as little of Microsoft's software as possible. It's just bad news--too many exploits. You can go ahead make the argument that possibly Firefox has holes too that no one has bothered to exploit because of it's smaller marketshare. If that's true, then its smaller marketshare is just one more benefit.