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Communications

Using a Cellphone in a Basement? 62

Posted by Cliff from the repeaters-and-signal-boosters dept.
Nimsoft asks: "I recently moved into a basement flat and as a result I get no cellphone coverage in there. This is incredibly frustrating as my cell provider is so much cheaper than landline offerings I rely on my cell as my primary means of telecommunications. I can pick up a signal the second I step out of my front door and friends on other networks can sometimes pick up a weak signal within my flat. What would the geek solution (must be cheap!) to this issue be? Would attaching a larger antenna to my phone work, or can I hack together some sort of repeater and put an antenna outside somewhere?" While thousands of offers of repeaters and signal boosters are only as far away as the nearest Google search, what recommendations or experiences would you care to share on the subject?
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Using a Cellphone in a Basement? More

Using a Cellphone in a Basement?

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  • VoIP (Score:5, Informative)

    by madstork2000 ( 143169 ) * on Saturday February 19, 2005 @04:25PM (#11724066) Homepage
    I have a similar situation. Except my office is in the basement. Anyway, I use Vonage.

    I have my cellphone set to conditionally forward to the vonage line. By that if I don't answer, instead of going to voicemail, it goes to the Vonage line. I use the Vonage voice mail. IMHO it is better because you can check the VM online via a web browser and other nifty features that are better than the cellphone.

    -MS2k
    • My situation is exact same as madstorks, verbatim. I went the Vonage route recently. Hey, you cant beat $25/mo for keeping the peace between me and my girlfriend regarding dropped calls...There's about a billion advantages that Vonage provides, I highly recommend them. I would say there's almost no near-term hope for getting signal down there, short of some cracked-out antenna assembly. Just bite the bullet for $25/mo. Sell blood or something...
    • Get an external aerial. Check this blog out for instance: www.kiruba.com [kiruba.com] It describes a common solution in rural India where cell phone signals are fairly weak in some places.
      (you'll have to scroll down that page quite a bit - just search the page for "mobile phones").

  • While thousands of offers of repeaters and signal boosters are only as far away as the nearest Google search, what recommendations or experiences would you care to share on the subject?

    Why are you complaining? You posted the story.

    Voice over IP isn't a bad solution, but it still makes for two phone bills, not one.

    • Actually, since I spend so much time in my office, and now use the Vonage line a lot more than the cell line, it is cheaper with two bills.

      I used to have a big minutes cell plan and used the cell almost exclusively. But no with the flat rate of Vonage, I was able to switch to a much cheaper rate plan. Because of my usage habits, it has been cheaper for me to have two bills than it was with one big minute cell plan.

      -MS2k

  • Bluetooth headset (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Badfysh ( 761833 ) on Saturday February 19, 2005 @04:33PM (#11724139)
    Get a Bluetooth headset. Maybe you can leave your phone upstairs or near a window for a signal. You don't have to wear it all the time, just put it on when the phone rings.
    • Bluetooth doesn't work that far dude. And quite possibly, he doesn't have access to the upstairs. Plus, whatever is keeping the cell signal from propogating down would probably keep the bluetooth signal from propogating as well

      • Re:Bluetooth headset (Score:3, Interesting)

        by Badfysh ( 761833 )
        Well Bluetooth is good for 10 metres, or 32 feet which is twice the size of my front room. He wasn't very clear but it might be that he can get a signal if the phone is actually on the windowsill, this has worked for me. Bluetooth should work fine, his problem is he can't get a signal from *outside* to his phone, but a signal from phone to headset within the same area should be ok. Also, cell phone frequencies are much different to bluetooth so the same conditions don't apply. While I'm posting, I was thin
        • you obviously haven't used bluetooth in a real world environment, it's no quite as fantastic as the marketing departments would have you believe :|
          • Bluetooth is rubbish on a PC, there's no doubt about that.. believe me, I know. But I use my Jabra BT200 on my Nokia 6310 all the time, it works amazingly well. And it means I don't have to get my old phone out in public...
          • you obviously haven't used bluetooth in a real world environment, it's no quite as fantastic as the marketing departments would have you believe

            I've used a number of bluetooth devices in a VERY electrically-noisy manufacturing environment. It goes through a wall or two, and with line-of-sight, I've gotten better than 60ft range.

            The key? Don't use cheap consumer-grade bluetooth devices, you get what you pay for here. For example, we have a few barcode scanners that cost almost $500 each, compared with

  • Dear Slashdotters... (Score:2, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Dear Slashdotters, I need to use my cell phone inside my lead lined closet. Any suggestions?

  • Ask your friends (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward
    That don't have problems which carrier/phone they use. Use that.

  • Passive Repeaters (Score:5, Informative)

    by AdiBean ( 653963 ) <bean AT advanceddecisions DOT com> on Saturday February 19, 2005 @04:45PM (#11724219)
    Back in the day (when I was more involved with Ham Radio), we would use a passive repeater to fill in dead spots. A passive repeater is simply two antennas connected by a piece of coax. One antenna is placed where it will receive the desired signal well, the other is placed where you want to improve the signal (in this case, the basement).

    Seems simple, but there are a couple of things to consider. First, you will have to know which band your cell phone is using at your house. The two likely choices are around 890MHz and around 1800Mhz (I am doing this from memory, so look it up). Then, the simplest antenna to make is a vertical dipole. Each antenna is two pieces of coat hanger, each piece cut to a quarter wavelength of the frequency you are using.

    The next thing to consider is that all coax has loss. At 1.8 Ghz, you could easily be looking at -10db per 100 feet for average coax. So, make sure that you use the best coax you can find (it will be more expensive, but worth it) and keep it as short as possible.

    If you are not getting enough signal with this arrangement, you can get fancy and build a better antenna for the end that gets a good signal from the cell tower. Two more pieces of coat hanger will let you build a three element directional array. Mount the coat hanger pieces through 3/4 inch PVC. You will need something like the ARRL Antenna Handbook to get the correct lengths for the pieces, and the distance between them. Since this kind of antenna is directional, you will need to point it at the cell tower. Also, remember to keep the elements vertically oriented, not horizontal like a TV antenna.

    Good luck
    • hey

      the best thing would be to find 2 car kit aeriels and attach them one upstairs one down

      use the phone to monitor best position of outside aerial ( unless you have a signal box)

      Note the gold on the conectors fudge it and no signal

      regards

      John Jones

    • Here's a cringly article about building a http://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/pulpit20020207. html [pbs.org]passive repeater for 802.11b. You could probably do something similar with a can shaped correctly for your cellphone frequency.
    • A passive repeater seems to be the most sensible idea I've seen so far.

      This guy should be able to build one for less than $20, and it's about as close to an instant, duct tape and bailing wire solution as you're going to get.

      As far as easily availible, decent coax RG6 is what you want. It seems to be what the cable companies are switching over to, and it should be very easy to get at your local home despot.

      Also, for Vp = 3E8 m/s a quarter wavelength is:

      84 cm for 890 MHz

      42 cm for 1800 MHz

      Also note
      • Naw, badass is when you put in your own waveguide ;-)

        Seriously, ladder line actually has lower loss than coax, which is why its used in the first place. Problem is that ladder line will have an impedance of around 300 ohms. This will work poorly with a dipole, which has an impedance of about 50 ohms. You need a balum (impedance transformer) to connect the dipole to the ladder line, and then some kind of antenna tuner at the cell phone. Even if it was worth the hassle, I've never seen a balun, or ladd
        • Dipoles are 300 Ohm (that cheap wire antenna you get with an FM receiver is a dipole made out of 300 Ohm twin-lead), monopoles around 50 to 75.

          RG-58, the stuff they used to use for Ethernet, is 50 Ohm.

          • Dipoles are 300 Ohm (that cheap wire antenna you get with an FM receiver is a dipole made out of 300 Ohm twin-lead), monopoles around 50 to 75.

            There's nothing that says ALL "ladder lines" have to be 300 ohms or 450 ohm or any other specfic impedance. It's just a function of your wire diameter and the spacing.

            Check out this page for a calculator. [astrosurf.com]

            Of course there are very good reasons that engineers choose the impedances they do. But it's still at least theoretically possible to make the whole passiv
          • Dipoles are 300 Ohm (that cheap wire antenna you get with an FM receiver is a dipole made out of 300 Ohm twin-lead), monopoles around 50 to 75.

            Center-fed resonant dipoles in free space are 72 ohms [comportco.com], folded dipoles are 288 ohms, ground planes are closer to 50 ohms depending on the angle between the driven element and the ground plane elements (is that what you meant by "monopole"?)

            If your cheap FM wire antenna is not folded back on itself, you'd better connect it to the 75ohm terminals instead. Otherwise

  • externall antenna time (Score:4, Informative)

    by Mr.Coffee ( 168480 ) <rhysfeezled@gmai[ ]om ['l.c' in gap]> on Saturday February 19, 2005 @05:01PM (#11724323) Homepage
    it is most likely that your cell phone has an antenna connector on it somehwere (most do, they are usually covered by small grey plastic plugs). i would find out what kind of connector it takes, and get a cell antenna (the kind people use in cars should work fine) that will adapt to it. signal loss with coax is a significant concern, so you will want to keep that link as short as possible, another way around this is to use a high-gain antenna deisgn, that should help compensate for the signal loss from the cable.

  • Car kit (Score:3, Informative)

    by Mike1024 ( 184871 ) on Saturday February 19, 2005 @05:01PM (#11724327)
    Don't some car 'hands free' kits include an outside arial?

    If so, the obvious thing to do seems to be to get one, and put the arial somewhere where it gets a signal.

    Just my $0.02,

    Michael

  • Cheap? (Score:2)

    by fm6 ( 162816 )
    Your provider is cheaper than landline? That makes me want to know who your provider is. Though it may also be why they don't have a tower that can reach your basement.

    If the providers that do reach your basement aren't too much more expensive, you might consider switching. If you choose your handset carefully, it might overcome the poor signal.

    • Re:Cheap? (Score:3, Insightful)

      by rusty0101 ( 565565 )
      For me, any of the pre-pay plans are cheaper than a land line. I don't use enough minutes to exceed $20 every three months. You know a log of local providers willing to sell you a phone line for $7.00 a month?

      That isn't everyone however. My daughter can easily eat through $50 a month on pre-paid, so for here it would be cheaper to get either a land line, vonage account, or if she needs mobility, a $39.99 a month plan, once she figures out how to manage her minutes so she isn't going over whatever limits th
      • For me, any of the pre-pay plans are cheaper than a land line. I don't use enough minutes to exceed $20 every three months. You know a log of local providers willing to sell you a phone line for $7.00 a month?
        Well, lifeline service is at about that level, but basically you have a very good point. I'll have to give your links a look.

  • You could try buying an antenna for your cell, like cellphone users used to use on cars. Try finding a spot near the ceiling where the antenna gets reception, then run the cable to where you want to keep your phone.

    For keeping the cable tidy, find removable wallclips. In the US, 3M tends to make them, I'm not sure what brands are available in your country.

  • WLAN (Score:2, Interesting)

    by theomedes ( 629505 )
    To counter problems like these, operators are coming up with WLAN-GSM / WLAN-CDMA solutions. A cellphone can switch seamlessly to WLAN network when you enter your home and there is WLAN signal. The voice traffic is encoded and transmitted to the operator's network. I believe, T-Mobile and Sprint have plans for such products.

  • Vague/sketchy details (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Kehl ( 663202 ) on Saturday February 19, 2005 @05:36PM (#11724509) Homepage
    Why are "Ask Slashdot" questions allways so generic and vague?

    Try posting some more information ..... just a thought?

    ie.

    Location - What County/City/State? ..... even a Country/CONTINENT would help!

    Cellphone Service Provider - Would be handy.

    Current Cellphone - Make/Model - as above.

    Somebody may have had exactly the same issue in the same region with the same phone/provider and could answer your question in one sentence.

    Please when posting "Ask Slashdot" questions be a little more concise! .....

    My thoughts .....

    A basement is an enclosed space (I will assume you have no windows/sky lights) however there must be a means of circulating air around the "basement" - im thinking ..... air vents.

    Have a look at the car antenna kits that are compatible with you current phone - remember these antennas are normally installed in the rear car window and after trailing the cable around the window/sills/footwells you could easily use 6-9 metres of cable.

    Next ..... trace any wires/pipes/air vents that come into your building - could you follow any cable/phone/water inputs to the outside world? If so how far would it be to get a cable to there?

    Then stick a car antenna on the wall .....

    If you own the place then get out a 2 foot long drill - bang a hole through the wall - problem solved ..... or are you renting? (you never said)

    Even if you have to follow the path of an existing cable/pipe that runs "upstairs" - measure the distance - then talk to somebody who knows about signal loss /vs/ cable length when using car antenna (hint usenet) - from what I know the are shielded coax ..... so they *may* be useable at 100 metres.

    Then spend about (rough guess £40) on a bluetooth headset ..... as you phone will be pinned to the antenna cable ..... depending on max cable length

  • I had the same problem... (Score:3, Funny)

    by porcupine8 ( 816071 ) on Saturday February 19, 2005 @06:16PM (#11724739) Journal
    I had the same problem in my basement apartment, exacerbated by the fact that I live in a heavily forested area.

    Then a hurricane came through town and took care of some of the trees for me. I get fine reception now! I highly recommend it!

  • Wireless repeater (Score:2, Informative)

    by MistabewM ( 17044 )
    http://www.4cellular.com

    ^ These guys sell a repeater that would suit your needs.
  • There are commercial repeaters that are fairly cheap you can use. It depends on what you consider "cheap"...

    I completely agree with the poster Kehl above, we need more info! We don't even know what kind of cell phone you have.

    Since the question is so vague, all I can provide is a vague answer: To get started, Google "Cell Phone Repeater" [google.com] and Froogle it [google.com] to see what kind of items and prices you're looking at.

  • Ask, and the shack shall provide (Score:3, Informative)

    by ChrisTower ( 122297 ) on Saturday February 19, 2005 @09:22PM (#11725865) Homepage
    Universal Antenna [radioshack.com].

  • tie down a handset (Score:4, Informative)

    by TheSHAD0W ( 258774 ) on Saturday February 19, 2005 @10:22PM (#11726146) Homepage
    Several companies make products like this one [iconhouse.com] which let you stick a cell phone in a cradle and hook it up to one or more wired telephone sets. Just set one of these up at your entry and wire it down to the basement.
  • Relying on a cellphone as your 'main' communication device is stupid. A cellphone is nothing but a glorified walkie-talkie.

  • Ask a stupid question, get several stupid answers. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Myself ( 57572 ) on Sunday February 20, 2005 @01:26AM (#11726940) Journal
    First, as everyone else has suggested, run a bunch of antenna feedline down to the phone, from an antenna parked in a good location. This sucks, because there's a tradeoff between flexibility and performance. Also, the antenna connector on your handset may or may not be very durable. However, if you're going to go this route, check a truck stop for adapters. Truckers generally spend a lot of time outside traditional cellphone coverage, and any well-equipped service plaza that's more than a hundred miles from a big city will probably carry an assortment of antenna adapters. They generally use TNC as the "common" antenna connector, since it was the standard on the old analog bag phones.

    Second, you could leave the phone upstairs where it gets decent signal already, and bring the voice downstairs. Do this with a Cellsocket [cellsocket.com] or a Dock'n'talk [phonelabs.com] cellular POTS adapter [sandman.com]. Run a regular phone line down to where you spend most of your time, or hook up a cordless phone to the analog port.

    Next option: Leave the phone upstairs. Get a really long headset cord, if your phone supports voice dialing and an answer/hangup button on the headset. :)

    Yet another dumb idea: Leave the phone upstairs, and use a Bluetooth headset to bring the audio down. You should be able to dial by sending commands from a Bluetooth-equipped PDA.
    • I don't think you understood everyones Antenna suggestion, you don't actually connect the wire to the phone, just another aerial in the basement which the phone should use as it would a cellphone station.

      Have you used bluetooth through walls before? In my real world experience it does not work at all, infact bluetooth hardly even works in the same room when there are many obstacles.
  • You could always just use an external antenna. RadioShack sells a couple models that would work.
  • If you aren't too concerned with portability inside of your apartment, then you can go to any local wireless store, find an external antenna (these ones are usually used for car travel, that you can attach to the outside of the vehicle with a magnet) and mount it outside your window. Like I said, if you aren't concerned about portability while inside, then you can just leave it plugged in to the antenna until you are ready to leave.

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