Cheap Tapeless DV Capture? 259
K'thardin asks: "Recently I've been chafing under the limitations of mini-DV tapes, as I attend various conventions throughout the year and record certain events and information panels. These limitations include dropped frames, gummed up tape heads (especially prevalent when you spend more than fifteen minutes at a time on pause), and most importantly, time constraints as the largest mini-DV tapes can only hold 83 minutes on SP (a little over 2 hours on EP, with a loss in quality and larger possibility of dropped frames). Several events I attend can run for 4 hours or more, so the time constraint is one of the worst, as it requires me to change tapes several times, thus loosing vital footage." Are there video acquisition devices out there that can record to high density media as well as (or instead of) DV Tapes? If not, how difficult would it be to build a portable one?
"There are several tapeless acquisition systems out there, such as the Firestore FS-4, the QuickStream, and the ADS Pyro drive. The advantages to these solutions are generally longer recording time, elimination of dropped frames, and the ability to record natively in several video formats, removing the need for time-consuming tape capture. The problem with most of these is that they are prohibitively expensive for the larger capacities, require user-built portable power solutions for long duration recording times, are not upgradeable, and have been reported to be buggy by several users.
Considering these devices are little more than specialized computers, I've been considering what sort of devices would be a cheap and more reliable alternative to commercial offerings. An article on DVInfoNet details the creation of a relatively cheap and upgradeable tapeless acquisition system that uses a tablet PC. The problem with this is power and space constraints. There are several existing and upcoming Linux-based devices out there (as well as those that can be made to be Linux devices) that can be made to do what I wish with the capacities I need. The problem there is that none of the ones I've found come with a Firewire port, which is vital for tapeless acquisition on current DV based cameras. Also is the problem that many of these acquisition systems do not have the capability of being upgraded, or simply lack the ability for one to swap out hard drives should it become necessary (such as recording two 4-hour events back to back ... I've done this). The only possible solution I've seen containing a needed Firewire port is the Apple iPod, and it doesn't seem to have the ability to process the information coming in from a camcorder fast enough to prevent jittery video; nor is it upgradeable.
Does anyone else have this complaint? Are there any devices I've overlooked that fit the criteria of small, relatively powerful, cheap, power-efficient, Firewire-enabled devices with upgradeable/swappable hard drives that are able to run Linux?"
Dare I guess (Score:2, Funny)
Let's see: what kind of movie would you pause for 15 minutes? not a football match (you usually re-run an action over and over, not pause), not a regular movie (same thing)... Obviously a movie that you want to freeze a certain scene to marvel at it at length... hmmm, I wonder...
Re:Dare I guess (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Dare I guess (Score:2)
Re:Dare I guess (Score:3, Interesting)
Bottom line is that if you're getting clogged heads after pausing for 15 minutes, you are either using A. the cheapest, crappiest, oldest, most unbelievably shedding tape in the known universe or B. the worst
Re:Dare I guess (Score:2)
Too bad, I guess she must be ugly...
When to do it. (Score:3, Funny)
Macs, Analog, 2 Cameras? (Score:5, Informative)
How about... analog? Is digital a requirement? A good quality VHS camcorder (like an old professional model) shoudl be able to tape for quite a long time and give you a great picture. Maybe even beta or VHS-C or 8mm or something. If you go out of the digital realm, you may have better luck. And there must be special VCR type things that can take those tapes and have FireWire to take the video off for you easily.
My other suggestion is more decidedly low tech: 2+ camcorders. Switch one on when the other is about to run out of tape.
Re:Macs, Analog, 2 Cameras? (Score:2)
Re:Macs, Analog, 2 Cameras? (Score:3, Informative)
I think he was looking for something a little more portable in mind.
Also, I have to wonder about his gummed up tape heads as it really sounds like he is alternating some tape stock. (different brands and variants use different lubricants... which is why I always try to keep the same deck type with a certain tape stock)
Re:Macs, Analog, 2 Cameras? (Score:2)
The data rate of Firewire is indeed 25 megabits per second, which turns out to be around 3.6 MB/s, well within the capability of the Mini. And he never said anything about wanting to transcode on the fly...and given that to people doing professional video, DV's quality is considered pretty minimal anyway, I'm not sure it's safe to assume that anything less would be acceptable.
Re:Macs, Analog, 2 Cameras? (Score:2)
One videographer I know uses this solution. Every event she tapes, she takes along about 6 cameras. This way she can get 2 or more shots continuously.
If you're wondering where you can get a cheap second DV cam...try looking about for a Sharp Viewcam Z. They have a manufacturing defect that requires you to take out the little watch battery (the one that saves the time stamp and f
Re:Macs, Analog, 2 Cameras? (Score:3, Insightful)
Since when is VHS professional?
shoudl be able to tape for quite a long time and give you a great picture.
In SP (the 'greatest' picture that VHS can produce), VHS still creates a lousy picture, and the largest preloaded tapes [for NTSC] are 180 minutes.
Maybe even beta or VHS-C or 8mm or something.
I hope you mean Betacam, not Betamax, although it is better than all the other options you have stated. Oh, and still not 2 hours of continuous.
get a JVC HDD camcorder (Score:5, Informative)
http://www.jvc.com/press/index.jsp?item=461&pageI
http://www.camcorderinfo.com/content/JVC-Introduc
Re:get a JVC HDD camcorder (Score:3, Informative)
--Rob
DV Rack software was made to do this (Score:5, Informative)
There's an express version that lists for $149.
Disclaimer: Yes, I work at the company but hey someone finally asked a question on Slashdot that requests exactly what a product that I worked on does.
Re:DV Rack software was made to do this (Score:2)
I just wish you guys made a Mac version as well, because I got a free powerbook 15" from work
BTW: I didn't know that Serious Magic was formed by the Play folk... I would've hung around the booth at NAB to shoot the bull more
N.
Re:DV Rack software was made to do this (Score:4, Informative)
We also have an FS-2, an FS-1, and an FS-4 and dv rack is great if you don't have the funds for dedicated equiptment. It can help if your laptop has more than one dv port (get an expansion via your PCMCIA if need be) so you can transfer your 2 gig files from your laptop if you have to do long form stuff. I did a 3 day, 30 hour telethon with my laptop, a Lacie drive and DV Rack without problems. We used the recording to quickly encode to MPEG2 for our videoserver to playout over Comcast and to grab clips for promos for the next year.
One thing, make sure you use it is bit as I found DV Rack's protection scheme caused some grey hairs when it kept asking for activation when I was on site and ready to go live without an internet connection and Serious Magic wasn't open on the weekend...
Re:get a JVC HDD camcorder (Score:4, Insightful)
This has already been brought up, but I thought I'd go into a little more detail: The video is too compressed. For somebody capturing a home movie, it's fine. But for actually producing something that'll need to be edited and post processed, it's not a great option. The reason for that is that the footage will be degraded when it comes in. When they go to the process of putting it back to a DV tape, or to DVD etc, they'll need to compress it again. Unfortunately, that'll make the video look crummy. Worse, they would basically lose the ability to do any form of green/blue screen compositing because the compression scheme will jaggedize the edges of the matte. As it is, it's barely possible to get a decent bluescreen shot with DV. Compressing it further will basically destroy this capability.
What would be nice is if they made an HDD camera like you described, only it holds 80 or so gigs. Then make it easy to swap out the drives. If they can get enough throughput on the drives, they could capture at higher quality and bring a bunch of hot-swappable drives along. If they need longevity, they could lower the quality and get longer recording times. Flexibility is key.
We're just on the brink of some really cool advances in this arena. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if in the next five years a hard-drive equipped camera was the norm. I'm not exactly a visionary for predicting that, though. At this point, it's a no-brainer.
Re:get a JVC HDD camcorder (Score:2)
Don't get a DV camera (Score:2)
JVCs are junk! (Score:2)
I'm into digital video. I used to work with ancient Macintosh computers, back in the days of MJPEG analog capture cards, about the time Premiere 2 came out. Ad nauseum, I'm into portable video, especially as gagetty as I am.
I'm looking for a digital camcorder which does 720x480, or x486 -- I think the extra 6
Re:get a JVC HDD camcorder (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:get a JVC HDD camcorder (Score:2)
It's a big pain to make a cut when the frame you're cutting in on depends on information located in the preceding frames. In fact, I think it ought to be impossible, without transcoding to an intermediate format and back. (And since we're dealing with lossy com
Re:get a JVC HDD camcorder (Score:2)
It is true that there is re-encoding required if you cut a GOP. The loss of quality is small, and only happens when you go to a final render. MPEG2 encoders have come a long way, so it's difficult-to-impossible to detect the loss.
This isn't some esoteric thing, either. Even iMovie does it:
http://www.apple.com/ilife/imovie/ [apple.com]
I think the problem is that tape is the cheapest.. (Score:2)
The actual demand for portable tapeless recording of any kind is still pretty low. The demand is low enough that only the people that absolutely must have it have to pay a lot because it requires a specialized device that would hook to the Firewire or other port on the camera.
Re:I think the problem is that tape is the cheapes (Score:2)
Re:I think the problem is that tape is the cheapes (Score:2)
Assuming that the guy didn't actually transcode it from DV to MJPEG, then there's no reason why it should have ballooned in size like that. AVI is just a container format, it can easily have the DV data inside of it, without re-compressing each frame to MJPEG. Unless AVI adds a huge amount of overhead to the DV data, as compared to Quicktime or some of
Easy... (Score:2)
tried this yesterday (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:tried this yesterday (Score:2)
If there is a tape it will power off unless it is recording something.
Why pause? (Score:5, Interesting)
FWIW, I do video / film production for a living.. this just doesn't make sense. Consumer DV camcorders switch off automatically after a few minutes for a reason - not to save battery life *tho that's a benefit* but because of the exact 'gumming' thing mentioned. The drum spins and creates a magnetic effect which pulls tiny metallic particles off of the tape. Too much of this and your drum/heads/tape gets messed up.
It seems like the person posting the topic doesn't really understand what they are doing - or rather, they don't have a good foundation on which to improve their problems. So instead they are looking for a product (that's not prohibitively expensive) that caters to the way they think things 'should be done'.
Learn to work how the gear is designed to work. Then start experimenting.
Re:Why pause? (Score:2)
And *always always always* record 5 minutes of black at the top of a new tape. That way all the unstable tension and stuff is out of the way once you start actually using it.
Re:Why pause? (Score:2)
The reason I leave space is actually for postproduction: some VTR decks need several seconds of space before the marked cut in point where you want to begin transferring data. You mark the in point, and the deck then automatically backs up, starts playing, and begins transferring at the exact point marked. If you've ever tried to get video off the very beginning of a tape and into FCP
Re:Why pause? (Score:5, Insightful)
Welcome to Ask Slashdot.
"Hi, I'd like to do $THING. I know that $SOLUTION_A and $SOLUTION_B will do it very easily and for a very reasonable price, but I don't want to use $SOLUTION_A or $SOLUTION_B because $VAGUE_REASON and $CONTRADICTORY_REASON. Instead, I'd like your under-informed ideas on how to achieve my $POORLY_CONCEIVED_AMBITIONS using Linux, duct tape, an iPod, and hours and hours of my precious time."
With apologies to the inquirer.
Re:Why pause? (Score:2)
Re:Why pause? (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Why pause? (Score:2)
I spend a lot of time walking around videoing stuff, and a portable battery powered drive which simply connects to my XL2 via a firewire cable would be an immense time saver!
As it is, I have to record the video from the MiniDV tape into the G5 real-time before I can start doing anything at all.
Re:Why pause? (Score:2)
On that note, why use consumer? (Score:2)
Although consumer grade mini-DV equipment is pretty good, if you're trying to do anything real, you need real equipment. A DVCAM or DVCPRO camaera not only produces a higher quality recording, it also uses better, longer, tapes. If consumer grade equipment doesn't work, it's better to use better equipment than hack the junk to make it work.
Re:Why pause? (Score:2, Informative)
Unless you have years of experience with the subjects, and/or have the director standing beside you, you cannot predict when there will be sufficient pause in the action, a) to start from Stop, several seconds longer than from Pause, or b) change a tape - this can take up to 2 minutes with some cameras, 'specially when you are forced by the design to unscrew it from the tripod to get at the tape aperture.
So, take 2 cameras, each on its own tripod or bracket mount, and annoy the s
I have to say it... (Score:4, Funny)
maybe not the best solution...... (Score:3, Informative)
you can carry the notebook in a shoulder bag and hook a DV cam to record straight to the internal drive (bypassing the tape). you would have to offload it later if you want to keep the files at full quality, but that may do it? i do know people do this. it has that 80's camcorder thing going but it may be the cheapest solution.... in the sense that the notebook is not dedicated to this project and you can use any handheld video camera with firewire output (even an apple isight).
Apple powerbooks have had this feature for a few years, and i really doubt they are the only ones. i am not saying they were first either, i just do not follow other notebooks. the only thing to ponder is that it is a software setting that tells the machine if it should sleep or not when the lid is closed. if the notebook was designed to run OS X or Windows, there may not be an easy way to control that from a Linux install.
i would assume there is some other all-in-one option, but it might be prohibitively expensive?
Re:maybe not the best solution...... (Score:2)
Linux has better support for ACPI (the standard that lets you control what the lid button does, among other things) than Windows does. What I mean by better, is that you can specify whatever functionality you want. Windows just gives you a choice of Suspend, Hibernate and Nothing for the lid, and no choice for the power button, but on Linux you could for example power down the soundcard, wifi, display and video chip, leaving the CPU, firewi
Re:maybe not the best solution...... (Score:2)
Yeah right. I can select whatever i want, and get a kernal panic or simply nothing when actually trying to resatart... But yeah, i can enter 35 options into a config file, thats rulez.
I experience this too (Score:4, Informative)
Re:I experience this too (Score:2, Funny)
But with a Beowulf cluster of Linux, I bet you could hold at least a megaton of video.
Personally though, I wont be satisfied until I can haul a teraton of video around.
Re:I experience this too (Score:2)
The funny thing is, in most 4 hour events, you rarely have more then 1 hour that is watchable. It's no fun watching the kids setup the stage for the next act at a school function. I only record when the kids are DOING something
Camera (Score:2)
And it's main purpose is as digital camera! USB 2 connectivity and long battery life. Good microphone too.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B00
SP vs LP myth (Score:5, Informative)
There is no loss in quality going to LP recording mode compared to SP mode. It is still 25 Mb/sec.
Switching to LP you give up reliable insert editing, recording/playback compatibility with other cameras, and audio dubbing. And you are more likely to have dropouts. But aside from these things, SP and LP produce identical quality video.
And Digital-8 has the same quality as well. Same 25 MB/sec recording rate. The reason Digital 8 is perceived as an inferior format is because it appears on relatively lower quality cameras. You can dub DV digitally to a Digital 8 deck and you will end up with a perfect copy.
Protable and cheap if you have a decent laptop (Score:3, Informative)
Step 2: Get a laptop with IEEE1394 and install the biggest hard disk that you can. (External hard disks could also be used here.) Use a program like DVIO [carr-engineering.com] to capture the incoming DV frames and dump them to a file on your hard disk.
Presto! DV video capture limited only to the size of your disk partition.
Re:Portable and cheap if you have a decent laptop (Score:2, Informative)
Every DV camera I have ever used outputs video to the firewire po
Re:Portable and cheap if you have a decent laptop (Score:2)
Under $300 for a copy and the tools it provides could allow an amuater take professional quality video.
Too bad I don't have mod points
Re:Portable and cheap if you have a decent laptop (Score:2)
I'd have thought so too. They need the capability in playback mode for transfering tape to PC, so why not use it in record mode as well?
Re:Protable and cheap if you have a decent laptop (Score:2)
Do not even think about using a dazzle hollywood. Unless they've fixed it, it likes to do things like switch randomly to PAL and in many cases won't capture properly, without something like a switcher upstream.
Mac notebook + firewire? (Score:2)
--Rob
Re:Mac notebook + firewire? (Score:2)
Well, I would be wary... (Score:2)
Perhaps direct firewire dumps will owrk pretty well on the PC... but then of course there's the issue of noing being able to use Final Cut (or even iMovie) on the video when you are done which would be pretty useful. A Mini while not the ideal box for video would work well enough for someone on a budge
2nd camera? (Score:2)
A tapeless system using a hard drive or whate
Outsource (Score:2)
QuickStream DV (Score:2)
15 minutes of pause (Score:2)
You should leave it on slow motion play or you could repeatedly hit the frame advance button with your non-occupied hand.
Try an Apple iBook (Score:2)
I use an ancient blue-and-white G3 to record HD video off my cable box -- it's more than equal to that task, so an older iBook such as you might find on eBay should be sufficient.
"Events"? What events? (Score:2)
If they are some sort of audio-visual event are they not professionally recorded?
If it is just some talking head, wouldn't a few stills and a transcript be better?
I know, it wasn't the question, but who really wants to watch a 4 hour video of most "events"?
Re:"Events"? What events? (Score:2)
In regards to your last question, the answer could either be no one, or the Department of Homeland Security.
Correcting a mistake and some info (Score:2)
2. a) There are already ways of doing real-time storage... some not so easy. I just did it myself this July for a church conference, with a camcorder connected via firewire to a laptop, connected via firewire to an external drive. Not the best of solutions, and it pretty much eliminated mobility, but it gav
Re:Correcting a mistake and some info (Score:2)
miniDV EP is lower quality? Bwahahahaha!!! (Score:5, Insightful)
Dropouts? I've been using miniDV for years in an industrial environment and I never have dropouts. Your camera is gummed up as you've already explained.
Always use fresh tapes for important events and record them, completely, with the lens cap on then rewind to retension and create a proper timecode on the entire tape. Don't reuse tapes, keep your camcorder clean and stick to one tape manufacturer.
Pause for 15 minutes while recording? Huh?!?! Most camcorders shut themselves off. There's no good reason to be on pause for 15 minutes. Turn it off then back on.
You don't need a HD. What you need is attention to detail and, it seems, a second camcorder and tripod. Record overlapping segments and do post-editing.
Re:miniDV EP is lower quality? Bwahahahaha!!! (Score:2)
You came to expose one myth and reinforce another, it seems. That "proper timecode" idea is based on the incorrect assumption that the bits you layed down during the "blank record" will hit the record head in exactly the same spot when you later do your "real" record. Ain't gonna happen. Tapes sag and stretch, and only a minute amount of sam
Dending on the quality you need... (Score:2)
ultimate portable media solution (Score:2)
Be prepared to go grab lunch and wait while the video "finishes" recording after the presentation - that cleanup it does when you hit Stop will take quite awhile for a four hour recording. (probably 30 minutes or more?)
Then do any editing you need to via iMovie (cutting out breaks, inserting text overlays at the start/end, transitions, etc) then export to w
Re:ultimate portable media solution (Score:2)
Re:ultimate portable media solution (Score:2)
Actually, more surprising than the video quality is the audio quality. The mic in that camera is incredibly good. I'm used to using the built-in mic in my powerbook and the iSight's mic qua
Re:ultimate portable media solution (Score:2)
Re:ultimate portable media solution (Score:2)
I used a similar setup 10 years ago to allow long-term
This is what you need: FireStore (Score:2)
FireStore (Score:2)
Since the FireStore uses a FAT filesystem, the individual segments are 1.99GB ea
mini-itx (Score:2)
I've built a mini-itx system (fanless) with firewire and a 250gig hdd.
I then had my roomate build me a little device to connect a button and a set of LEDs to the internal rs232 port. I can control the LEDs and read the button presses from a python script running on the system.
With this setup I have a small/quiet machine (hold in one hand) that is very easy to use.
There's a power button and a record button, the
Use a Laptop (Score:2)
Direct to Disk Video Recording [backpackit.com]
I hope you can find it useful.
Re:Use a Laptop (new URL) (Score:2)
http://mboffin.backpackit.com/pub/66066 [backpackit.com]
And your field masters will be....what? (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm a Final Cut Pro user and when I bring tape into my system the first thing I do is LOG it. Then I can select what I want to capture. The tape gets write protected, of course, properly labelled, and now I can simply save my project files. At the end of a project I can discard the captured video. It's merely a matter of popping in a few tapes should I need to recapture the project.
This saves a TON of disk space that otherwise you're going to have to hold onto - or you'll lose the footage you chose not to keep (but which might be very useful). I've had no problem over five years in retrieving old footage. Yes - you might need to keep a lot of tapes but they are small.
your milage, of course, may vary -- but I recommend you have your camera cleaned and aligned and maybe treat it a little better - respect the tools you want to giv eyou good results is always a good idea.
get the firestore (Score:2)
Get out of videography completely (Score:2)
Save yourself this grief now. Get out.
How about optical media camcorders (Score:2)
The discs are about $30 a pop, you can get a PDD drive for your computer, or use the camera via FireWire either as a VTR style device, or in file access mode, where you see the files on the disc. It's non-linear and very rugged. You can pause for as long as you like with no wear and tear. There's no need to then capture the footage to your computer, as it's already there, on the disc, ready to use in your editing software. Dis
One possible idea (Score:2)
Strongly suggest DV magazine (Score:2)
I suggest starting with good gear, taking care of it, and picking a good tape and
Re:web cam? (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Sony DVD Camcorder (Score:3, Informative)
And when you use DVD instead of MiniDV your picture quality drops significantly. DV has a vastly superior picture to most MPEG-2 implementations. These cameras have to use single pass MPEG-2 encoding, at a maximum of 4-6 Mb/s. DV, though a different type of encoding that doesn't have some of the advanced motion analysis of MPEG-2, has a constant bitrate of 25 Mb/s, which is quite good. And it is better for editing with random seek and insert capability.
For the highest quality video, stay away from the
Re:Sony DVD Camcorder (Score:2)
Re:Sony DVD Camcorder (Score:2)
Re:Sony DVD Camcorder (Score:2)
DVDs in general use MPEG-2, which proves that if you're willing to devote enough time to optimizing your compression you can get absolutely immaculate pictures from it. But that isn't happening with a realtime MPEG encoder -- the HDV standard is just barely adequate for production work, and requires some heavy duty hardware on the camcorder to do it right.
As for other HD cameras, Sony has two, but they record in an off-kilter variant of 1080i, not the 720p that the JVC unit uses.
Re:software solution? (Score:2)
Recording DV isn't a big deal. The reason those custom capture devices are so expensive is convenience and simplicity. If it isn't a problem, hit ebay for a cheap G4 and install extra hard drives, and put the whole mess on a wheel around rack. If you want a belt mounted unit, it is still going to cost big bucks.
Re:software solution? (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:miniDV is for suckas (Score:4, Interesting)
Wooooooah there. Are you a Sony dealer? You sound like one.
For one thing, using DVCAM tapes in your non-Sony camera will cause *more* dropouts as the "better lubrication" gets mixed up with the lubricants from whatever tapes you were using before and basically creates a big mess. Notably, sticking Sony tapes in a Panasonic camera is asking for trouble.
Better advice would be: Use one brand of tapes, and never, ever, switch.
Better yet, use a Sony DVCAM camera with the DVCAM tape...
You *are* a Sony dealer!
Check out the Panasonic P2 cameras
Ok, maybe you're not a Sony dealer...
Re:miniDV is for suckas (Score:2)
Woooooah there. Are you a Panasonic dealer? You sound like one.
Re:miniDV is for suckas (Score:2)
No, but I did just buy a DVX100A (like, today), and I did get the advice, from many sources, to stick with Panasonic tapes vs. Sony tapes. Not that they're any better, just that mixing tapes causes problems.
You could just as easily use only Sony tapes in your Panasonic cam, but then you wouldn't get to join in on all the brand-zealotry flame wars.
Re:The Archos (Score:2)
Re:RCA Lyra? (Score:2)
Re: A pro's opinion (Score:2)
Firestores and their rip-offs are perfect for killing video tape; however, they cost a lot.
A firestore starts at $700 for 40GB and doesn't run on batteries (costs more for battery.) You can get a n ibook for that kind of money!
The iBook is much better, you can do (simple) editing with iMovie. You can boot it up into Disk mode, and the iBook becomes a firewire drive.
The EXPENSIVE firestore devices are more portable.
NTSC DV is
Re: iBook hack for video (Score:2)
Maybe someone has an OS hack to disable the lid sleep thing?
FYI: any firewire iBook will work, and you can put in a LARGE 2.5 ide drive... used "slow" ibooks can be found cheap.
Otherwise, I've been interested in a FreeBSD one, since I've seen there is a DV capture progr
Re:DV Recorder Question (Score:2)
No.
The only people who make DV-Decks make them for pros, since they assume the consumers are just going to load from their cameras over firewire. The cheapest DV deck i've seen is around $800 and its an S-HVS + MiniDV deck It would actually be cheaper just get a Dedicated DV camera that can do video pass throu (or even a digital 8 camera).