How To (Really) Share A Simple Calendar? 118
Lucas asks: "I run a small business as one of the people who 'knows something about computers', which now means, like many of you, I find myself having to solve IT problems. We have been trying to share maybe three simple, stupid calendars. Here's the catch -- we need to able to edit each other's calendars! This is where the problem comes in. We tried Mozilla Calendar/Sunbird with a WebDAV server (even though it deleted two calendars upon upload and barfed on a third, my office loves Sunbird's interface), OfficeZilla (too complicated for just one calendar), Calendars.net (too slow), ACT! (bolted on and expensive), and Yahoo (not designed for corporate stuff). Even iCal won't let you edit someone else's calendar. Is there any way to do this -reliably- without using MS Exchange and without spending a ton of money?"
webcalendar (Score:4, Informative)
Re:webcalendar (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:webcalendar (Score:4, Insightful)
I set up WebCalendar for a financial services organization. They have 150+ users spread around the country and WebCalendar is accessed as a plug-in to Squirrelmail. We mandate SSL/TLS connections and it performs wonderfully.
When I left the new techies wanted to replace it with Exchange/Outlook/OWA and were flat out told "no way in Hell" by management. The killer sticking point was the ability to overlay calendars -- something Outlook just can't do. (Side-by-side just is not the same.)
-Charles
Re:webcalendar (Score:4, Informative)
212.138.47.24 - - [29/Aug/2005:14:01:50 -0500] "GET
Re:webcalendar (Score:1)
Re:webcalendar (Score:3, Informative)
Re:webcalendar (Score:2, Informative)
Re:webcalendar (Score:1)
Kerio MailServer (Score:5, Informative)
you can use webserver with a web calendar or various custom applications depending on how you work
Or
You could use Kerio Mail server this allows multiple people access to a calendar i.e. a shared calendar for the web and Microsoft Outlook
see Kerio MailServer [kerio.co.uk]
regards
John Jones
discalimer I work for Kerio
Re:Kerio MailServer (Score:1)
A test to destruction... (Score:5, Insightful)
I expect it's hard even when you get to use human intelligence.
--dave
MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:1, Interesting)
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:2, Informative)
Open source E-mail app? Done in spades. Web browser? Plenty to choose from. Calendaring app? None worth mentioning. Calendering with e-mail?
Outlook did this how many years ago? It's getting close to ten years, isn't it? The closest thing I've seen to it is Gnome Evolution, and they were just blatently copied the UI of Outlook.
So if you're on Linux/BSD, use Evolution. If you're on
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:2, Insightful)
Same way you got yours. Mods with grudges or axes to grind and no compunction against gaming the system. Jerks.
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:5, Informative)
Oh, but that doesn't cost hundreds of thousands of dollars or have a shiny GUI. Boo fucking hoo. Fuck Windows, and fuck Microsoft.
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:3, Insightful)
A real life solution needs to be usable by anyone, not just those that recognize that M-x is an Emacs-ism.
Your solution has a horrible UI, but it *will* cost thousands of dollars more than Outlook/Exchange. Why? Because training people to use your system is more expensive than an Exchange license.
You want to fuck Microsoft? Write a real competitor to Outlook that regular folks can use (or help out
Training people to use Outlook is just as bad. (Score:1)
Re:Training people to use Outlook is just as bad. (Score:2)
Needless to say, WebDAV and iCal is as advanced as we need, and that's free.
The developers prefer plain text files, though.
Re:Training people to use Outlook is just as bad. (Score:2)
Leaving aside the fact that Outlook/Exchange supports iCal, you seem to miss a very simple set of facts:
Re:Training people to use Outlook is just as bad. (Score:2)
If you were talking about IIS vs. Apache or Windows 2003 vs. Debian, I'd be inclined to agree.
However...
as much as Outlook has been a virus/worm/trojan breeding ground, it still performs its duties (e-mail + calendaring + task list) better than any open source application out th
Re:Training people to use Outlook is just as bad. (Score:1)
The basic version works with Firefox, but it is mainly an active X thing, though in all honesty you could build a nicer OSS version in PHP without nearly as many headaches and help the community as well (it has already been done, but not by M$).
Anyways, I don't know how YOU have all of these issues, most of my things w
*whoosh!* What was that? (Score:2)
I'm very curious about this. How exactly would this be done when OWA is working over an HTTPS connection? Got a reference?
Yes, it's Microsoft. I don't really understand why people responding to me think that I like the product. I simply hate the alternatives even more.
Re:*whoosh!* What was that? (Score:1)
I drive a non synchronized stick shift because I love it, not because it is easy
Good for you. Can you grow your own food? Do you know how to farm? It isn't easy, but many people find it rewarding. It also helps to make you more self-sufficient.
The lesson here i
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:5, Insightful)
IF YOU DON'T USE THE BEST TOOLS YOU CAN GET, YOU ARE A MORON! Outlook/Exchange happens to be the best tool right now.
I must be a MORON!!! I use OpenBSD and Linux exclusively and I can't use Outlook/Exchange. I'm not prepared to run my Internet-facing mail server on Exchange (you need mail abilities to use the calendar to its full potential). Putting a M$ product on the greater Internet says more about how moronic you are than not using the best tool for the job.
There are dozens of great tools for simple calendaring. Did you look at Hoarde (http://www.hoarde.org [hoarde.org]? I bet you didn't. Hoarde have a whole suite of PHP-based groupware applications from Webmail to calendaring to practically anything else you can think of.
Why would you want a bloated, arbitrarily limited, buggy Exchange program running on a fundamentally flawed OS when you can have a PHP-based application running in any webserver you can make PHP work in (usually Apache, but others exist) on any OS that can run the webserver (OpenBSD is my choice for server OS, Linux might float your boat). Sure, there's no client-side application and it's all web based, but the Outlook program leaves a lot to be desired anyway. If it wasn't mandated here by some manager to use Outlook I'd be using a real client without even thinking about it.
Think twice before you start calling people morons. OSS might not be the answer to everything, but if you're using other OSS tools the suggesting that a MS tool is the way to go is just being stupid. How do you propose that I get Outlook clients running in a Linux-only shop? The web client for Exchange hides most of the functions that make the groupware in Exchange so "great".
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:2, Informative)
I am not sure how other email clients aside from Evolution operate with exchange servers, but Evolution makes people happy and is a decent package.
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:1)
I am not sure how other email clients aside from Evolution operate with exchange servers, but Evolution makes people happy and is a decent package.
Evolution is OK, but it uses the OWA package of Exchange. As I said, the web access component hides (or makes complex) a lot of the features that make Exchange/Outlook worth even using.
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:3, Informative)
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:2)
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:3, Informative)
XAMPP... It's a prerolled LAMP server. Unzip, install, customize.
XAMMP - LAMP [apachefriends.org]
--Dave
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:3, Interesting)
Maybe, maybe not. One thing Outlook/Exchange doesn't seem to be good at is scheduling for small close-knit groups (i.e. a small 4-5 person department that needs to coordinate a lot of things). Switching back and forth is inefficient, a shared calendar in a public folder can make it hard to figure out whose appointments are whose and reminders don't work, using meeting requests for ever
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:1)
I quite agree with your points. There is a unsupported team calendar [microsoft.com] add-in to Outlook - it queries a number of calendars and then fakes up calendar view.
It works.. but there's a reason it's unsupported. It's free though.
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:2)
Nowadays, if you don't go by standards, you are fucked in the near future. You don't know whether your company will want to upgrade to next mswindows version, and with exchange you don't have a migration path. At least, as there are no big standards for calendaring, you should use software that lets you retrieve the information and use it elsewhere, easily. Vendor lock-in is a risk for any company, you have the responsibility to help the company you work
usefull question (Score:2)
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:2)
As you correctly recognize, Slashdotters are substantially wealthy people who should be embarrassed about asking such prole-ish questions like "how can I save money?"
Clearly, your address at "freeservers.com" shows that you are one of these wealthy high-roller Slashdotters. We apologize for offending you.
You are also correct in implying that Slashdotters spend their large amounts of money on whatever "everyone else is using" because
Re:MS does have things that are worth the money (Score:2)
What I was specifically saying is that have a problem getting any sympathy for some guy who doesn't want to do some googling, and wants to bother other people just to save a few bucks.
I don't like it in RL when people come to me asking for my free time so they can save some bucks. I need a better motivation. For example someone who really can put the bucks they save, to a good use, like a public schoo
back to basics (Score:2, Insightful)
Horde (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Horde (Score:2)
Re:Horde (Score:2)
Wiki (Score:1, Interesting)
I'm not kidding, it would work well.
Re:Wiki (Score:2)
The calendar'd be edited frequently, I'm just thinking that it might be possible that it two people edit at the same time the first one to submit will lose their entry when the next one is submitted. It'll be in the history, but since it wasn't in the other person's textarea it'll disappear when they submit.
Re:Wiki (Score:1)
Each page refreshes every few seconds (practically in real time), so clashes are unlikely.
With that said, Writely's meant as a document collaboration service, not a calendar sharing service, so YMMV.
Re:Wiki (Score:2)
"...team calendars..."
Might be of use.
Re:Wiki (Score:2)
Re:Wiki (Score:2, Informative)
1. Person X starts to edit the page.
2. Person Y starts to edit the page.
3. Person X saves his copy.
4. When Person Y saves his copy, he is warned that the previous content has been edited, and is presented with two textareas, containing person X's revision and person Y's new revision. He is responsible for merging his changes back into person X's revision.
Dunno if that'll be too cumbersome for yo
Re:Wiki (Score:2)
It still has the problem you might have to revise it, the revise it, then revise it, then revise it... if lots of people are submitting at the same time.
I suppose whether it would work or not would depend on how many people were using it. If it was only a couple it might work well, while if it's 100 it'd probably not. Splitting the calendar into as many
Re:Wiki (Score:2)
SharePoint (Score:3, Informative)
There is a catch, you have to use the web interface to edit the calendars. You can always set that up to open in outlook.
We use it for an office calendar, useful!
Re:SharePoint (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:SharePoint (Score:2)
Personally, I'd rule out Exchange because it would encourage the use of Outlook. Outlook can be wonderful for calendars and such, but people have a tendency to also use that pesky "mail" module.
Re:SharePoint (Score:2)
Look at the competition... Lotus, Groupwise, etc suck ass.
Avalon Business Systems (Score:4, Informative)
You can set up permissions so that you can create your own appointments, create others, or suggest others which are put into a "pending" approval queue. It's all web-based and sexy as hell.
I'm not sure how much it costs, but you can probably get just the features you want. I can vouch that pretty much every aspect of it is great.
I've done it with InsightServer (Score:4, Informative)
You were so close (Score:5, Insightful)
Anyway, you were on track with the WebDAV server. I use Apache 2's built-in mod_dav to host [honeypot.net] several calendars, and view/edit them with Sunbird (Windows) and Korganizer (Unix). I think your time would be better served debugging your first attempt than starting over from scratch.
Re:You were so close (Score:3, Interesting)
Require valid-user
AuthName "calendarios"
AuthType Basic
AuthUserFile
It works perfectly. I used to use Sunbird too and worked fine, but didn'
4Team (Score:3, Informative)
http://outlook.4team.biz/ [4team.biz]
This works too (Score:4, Informative)
Brown Bear (Score:2)
It has a pretty good system for modifying others' calendars, setting up meetings, stuff like that.
Re:Brown Bear (Score:2)
I'm in a department of about 20 people, several of whom are fairly technophobic, and this is the only piece of communal software I can remember intutitive enough for end users that everyone wound up using it without complaint. (You do have to have a set-up person willing to RTFM in order to choose appropriate options and customizations. But that all requires little technic
No one has mentioned. (Score:3, Informative)
Which runs on Windows and Linux.
KISS - use notepad. (Score:2)
Notep
ad.
(PS: _sometimes_ the paste function doesn't work right)
WebDAV Versioning (Score:5, Informative)
Also look into the fledgling CalDAV [webdav.org] implementations & projects like Hula [hula-project.org] (server) and Chandler [osafoundation.org] (client). Very recent binaries of Sunbird also sport CalDAV support.
Re:WebDAV Versioning (Score:1)
open-xchange (Score:4, Informative)
There is a free [open-xchange.org] version and a pay [open-xchange.com] version.
LDAP (Score:2)
iPlanet Calendar Server (Score:2)
The calendar server uses LDAP not just for authentication, but also to store user's preferences. (as do sun's mail server and other products)
Meeting Maker (Score:1)
I remember it being pretty nice for cross-platform use and had a built-in web interface as well.
Sunbird Deletes Calanders! (But it's fixable) (Score:5, Informative)
When you have a WebDAV server setup and have Sunbird/Mozilla Calander setup - it will delete calendars that have zero items. Delete the last item in your calendar, and POOF, you have a zero byte
Group Calendars (Score:1)
why not exchange (Score:4, Insightful)
what you're describing isn't exactly that simple, and calendaring is perhaps exchange's most touted feature among those who use it.
and it's popular enough that it's available in some form on every platform (Evolution for *nix, Outlook for Win32, Entourage for OSX)
I'm not a very big microsoft advocate, but it seems like you're passing up a perfectly good product based upon your bias against microsoft.
If Sunbird was stable, or came close to matching the ease-of-use or maturity of outlook, I'd reccommend it even if outlook had the edge because of price and the fact that it's not microsoft. But the fact is that nothing comes close.
Re:why not exchange (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:why not exchange (Score:1)
Novell and IBM products (groupwise, notes) definitely are equally good for basic mail/calendering, and notes can do much more for collaboration if you use it properly (in fact, you can negate the need for a fileserver altogether if you want).
You are correct in assessing that currently no equally good free alternatives exist, but alternatives DO exist.
Lotus (Score:1)
If you only use the Lotus Notes client (ie. no domino server), and have a shared fileserver, you could make the data directories (where the notes client saves it's data) available on the fileserver. It's simple but has the problem you will not be able to use it off location. If you get domino or workplace this wont be a problem.
With workplace the client is also available for linux btw. With notes only win32 and Mac clients are avail. though the win3
Re:Lotus (Score:1)
--
That is a blatant violation of the US DOJ Antitrust Settlement. Kindly contact your attorney-general. The point of "Set Programs and Defaults" was so that any middleware could work equally well with Microsoft programs. It is an uphill battle --Outlook isn't even listed in th
Re:Lotus (Score:2)
Stupid zealot. "contact your attorney blah blah blah" indeed.
Re:Lotus (Score:1)
If you by chance have MS Office installed, and have not installed MS Outlook, you will notice that the "Mail Recipient" option is grayed out.
It DID work in MS Office 2000, I'm not sure about 2002/XP, but probably, like 2003 it no longer works. In effect MS disabled it for non MS programs.
Re:Lotus (Score:1)
What I slowly discovered was that Active Desktop caused major stability and spe
Re:Lotus (Score:1)
Since this is only an office thing I'm not sure it applies.
Anyway, I have no problem contacting the DOJ, even though the EU Commision would be more relevant for me.
Re:Lotus (Score:1)
Here are the US websites:
http://www.microsoft-antitrust.gov/ [microsoft-antitrust.gov]
http://www.thetc.org/ [thetc.org]
My AG recommended reporting complaints to both.
I just had an idea that perhaps an Ask Slashdot would be appropriate for this. We could get several complaints. For me, the complaint is two part or
Re:Lotus (Score:1)
The MAPI thing is a little different IMHO, since MS included the function in windows untill 2K, but then moved the function from windows to office, meaning that if you wanted to use it you need to install outlook along with office (I've made some programs work with notes this way).
Simply put, MS has willfully made 2 changes to make it more of a hassle to use oth
Re:Lotus (Score:1)
http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=190146 [microsoft.com]
This knowledge base article seems to suggest that it was possible in Outlook 98.
If you haven't heard of MAPI, it's worth a Google search.
--Sam
P.S a support call to Microsoft might reveal some workarounds, and they will then post a knowledge base article about it. ($35 only if they can solve your problem) You might make it clear that you consider it a bug (bugs are free).
Re:Lotus (Score:1)
MAPI support has since windows 2000 not been part of windows. Instead MAPI support has been moved to the Office package, and only installed with the Outlook from MS Office.
Thus, programs that need MAPI support, has since Windows 2000 also required that Outlook be installed.
The article you link to, points out that Lotus Notes supports MAPI, of course MAPI support needs to be installed.
So my complaint was that since Windows 2000, MAPI support requires a MS Offi
Re:Lotus (Score:1)
You may find the following useful:
1. Does Lotus Notes support set program and defaults? If not, goto step 2. If so, goto step 2.
2. In the Programs tab on the Internet Options control panel, is Mail set to be Lotus Notes?
a. Set it to blank.
b. set it to Lotus Notes
This may solve your issue. Or have you already gotten MAPI to work with Word?
Summary:
simple vs. extended?
some troubleshooting steps
KDE KOrganiser (Score:1)
Various good web-based options. (Score:5, Informative)
1. horde-kronolith http://www.horde.org/kronolith/ [horde.org] (horde suite is quite comprehensive and easy to set up)
2. webcalendar http://www.k5n.us/webcalendar.php [k5n.us]
3. MediaWiki with calendar plugin (a little bit tricky to set up, and not as great to use as previous two)
Basically the shared feature of horde is pretty powerfull with a good rights-system. They also alow calendars to be exported etc.
Check them out.
Re:Various good web-based options. (Score:1)
I was searching something similar like the person asking. I just needed a little bit more (Palm). For me OGo is the best solution.
Re:Various good web-based options. (Score:1)
Citadel (Score:3, Interesting)
You can create a Calendar room accessible by everyone (or acl'ed as you wish) and people can edit as they wish, as a plus it can handle your mail, among other things. If you want to have a play with WebCit, log onto Uncensored BBS [citadel.org] or one of the [citadel.org] others [citadel.org].
Disclaimer: I'm to blame for the upcoming NNTP implementation in Citadel, along with a patch to use Bogofilter, and the token Australian node on the "IGnet".
Re:Citadel (Score:2)
I'll add a vote for this, at least on a "try it out and see how it works for you" basis - my experience with it is limited at this point but I like what I see so far.
I've just started using Citadel as an SMTP/IMAP server to see how it works. It was pretty easy to compile and get running, and seems to work painlessly with Thunderbird. I haven't tried calendars in it yet, but that's "soon" on my list, once I've had time to find the documentation on it.
I had a problem getting webcit to run properly, but I
Wrong approach (Score:2)
It really sounds like you're trying to use publishing where it isn't appropriate. If anyone can edit a particular calendar, it isn't really "someone else's". The only type of server I see a need to involve is a file server, and you'd simply use whatever calendaring application you prefer to edit the files directly. As a bonus, standard file-based permission can be used to restrict access to the group of people who can edit them. Everything else you're talking about seems to be overkill for a small busi
Hula Project (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Hula Project (Score:1, Informative)
Do you really want others to edit your Calendar? (Score:4, Insightful)
My first response to that actual ability for you to edit someone else's calendar is acceptance and actually being able to make it.
If someone edits your schedule without you knowing, you may not kow the scheduled item is in place. Likewise, if someone decides you need to be at their power-point meeting instead of picking up someone at the airport, that's bad.
I'm of the firm opinion that people need to be able to accept invitations instead of simply being informed they'll be showing up at a certain time. It's my time to manage, not yours.
Then again, I'm not a fan of having schedules imposed on me by other people. So the idea of somsone else editing the final version of my schedule would make me rather irate.
Re:Do you really want others to edit your Calendar (Score:2)
My favorite webcal (Score:2)
I'm not really sure about your needs... (Score:1)
CGI Calendar (Score:2)
CGI Calendar [sf.net]
(hosted at Sourceforge, licensed under GPL)
Been there, done that.... (Score:1)
After poking around the net for a while, I found these guys http://www.xcnetwork.com/index.jsp [xcnetwork.com]. Ok, so its costs money but it solves all the issues, and best of all it is cross-platform.
Their various plug-ins run on the Mac, Windows an
OpenGroupware.org (Score:1)
workgroupshare.com - and outlook (Score:1)
(at workgroupshare.com).
It's relatively cheap ($150 for 5 users) - allows people to share calendars, emails, contacts, etc.
I've used it for a while and can't really complain.
It allows advanced permissions (so only certain users can see your emails, or only certain users can modify
and is overall, a pretty mature product, IMHO.
I have more than a couple of clients that use it without problem.