Getting Fingerprint Readers to Read Your Prints? 88
crypticgeek asks: "I recently obtained a new job, and I'm already at my wit's end. Many of the doors in our facility have finger print readers because they are high security areas. No matter how hard I've tried, I can't get the system to read my prints very well, since they aren't well 'defined'. This means I don't have access to the areas I need to. I have to have someone else let me in to secure areas. I've tried using lotion thinking they were too dry, but that didn't work. In fact, most of the time my hands are really sweaty. Someone suggested I use nail polish remover and that would 'raise' the print, however I'm skeptical. Has anyone else had problems with finger print devices, or know of some possible ways of getting a better read?"
In the old days (Score:5, Informative)
Re:In the old days (Score:1)
GoJo? DAP?
ridgebuilder solution (Score:4, Informative)
Re:ridgebuilder solution (Score:3, Insightful)
I agree with the people who say this is his bosses' problem, not his...
Re:ridgebuilder solution (Score:2)
Here's a link to a place selling Ridge Builder: http://www.tritechusa.com/fingerprint/LC-RB.htm [tritechusa.com] It's light on the details, though, so I'm still not sure how it works or if it's safe.
Another site had this to say: "The ridge builder works by temporarily "puffing" or raising the fingerprint ridges. I'm fairly sure it sounds like something you wouldn't want to use on a daily basis.
Maybe you could use it once, get some clear prints, then use those to build a latex model of your finger print. You coul
DO NOT USE ALCOHOL UNTIL YOU ARE SURE (Score:4, Informative)
There is a lot of bad advice in the thread. Some things I have found that really work
1. The number 1 cause of bad prints is dryness. Make sure your finger is moist. You can do this with lotion or simply rubbing your fingers together
2. Press firmly but don't mash your finger into it.
3. If it doesn't work after a second or two, lift it up and try it again.
4. Make sure you are covering the scanner completely. Don't just scan the tip of your finger. The more area you can cover it with the better.
5. If it still doesn't work, try scooting your finger higher up on the scanner to get the better prints towards the bottom of your pads.
6. Most setups have the option of registering a different finger. Try your middle finger or your thumb instead.
7. If a lot of people are having trouble, they probably have the match settings too high or the scanner is defective. But more than likely, it is probably you.
Re:DO NOT USE ALCOHOL UNTIL YOU ARE SURE (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:In the old days (Score:2)
Re:In the old days (Score:1)
Get some Play-Doh (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Get some Play-Doh (Score:2)
Rub your fingers together (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Rub your fingers together (Score:2)
Re:Rub your fingers together (Score:2)
Sensitivity Threshold (Score:3, Interesting)
Don't these things... (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Don't these things... (Score:2)
Dude... (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Dude... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Dude... (Score:2)
Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Dude... (Score:2)
Jelly Bears (Score:4, Funny)
works most of the time just dont look at who had access...
regards
John Jones
Not your problem (Score:5, Insightful)
Why should you trouble yourself if the company's assclown policies are preventing you from doing work?
MOD PARENT UP (Score:2, Informative)
Re:MOD PARENT UP (Score:3, Insightful)
While at my place they're generally instantly forgiving if I'm loafing because someone else has locked the database or neglected to make a bugfix for a deadline, you'll still lose prestiege in the eyes of some bosses even if it's completely out of your hands. Regardless of even being aware that its not your fault, they'll still subconsciously be thinking "well, he is getting paid for nothing..."
You also run the risk of the boss discovering he act
Re:MOD PARENT UP (Score:1)
You need to use someone else's finger (Score:2)
Some folks are just SOL (Score:3, Informative)
Are the sensors chip-based or optical? If they're chip-based, I've found that having clean fingers helps, but if I *just* washed and dried my hands, it's harder to get a good read than if I wait a minute for some sweat/oil to form on the skin again.
Suggestion (Score:5, Funny)
Use another finger (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Use another finger (Score:3, Funny)
Fake your own prints (Score:2, Informative)
Are your other fingers equally poorly defined? Compare them to each other (and other people's as a control group) to see if one of your fingers works better (hopefully your middle finger for added irony)
Whooa! (Score:5, Insightful)
Get them to fix the system so it lets you in - don't put yourself at risk by breaking the rules.
Re:Whooa! (Score:2)
Check your finger positioning (Score:5, Insightful)
Solution: I put almost half of the required fingertip over the top of the imaging sensor, so the stupid little device gets the part of my print it really wants.
Anyway, it might be worth a try to play around with finger positioning.
Re:Check your finger positioning (Score:2)
finger on a string (Score:5, Funny)
Re:finger on a string (Score:2)
Oh, please. Do you know how ridiculous it would be for an adult IT professional to go around sucking his thumb in public?
Re:finger on a string (Score:2)
Re:finger on a string (Score:2)
Re:finger on a string (Score:2)
Re:finger on a string (Score:1)
Then again, maybe he already is, and a cadaver's "stiff little finger" would be an improvement for him....
raise the ridges (Score:3, Informative)
Employer's problem (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Employer's problem (Score:2)
Re:Employer's problem (Score:2)
Re:Employer's problem (Score:3, Interesting)
If he works in a 80,000 person organization like I do, he will be fired for failing to comply with the security policy - regardless of whether he is able to comply.
Just ask Chuck Strickler, a welder with no remaining fingerprints.
http://www.whistlestopper.com/forum/archive/index. php/t-2731 [whistlestopper.com]
Re:Employer's problem (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Employer's problem (Score:2)
> the employee than fix the security system.
Not if he invokes the ADA. He is obviously disabled, and they must accomodate him.
Re:Employer's problem (Score:2)
Besides..
http://www.usdoj.gov/crt/ada/q%26aeng02.htm [usdoj.gov]
"In addition, an employer is not required to make an accommodation if it would impose an "undue hardship" on the operation of the employer's business."
Such as compromising security, having to redo their entire security system, etc.
"Q. Can an employer consider health and safety when deciding whether to hire an applicant or retain an employee with a disability?
A. Yes. The AD
Safecrackers (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Safecrackers (Score:2)
Re:Safecrackers (Score:2)
(for a concealed weapon permit, if you're curious)
To ensure perfect aim, shoot first and call whatever you hit the target
No further comments...
One piece of advice... (Score:3, Informative)
Fake finger (Score:2)
Re:Fake finger (Score:2)
Re:Fake finger (Score:1)
Get arrested for gaining access to what you are already authorized?
Re:Fake finger (Score:2)
"Get arrested for gaining access to what you are already authorized?
Absolutely. And although the official reason would be "spoofing the security system" and the arrest would be for "possession and use of illegal access devices" the real reason would be what it always is: making your bosses look like idiots.
Have you considered the possibility... (Score:1)
Robot, Alien, Alien-hybrid, clone, some poor shmuck who has replaced the real you with implanted memories waiting for the trigger to set you off.
Consider yourself lucky (Score:2, Funny)
Try breathing on the glassy thingy (Score:4, Interesting)
On many fingerprint readers there's usually this glass thingy where you put your finger. Usually the oils from the previous print will be left on the glass, by breathing on it, you can often fog up the glass to create an image which can be read by the reader.
With most biometric systems you need a human or something monitoring that no funny business like this is happening.
Anyway, you should just make a distinctive mold, register it and put it on your keychain.
Yup... (Score:3, Insightful)
Fingerprint locks should be used as a highish security convienience. There should always be a backup system too. Even if that backup system is a big thug checking photo IDs.
Re:Yup... (Score:2)
a smart card with a PIN key is more secure and easier to use.
Re:Yup... (Score:2)
Like I said, they're nothing more than a convienience. Any implementation that doesn't have a PIN along with the fingerprint is completely broken anyway. You should never have a system where just the fingerprint gives you access.
Re:Yup... (Score:2)
Easy Way (Score:1)
Find somebod y inthe office with full access that nobody likes and get them drunk and just cut off there finger with a big ass knife...,
Just made sure to cut it at the Proximal Phalanx (see pic) [davidlnelson.md] under the nuckle (see pic) [aol.com] for easy drilling of bone to attach onto keyring.....
Or send it to me and I'll make it up for you for a small fee
Fingerprint locks don't work anyway (Score:4, Informative)
That said, here's some documentation for that claim, some of which include suggestions for how to easily bypass such systems, perhaps one of them will work for you, although I don't recommend the first one:
Malaysia car thieves steal finger [bbc.co.uk]
DHS and UK ID card biometric vendor in false ID lawsuit [theregister.co.uk]
Unsupervised biometric scanners more toys than serious security [ncl.ac.uk]
Impact of Artificial Gummy Fingers on Fingerprint Systems [schneier.com]
Cold dry hands (Score:1)
This is a problem. Here are some ideas. (Score:5, Informative)
I've been doing biometrics related stuff for the last several years, and I can tell you that there are a *lot* of people who don't have easily-scannable fingerprints. Many people who do a lot of work with their hands basically keep their fingertips polished smooth. One colleague of mine has a grandmother who quilts a lot and the constant rubbing of fingertips against cloth erases her ridges. A national ID project in Nicaragua (IIRC) ran into lots of trouble because most of the women cook tortillas and frequently grab the hot tortillas with their fingers to flip and remove them, burning their fingerprints off in the process. People who do hard labor often have thick, cracking callouses which cause problems.
It also appears to be a bigger problem for women than for men, women seem to have naturally fainter ridges than men, and asians seem to have fainter ridges that other races. I've met lots of asian women who have basically no ridges at all.
Other people have a different problem. Most fingerprint recognition algorithms want to look at some nice whorl patterns, which is where the most identifiable splits and changes in the ridges are found, but this "central" portion is not very centered on some peoples' fingers. For some, it's closer to the fingertip or closer to the knuckle, and I even met one man who got the best readings by tilting his finger about 30 degrees to one side.
Finally lots of people have problems using fingerprint scanners because they don't know how to use them. "What's to know?" you might think. Actually, you do have to learn how to position your finger on the sensor, and how much pressure to apply. Bad positioning, or too much or too little force, will give you poor scans.
So, to find a solution (other than getting your employer to fix or get rid of the scanners), I suggest you firse see if you can figure out what the problem is. Some things to look at/try:
Sounds like a way to lose one's job (Score:1)
The security folks may not like this approach, of course, but you can always try pointing out (after you've learned how to do it) that if it's so easy, then their security technology isn't much good anyway.
At many organizations, the security people will definitely NOT like it. Most security people tend to want to play things as strictly by the book as possible. I'm pretty certain that using a fake finger would be a clear breach of policy, and could land you in a HEAP of troub
Re:Sounds like a way to lose one's job (Score:2)
If you MADE the finger, but never actually used it for access, and then showed it to them, demonstrated it, and asked if you could use it as a solution to your problem, they might accept it... but I'd wager that they won't.
Oh, I'm sure they wouldn't. I thought it was obvious my suggestion was toungue-in-cheek. Now obvious enough, apparently :-)
Even if you get out of the trouble eventually, you would still be seen as a "troublemaker" by many in security.
I usually am. That's shy they hire me to des
Re:Sounds like a way to lose one's job (Score:2)
I'm still not quite sure what, if anything, it was scanning for. It wasn't even a beef frank.
Don't you think... (Score:1)
If the original fingerprint was bad, you can put as much shit as you want on your finger, this won't make the scanner think your actual fingerprints match the original one.
Or am I writing something stupid ? (I've never seen a fingerprint scanner in my life)
scar! (Score:2)
(ok, bad idea)
May be the refrence prints are bad? (Score:2)
The simplest answer is often overlooked.