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Education

What Should 10-Year-Olds Know About IT? 234

Posted by timothy from the the-sound-of-eyeballs-popping-out dept.
stephendl writes "I have been asked to give a computer based talk to a local primary school. It is part of an after school science club and I have a pretty free rein to talk about whatever I want for 10 minutes. The children will be aged 9 and 10 and will come from a range of backgrounds, there will be a parent of each child present too. My initial thoughts for the subject included the history of computers, the components in a computer and what computers are used for. Does the slashdot community have any suggestions, experience in this area or tips?"
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What Should 10-Year-Olds Know About IT? More

What Should 10-Year-Olds Know About IT?

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  • How about things not to do? (Score:5, Funny)

    by nharmon ( 97591 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:26AM (#10318278)
    Perhaps some pointers on how everything you do on the internet can and will be recorded, and probably will come back to haunt you.

    Wait, there's someone at the door............... ......

    ARRRRRRRRRRRGH!!!!

    • Re:How about things not to do? (Score:5, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:28AM (#10318300)
      Look, if he was dying, he wouldn't bother to carve 'aaaaaggh'. He'd just say it!

      Or, perhaps he was dictating.

  • Tell them to learn Hindi (Score:5, Funny)

    by BigChigger ( 551094 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:26AM (#10318282)
    if they're interested in an IT career.

    BC

    • On a serious note... (Score:5, Insightful)

      by jd ( 1658 ) <imipak@yahoGINSBERGo.com minus poet> on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @09:34PM (#10325362) Homepage Journal
      Actually, that's sadly not bad advice. The British did much of the preliminary work in computing (Alan Turing built the first stored-program computer in Manchester University in 1948) but really have done little since of any real note.


      (Oh, sure, the BBC computer was brilliant, the Inmos Transputer was the product of sheer genius, the Archimedes was very respectable for the time - far more advanced than PCs! - and the ARM/StrongARM processors were a work of art. Care to find any of these products outside of a few specialist shops in the UK? In fact, care to find anything other than the StrongARM anywhere at all???)


      Likewise, America isn't the tech centre it used to be. Most chip manufacture is done overseas, and sooner or later, it's going to occur to businesses in those countries that they can gain a massive competitive advantage by using these "local" resources. Why not? They're the ones with the experience, actually doing the work, these days. US labor is generally too expensive. Given the folks in Taiwan, etc, have the means, the motive and the opportunity to turn that work-experience into a profitable business of their own, it's just going to be a matter of time before it happens.


      With software outsourcing to Asian nations and the subcontinent, it's not just the hardware you need be concerned about. Again, these guys aren't stupid. With the necessary training, and the considerable work experience they are receiving, all it'll take is some imaginitive and a little venture capital, and you may very well see major companies coming out of such countries.


      Unlikely? Not really. Japan, after World War II, was a wreck, had very minimal up-to-date technology, and no history of being a major International power in commerce. With funding from the US, and an import of know-how (not all of it ethically obtained) they have cloned just about every piece of Western technology and have often made some impressive improvements.


      I heard this wonderful quote for Formula 1 motor racing - "if you're not moving forwards, you're moving backwards". In technology, this is certainly true. Last week's "new thing" is next week's "old hat". Plenty of places in the US still use COBOL, AS400s, etc. PL/1 compilers are still being sold for $15,000 a seat. (Someone's buying it or they wouldn't charge it.) That's not a sign of rapid forward movement.


      India, Taiwan, etc, don't have that legacy overhead. They're much freer to move forward to next-gen technologies, and that puts them ahead of the game, if they take the opportunity.

      • The British did much of the preliminary work in computing (Alan Turing built the first stored-program computer in Manchester University in 1948) but really have done little since of any real note.
        <IRONY:>
        This message brought to you using the World Wide Web over a packet switching network.
        </IRONY>

  • Hmmm. (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Just3Ws ( 687949 ) <slashdot@jus[ ]s.com ['t3w' in gap]> on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:29AM (#10318316) Homepage
    9-10, you say? How about, NOTHING? C'mon, they should be learning the fundamentals (three r') at that age. Adding in "IT" will only muddle things for them. We try to stuff to many things into kids minds too early. Keep their lives simple so they can actually learn what fundamentals, not what YOU think matters.
    • I think that you are right! My parents waited until I was 15 before they let me use that new fangled telephone.

      All kidding aside, the Internet is a part of growing up now, IT is the engine which drives part of our society today. For kids 9-10, I'd touch on security, like don't give out personal information online (but I wouldn't drone on it, I am sure that they get it alot). Maybe for something quick, I'd introduce them to Flowcharting.

      • Wow.

        Please recall that were talking about little kids here. Flowcharting? No.

        I agree that they are probably overwhelmed with (far too abstract) warnings about the internet.

        In my children's class last week, they had a entire session just on identifying different media: CD, Floppy, ZIP, Jump, etc. I was momentarily tickled to hear that my daughter asked if she could just "put a cord from one to the other."

        That sounds about the right topic level for this Ask /. questioner - he's got a diverse group on h
        • I ran a 4-H computer club at one time, that started with 4th graders, about 9-10 years old. Flowcharting was the FIRST thing we taught them- then BASIC (a real challenge in the early 1980s as we had computers from 12 different manufacturers, each with their own command for "clear the screen"). By the end of the year, programming was accomplished and blue ribbons were earned for a variety of basic text adventure games. If-then-else is quite easy to teach at that age, as is string processing.
    • When I was 9 I was learning to program in basic.

      • Re:Hmmm. (Score:3, Funny)

        by joper90 ( 669321 ) *
        me too.. well at 8 on the spectrum in the shops in town:

        10 print "Joe is wicked..."
        20 goto 10

        ahhh.. the good old days.. however.. I did advance from that to the pc days: format c: .. then run...fast

    • Re:Hmmm. (Score:5, Insightful)

      by bizpile ( 758055 ) * on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @11:05AM (#10318680) Homepage
      We try to stuff to many things into kids minds too early.

      I feel just the opposite. When I was growing up, I was constantly bored by school and, in hindsight, I wish they would have tought me more. Take math, for example, I'm pretty sure that between the grades of 3 and 7, I really did learn that much. The same can be said for other subjects. I do, however, understand that the public school system has to keep some kind of average pace so that the majority of students can keep up. But I still think they went too slow in many areas.

      • Re:Hmmm. (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Finuvir ( 596566 ) <rparle@soylen t r e d . net> on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @11:41AM (#10319038) Homepage
        School goes too slow for half of people and too fast for the other half. If you're even a little bit above average you're going to find some things a lot easier than many other kids do. That's why education shouldn't be limited to the school. Hell it shouldn't even start in school. I learned to read at home. We had word games, puzzle games, a huge collection of encyclopedias, dictionaries, National Geographic. When we went to the zoo we read the signs that tell you about the animals--where they come from ("Mom, where's 'af-far-ika'?"), what they eat, how they live--instead of just gawking at them. Even in university I've learned far more outside of classes than in, entirely outside my area of study. People need to realise that education isn't limited to school. It's there, everywhere, for the taking.
        • That's a good observation, and a prime reason why many people decide to homeschool their kids. By tailoring their education to the abilities of the child they are given the best possible chance to succeed and get as far as possible.

          I started teaching my oldest daughter basic algebra in the 3rd grade, because she was ready for it. The 2 younger kids were a lot older than her before we taught them algebra because they weren't ready for it. They still learn well at home, just at a different pace. My oldest wo
          • I hadn't even considered home-schooling in my first post. You're right, it's a logical consequence of my observations. I like the idea of home-schooling, but I think it would have been a bad choice for me, thinking about some parts of my primary-school education. I don't know why people get hung up on the issue of social adjustment. If there's a problem there it can be addressed just as any other problem can be. School is not a golden ticket to social capability either.

        • Re:Hmmm. (Score:3, Insightful)

          by Slime-dogg ( 120473 )

          School goes too slow for half of people and too fast for the other half. If you're even a little bit above average you're going to find some things a lot easier than many other kids do. That's why education shouldn't be limited to the school.

          The point of a montessori education is to avoid this. The pragmatic aproach that Americans have taken towards education, on the heels of Dewey and his ilk, has led to the modern "classroom" with "grade levels" that groups of students progress through. The montessor

    • Most kids minds "set"/harden by the time they are 12. So if you want to get anything into their minds _fast_ you have to start early.

      If your kids aren't learning the fundamentals at age 3-5 they're have difficulty fitting the rest in before the usual growing processes kick in and their brains "harden" - apparently there's actually a significant brain cell die-off at that point.

      I'd suggest teaching the kids what YOU think matters. Coz otherwise MTV and friends are going to try to teach the kids what MTV et

    • Re:Hmmm. (Score:4, Interesting)

      by vhold ( 175219 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @01:55PM (#10320535)
      It was fairly common when I was kid to go on field trips to various workplaces, or have people come in and tell us what they do.. You see that kind of thing on sesame street. I remember when I was a kid checking that kind of stuff out was very interesting to me because I had a curiosity of how everything worked.

      You're just exposing them to things, you aren't shoving it down their throats and forcing them to become IT slaves. Not all education is some kind of indoctrination plot. Simply giving them a little exposure to something isn't really the same as drilling it into their brains. A think that a wide exposure to many things is really healthy for kids, if they don't know what a wide world it is where knowledge is valuable, they can't see any point to their education.

      Interesting side note, one field trip that virtually every kid in the city went on at some point was to tour the tidy didee diaper company, a cloth diaper cleaning service, which was probably the largest volume of foul smell I've ever been exposed it, even to this day. I think that was some kind of weird scare tactic trying to teach us that if we weren't capable of skilled work thats where we'd end up, they didn't present it that way though, they took it all very seriously and the operation was quite complex.

    • hogwash (Score:5, Insightful)

      by YrWrstNtmr ( 564987 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @02:04PM (#10320630)
      This is an after school science club. These kids have chosen to be there and to spend extra time learning about science. IT falls squarely under that umbrella.
      Kids in a voluntary, after school science club are probably already reading above grade level, and performing math at junior high levels.
      I was in such a club at that age, and it was a lot of fun.
    • Keep their lives simple so they can actually learn what fundamentals, not what YOU think matters.

      Thanks for the practical demonstration.
    • Not true, I have a 9 year old brother that knows the fundamentals quite well, and even knows a good amount about computers. Way more than alot of older people anyways.

  • Talk about (Score:5, Insightful)

    by maxume ( 22995 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:29AM (#10318317)
    Talk about what they are used for first. Add other stuff if you need to fill time. Make sure to mention things like atms and videogames having computers in them. And cars, cellphones, cd players, etc. The best thing you can do with your ten minutes is make the kids think that computers are everywhere, at least for a second or two, before they stop listening. Your next goal should be to reach the parents who haven't yet figured out that computers are an increasing part of reality and that computer skills are essential. Your likely audience and time limit prohibit much more than that.

    Ten year olds are not going to care about cpus, memory and such. The ones that do care will already know more than you can tell them in ten minutes.
    • Spot on.

      As someone studying elementary education, I couldn't recommend this approach more.
    • Got to agree with that.

      To get the poster to answer their own question, what were they learning at age 10? Our school didn't do basic electricity ("This is a battery. This is a bulb. This is a switch. Look at the bulb glow.") until age 10-11. So don't imagine they'll follow much of the internals.

      At that kind of age, the computer *has* to be a magic box. You press the "on" button on the PS2, put your CD in, the game plays. Focussing on all the amazing things these magic boxes do would be a good start.

    • Re:Talk about (Score:3, Interesting)

      by babbage ( 61057 )

      Of course, pointing out that computers are ubiquitous now will probably be more fascinating to the parents than to the children. At the age level we're talking about, the pervasive presense of computers in modern society may very well be taken for granted.

      It may be more illuminating to go on for a bit about how these are great automating machines, and that whereas today we can do all these cool things because of computers and the internet (of which they probably won't need many examples), it wasn't that l

  • what to tell them (Score:3, Insightful)

    by tchdab1 ( 164848 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:31AM (#10318335) Homepage
    Find out what they know already (ask them), and build on it at the level they can handle.
    Explain how the computers they use are connected on the Internet, and what makes up the Internet. Explain that thousands of organizations have their own "mini-internets", that connect to the internet and also to all the computers within the organizations. Explain what those computers are, what they do, how they are different from the computers that most kids know about, and how there are other things on the network besides computers too. And then explain that IT designs it, builds it, makes it run, fixes it when it breaks, and upgrades it as it goes along.
  • I have a realated question: I want to start introducing my kids (7 and 9; those are ages, not names:) and potentially classmates to programming. I'm looking for thoughts on how to proceed.
    • Two words: Lego Mindstorms

      And it's fun for you to play with as well.

      --Mike--

    • Drawing pretty pictures in logo was a good start as to how one needs to give "instructions" to the computer; it's immediately rewarding to see a nice house on screen. The thing is to make it somehow rewarding in the extremely short term; you can't expect a kid to work for weeks with the vague hope of some abstract result.

      Logo also taught me computers need precise instructions; enter the wrong command and the picture wasn't pretty anymore! By the time they get bored with it you'll know whether any of the ki
      • I first used logo in 1986 in a HS computer programming class. The class was run by the Math Dept. and the class I was in was taught by a Geometry teacher. They'd yet to incorporate logo into their Math Program at the time, not sure why, but when I would get thru with my assigned exercises, I would play around and make what the teacher called "art" using logo.

        He seemed so surprised that logo could generate such patterns. I always got the impression they'd had some sales rep type explain how to start using
    • Start them out at a basic level assemby Teach them the basics and everything from there is a cinch. Sure the learing curve is pretty tough, but the ones who really aren't committed will get weeded out in the process.
    • Let them run amuck in a Squeak [squeak.org] environment. There are a ton of educational resources over at SqueakLand [squeakland.org]. It's a multimedia platform and a programming environment.
    • I know it's an old language, and you may not actually be able to get working copies of it anymore.

      But Logo was specifically designed for exactly this task wasn't it? It was one of my first languages back in the day.

    • STart off with logic exercises. Teach them to break problems down into steps, and design solutions. Buy a book of those row column logic puzzles and help them solve them.

      Then I'd move on to a very simple language. Logo, basic, something of that sort. Some place they can learn the basics without all the syntax. Your best bet is probably some domain language run by an interpreter. You may even want to write one yourself, something that looks like a game. An interpreted language to drive a car (command

  • Let children be children first (Score:5, Insightful)

    by christophe.vg ( 742168 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:33AM (#10318361) Homepage

    Maybe not a direct answer to your question, but related to this topic I wanted to add this thought:

    Computers are entering our lives at every level and sooner and sooner. Children are born nowadays in an age where they rather learn to type on a keyboard than learn how to breath.

    Being a little geek myself I am the last to say that I'm not having fun fiddling with these damn nice machines, but still remembering the days without computers I do belive that children first need to be able to be children. Childhood only lasts for such a short time it is a shame that even this period of their live is invaded by these machines. Children should play, outside, with each other, In Real Life.

    There was a time I believed that every child should have a computer in class as soon as possible is something I've left behind me for a couple of years now.

    Let children be children first, they'll have time enough afterwards to discover the wonderfull virtual world ... in there.

  • Power, Choice, and Logic (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Proteus ( 1926 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:34AM (#10318368) Homepage Journal
    Remember, young audiences will be bored to tears if you regale them on things they already know, or the history of anything unless it's exciting.

    Our 9 and 10 year olds already know that "computers are used for everything". They probably don't care (yet) about how they came into being. Instead, why not focus on what no one tells these kids: that the age of the Internet and the personal computer gives them a degree of unparalleled personal power.

    Show them how computers only ever do what a human tells them to. Give them fun logic puzzles and explain simply how they are really just programs. Explain how the ability to use logic and creativity together make the computer a powerful tool. Illustrate how computing gives them choices -- they don't have to use the software (not even the OS) that came with the computer, they can do whatever they can figure out how to do.

    Talk about the cool things computers will be able to do in the future. Have them work with a really simple encryption (secret messages! cool!) method, and explain how businesses and individuals use more complicated versions to keep their private messages private. Just about all kids love the idea of secret messages -- use it!

    Don't lie. Don't tell them it's all easy. Do tell them that it's all possible, if they work hard enough to learn. Make computing interesting and accessible, don't bore them with history and "hey, computers control your car, your games, and even the clock on the wall!"

    You have a very potent opportunity to motivate and educate. Don't waste it! Make sure every kid -- and especially the girls -- know that working with computers is rewarding and not just for "smart kids".
    • Have them work with a really simple encryption (secret messages! cool!) method, and explain how businesses and individuals use more complicated versions to keep their private messages private. Just about all kids love the idea of secret messages -- use it!

      This is bad advice. Not in the subject matter itself, but in the current school environment. If the topic strays to security and encryption issues, rather than remaining in the Word and Powerpoint universe most teachers know, there could be accusations o

  • Calculators and Video Games (Score:4, Interesting)

    by {8_8} ( 31689 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:35AM (#10318379) Journal
    You might look around the room for examples of computing technology. Calculators, cell phones, watches, etc. might be som good, concrete examples of how technology is all around us.

    You might also want to explore video game consoles as computers. You could look at the evolution of video games from the Pong days to now. That's a simple, easy way to show the development of computing technology for this audience. Most 10-year olds won't know or care about Linux distros, but they're probably familiar with video games.

  • Source critisism. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by noselasd ( 594905 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:38AM (#10318414)
    There was recently a small study here in Norway about childrens attitude
    to information on the internet. Most of the childes asked, believed that
    what they found on the internet is true, 100% fact, and they had no training in spotting what's not facts or how to check the sources.

    So, teach them to be critic of information, there's so much bogous information out there, anyone can be confused.

    • Most of the childes asked, believed that what they found on the internet is true, 100% fact, and they had no training in spotting what's not facts or how to check the sources.

      I don't beleive you. You posted your information on the net with no type of source or corroborating evidence to back up your claim. So then obviously what you are saying is false and everything I find on the internet really is 100% true...but if that is the case, then your statement really is true, thus not everything is true....ah

    • Judging from the "Fwd: Fwd: Fwd: Re: Re:" emails I keep getting from my relatives, it isn't just children who have this problem.

      On topic: The main task for 9 and 10 year olds is figuring out how the world works. So yes, help them be critical of information. But also show how the internet works, how a hard-drive works, how a monitor works. Huge numbers of kids who are "into computers", don't have a clue beyond how to chat or how to browse. They don't need alt-key trivia, they need to understand the pri
    • Most of the childes asked, believed that
      what they found on the internet is true, 100% fact, and they had no training in spotting what's not facts or how to check the sources.

      Actually, it is even worse if it is a printed book in the school's library or worse yet the assigned school textbooks. Students are taught to take it on faith that those facts in those books are true. Adults are worse though. Adults take it on faith that either CNN or Fox News depending on their political leaning is "right" without lo

    • Most of the childes asked, believed that what they found on the internet is true, 100% fact, and they had no training in spotting what's not facts or how to check the sources.

      Not at all surprising, and it's very unlikely that you'll ever succeed in convincing kids not to believe everything they read. Kids don't seem to be capable of evaluating factual information until they're in their early teens. Not that they don't consider some sources more authoritative than others, but their opinions of different

      • Well, one of the greatest things (well, probably the only good thing) about being so totally decieved is that it's the only way to become critical and suspect of new information.

        My sister went to a school where they had a very unusual song that they'd occasionally sing. It was something along the lines of "Don't trust the weatherman" and had little anecdotes about how the weatherman was wrong on various occasions. Apparently the teacher and the kids came up with it themselves after a field trip went bad

        • I don't know if the song had any broader implication for any of them, but I do know they never trusted the weatherman.

          I doubt it had any larger effect, and the resulting skepticism of weather forecasts was almost certainly excessive. An adult can understand that weather forecasts are useful information while still accepting that they're sometimes wrong, and that the further away the forecast is the more likely it is to be wrong. Elementary-age kids, however, are more likely to trust them implicitly --

          • Just kids? (Score:3, Interesting)

            by vhold ( 175219 )
            I feel that adults' minds are very similar to that description, it's just no longer cute, so instead of fascinating, it's frustrating.

            A guy I know keeps falling for crap like "You are a great poet! Be immortalized in the hall of fame! ** $50 plz", and virtually all multilevel marketing schemes that he happens to encounter. He must be on the "World's Greatest Suckers" mailing list. I just utterly cannot comprehend whatsoever, he simply does not want to listen to reason, there is some kind of fantasy to it
      • I haven't conducted any studies, but I from what I observe from my children, source reliability is a boolean value

        This is where the whole notion behind the word "liar" comes from it. On the playground, you're either a "liar" or you aren't, when in fact everybody tells lies at times, for good reasons and bad.

    • I can remember quite clearly that up until I was 10 or so, I thought anything written in a nonfiction style to be 100% fact. I didn't question informational authorities until I was able to start really questioning and tracking down inconsistencies from various sources myself.

      There may not be a good way to teach kids to be critical along those lines because if you overdo it, they might miss the point entirely and no longer believe anything they read. I don't know if that'd be useful at a young age. The c
  • . . . to strive for a job in the medical or dental fields, rather than pursuing an interest for which any related careers will have been completely outsourced to the Third World by their working years. Of course, this doesn't apply if you're wealthy enough to leave him a trust fund to support him his whole life.

  • Old Computers (Score:5, Interesting)

    by mrgrey ( 319015 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:40AM (#10318423) Homepage Journal
    I used to do something similar with elementary students. The district had bunches of old toasted computers and I would let the students take apart everything they could (aside from the PSU which I removed ahead of time) and answer any questions they had about the components they found inside.

    The kids really enjoyed it and it gave them a basic understanding of the innerworkings of computers.

  • What to talk about with 9 and 10 year olds (Score:5, Insightful)

    by justanyone ( 308934 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:40AM (#10318431) Homepage Journal
    This depends on the savvyness of your audience.

    Ask at the outset:
    - Which have Nintendo, PS2s, gameboys, etc.
    - which have computers already?

    One Idea: Have a Show and Tell. If they're not tech savvy, keep it very high level (this is a CD Rom drive, you put CDs in it, like music CD's or ones with software on it).

    Show and Tell Ideas:
    • Bring an old computer, open it up, and point at the major components.
    • Tell them what software and hardware are, bring some CD's, and some burned CDs.
    • If you have an old hard drive, say a 200 Meg or something silly like that, OPEN IT UP. Yes, this will completely ruin it. Make sure to mention that if you do this (!). Show them the read-write head.
    • Open up a CDRom Drive. Pass it around and show the major parts.
    • Explain Google and Wikipedia if you've got a net connection, show some big sites, ask for interests and then show them sites. Warning: this could eat time quickly, and you've only got 10 minutes.
    • Show them the connectors and how they're all different shapes to make sure you don't plug the wrong thing in the wrong place (reduce fear)
    • Get a chip, and show how the chips are connected on the motherboard with traces (wires).
    Of course, if your audience is savvy, you can't impress them with cool tech, you could always do the science discussion route and explain binary numbers. But, they're a little young for that.

    I have always thought the primary purpose of education was to provide perspective so people make better-informed and wiser decisions. Perspective includes reducing fear levels to allow for rational thought and contemplation.
    Rational thought allows for inspired choices later based on whole sets of info you can't provide by rote learning.

    So: Inspire, have fun, and show that no matter how complicated something looks, it's made up of simpler things that can be understood and manipulated by people who are interested in doing that.

    Tell them that it never stops getting interesting, and if they're bored, to imagine what other people find interesting about it and see if that's interesting to them.

    Just my 5 cents.
    • Also, entice their imagination. Any kid who will be interested in tech probably is very inventive or has a good imagination already. Tell them about how all the businessmen basically failed at innovating, and it took a bunch of kids to change the computer industry, and bring about the PC revolution, and that they could be the next Steve Jobs, Woz, or (Gulp!) Bill Gates.

    • Re:What to talk about with 9 and 10 year olds (Score:5, Funny)

      by BigJimSlade ( 139096 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @12:21PM (#10319484) Homepage
      this is a CD Rom drive, you put CDs in it, like music CD's or ones with software on it

      Just make sure you go over the talk with your local RIAA representative. They'll be sure to point out things you may have left out such as:
      • CD-ROMs are the work of the devil!
      • CD-ROMs were never meant for listening to music in, so if your new CD doesn't work in it... it's ok!
      • Every time you make make or download an MP3, God kills a kitten!
      • Did we mention that CD-ROMs are the work of the devil?
      • Make sure to buy your favorite album 10, or even 15 times!
  • You might do some searching on google concerning scouting. Cub Scouts have a program for "belt loops" and "academic pins". One of those programs is in computers. Since 9-10 year olds are cub scout aged, you might find some help there.
    Basically to get the belt loop you have three things to do:
    1. explain parts of a computer
    2. how to start-up and shutdown a computer
    3. use the computer to prepare and print a document

    There are more requirements for the pin (you have to do five of the eleven choices), but you m

  • Here's a few (Score:3, Funny)

    by crstophr ( 529410 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:44AM (#10318465) Homepage
    -Locating bomb making instructions on the internet...
    -How to disable parental controls on your web browser...
    -Bit Torrent, free games and movies and you...
    -Keystroke Loggers, how to watch what daddy is doing online...
    -Free porn resources...
    -Encrypting your .jpeg and movie collection...

  • Hah (Score:3, Insightful)

    by KDan ( 90353 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:44AM (#10318468) Homepage
    1) They'll probably be telling YOU stuff you don't know about IT.

    2) Screw the theoretical/historical talks. You're talking about 10-year olds, not uni students. Get a projector and hands-on show them something interesting and fun. A game might actually not be a bad thing. Perhaps a simple game programmed in some BASIC-like language, preceded by some extremely brief examples of how writing somethign in the program and then running it results in the computer actually doing what it's told. Those who are likely to get interested in computers will be fired up by that. Those who aren't, well, they aren't. Perhaps page-down through the slightly more complex game to show them how long the program is, and tell them "that's about 1000 lines of code - nowadays computer games tend to have X bazillion lines of code, but the result is a bit more impressive!" and give them a brief demo of some modern game - perhaps even play the demo movie from a game.

    Daniel
  • "That will take more than 10 minutes to go into any depth.

    History is the least interesting part.

    Talking about components is the most interesting part. Also talk about applications, directories, files, and aliases."

  • CLI (Score:2)

    by martin ( 1336 )
    tell about the command line, shells etc and how much more powerful they are over a WIMP interface.

  • not much ... (Score:2, Insightful)

    by PerlDudeXL ( 456021 )
    I don't think 10-year olds should need to know much about IT in general. Its just not important for them.
    Basic schooling is enough. I'm not even sure what to teach them about IT? some Network-basics?
    How a browser/mail client/... works? Word processing? programming? Its all not important for them.

    They will learn in automatically when they grow up or show an own personal interest in those things.

  • Oh, have a demo. Please. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by dmorin ( 25609 ) <dmorin@g[ ]l.com ['mai' in gap]> on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @10:58AM (#10318611) Homepage Journal
    You don't say if you will have a demo, or are you just talking? If you're just talking, you have my pity. :)

    I'm still a believer that programming gets a bad rap. I don't care about what you tell me a computer can do, I care about what I can tell the computer to do. (You know what I mean). Been that way all my life. If you have a demo, then find some sort of open source video game that enables you to hack up easily visible changes (like skinning the characters or something else quick and easy to demonstrate). If you don't, then start writing on the whiteboard and go with logic problems. Maybe do Towers of Hanoi in long hand. Give them a problem, let them solve it, and then show them how they basically just wrote a computer program. Or "missionaries and cannibals" or one of those others that has some good visual quality.

    The advantage to taking that path, by the way, is that you're least likely to run into the "We already knew that" argument that you're gonna get if you plan to talk about information that can be found on the Internet.

    Barring that, go science fiction. Talk about the Mars Rover or something that they may know about, but not necessarily have realized can be connected back to the same computers they use every day.

  • Keeping it safe (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Slugworth01 ( 738383 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @11:03AM (#10318656)
    Sadly, one of the things you should talk about to kids this age is (in IT terms) "acceptible use." I'd say something along the lines of reinforcing with kids (and the parent) that users can do a lot of things with computers, but a few of those things may not be safe for them. The kids should understand that parents or teachers will provide them with instructions on what is allowed and not allowed when kids use computers in home or school settings. I'm referring to things that would help keep kids safe from predatory people.

    Sorry to be alarmist, but here are two examples:

    My step-daughter, 12 years old at the time, had bveen given the talk about not giving out private information online. In spite of this she gave out her phone number to someone online. When the person called my wife answered and talked to the person. He was not the 13 year old boy that he had told my step-daughter he was; his real age was off by probably 20 years. We then iterated the safety issue of what she had done and as a consequence she couldn't use IMs or email for 2 weeks.

    I got an Instant Message from my 11 year old niece; her newly chosen screen name was "SmoothnPink99." The screen name had some meaning to her that was innocent, but of course might mean something else to an unsavory character. I called my sister and let her know politely that her daughter had a new screen name that is not the best choice to a pre-teen girl.

    So bad stuff can happen to kids while online.

    I'm not saying this is the only thing you should talk about, just suggesting that you speak a few sentences on the subject. The point is parents, teachers, etc., have some say in what kids at that age should and should not do when using a computer, what information the kids should not disclose, etc. You don't have to spell it all out in gory details, just say enough to make the point that a responsible adult can and should help set guidelines.

  • One thing to keep in mind is that 10 minutes is not that much time.

    Limit what the scope of what you are talking about.

    Practice your presentation beforehand and time it. Make sure your practice sessions run under ten minutes. The worst thing you can do is end up rushing through the presentation, covering too much in a rush

    As to the subject matter of your presentation, I would encourage you to try something fun and relevant. Take apart an old (or new, if you don't mind voiding the warranty) computer or
  • ..."go away kid, ya bother me. Don't touch that, you'll break it.". That, and packet state driver flux capacitor dark matter engineering. About covers it.

  • don't direct towards only the nerds (Score:5, Interesting)

    by xutopia ( 469129 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @11:08AM (#10318730) Homepage
    the reason why computers give us a good living is because anyone can use it to do plenty of great things.

    I say you show what you can do with a computer. Here are a few ideas:

    1.Schedule a Skype call with a friend you have as far away on the globe as possible. Explain how a computer takes audio information and transfers it over the internet.

    2. View the solar system in 3D (I think there is some open source software [openuniverse.org] that allows you to do that). Explain how a computer can take loads of data and draw it for you.

    3. If the classroom has dictionaries tell everyone to look up a complicated word up and race them with the computer. Explain that the computer's strenght is it's speed not it's intelligence. Tell them that you cannot ask a computer to draw a bird but you can use it do store and manipulate a bird picture.

    4. open up the computer and explain how each module has it's own specialty: graphics card, audio circuit, network circuits, etc... They'll feel like they've done something really cool.

    5. turtle! :) Install Python with the turtle program and challenge them to draw a square with a turtle. Explain to them that a computer is a tool for automation and that is why it is used. Humans still are the ones that have to think to make them automate tasks we ask them to do.

    The computer alone can captivate your audience but the great thing is to make them participate. Make them feel like they changed the world by doing something. Let them give you the obvious answers.

  • Value this time in your life kids, because this is the time in your life when you still have your choices, and it goes by so quickly. When you're a teenager you think you can work on any OS, and you do. Your twenties are a blur. Your thirties, you learn to program, you make a little money and you think to yourself, "What happened to my twenties?" Your forties, you grow into middle managment you grow another chin. The streaming video starts to get too fast and one of your old girlfriends from h

  • When I was 10 ... (Score:3)

    by polyp2000 ( 444682 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @11:19AM (#10318825) Homepage Journal
    When I was 9 i was able to program simple basic stuff on my older brothers ZX81 from books and magazines. My first program was "Measles" which printed random blocks on the TV screen. My understanding of computers at that time was not really of textbook level , in the sense that it wasnt really taught to 9yr old kids in 1983, I understood what a computer was, what it could be used for and what its limitations were, and why a 16k ram pack opened up new possibilities. I understood why Machine Code meant faster programs that could do more things than basic (although the concept of machine code was rather scary). I knew what the different I/O mechanisms were and what they were for- although maybe not by their technical names. Some of this I probably learned off my older brother and other stuff I suppose just seemed logical, or not in need of explanation.

    EG - the keyboard was for giving the computer instructions, and the tape-recorder allowed you to store those instructions and play them back at a later date.
    The TV was used to display the stuff that was going on inside the computer.

    In my own way I new what input / output was, what backing store was and what memory was. In addition I had a basic understanding of programs, programming and the things a computer was good at.

    Oh, yeah, and that the best game of course for the ZX81 was "3D Monster Maze" in which you wandered through a 3D Maze being pursued by a giant T-Rex..

    It was'nt till a year or two later that I obtained my C64 that the real stuff started!

    When I was actually taught stuff at school a few years later that I had any formal education regarding computers and I naturally was very good at it because I knew most of it already.

    Nick...

  • For my own experience... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by jakel2k ( 736582 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @11:44AM (#10319068)
    I have a 9 soon to be 10 year old son. He has been using the computer for almost 3 years now.

    Initially we started him with "This is the computer, and here are the ONLY games you are allowed to play", (Reader Rabit and programs sold by his school.) He got to learn the comonents fo the computer like how to handle a CD and such. We had a Knoppix CD where he was able to load and play games on.

    He then started learning about programs like paint and office applications for some of his school projects. So he was allowed to use those programs, since there was really no harm in doing so. (Notice that access to web content is still not permitted.)

    We constantly made it known that he is not to open any programs that he was not allowed to. Even though he had access he was not *allowed* to use them.

    Then his friends from school said that they were on MSN and Yahoo and Email and were able to visit sites advertised during his TV shows. So we sat him down and informed him that not everything on the Internet was for kids and that he is only allowed to access sites that we say are okay and that he is to make up a fake identity when he is told to give personal information, NEVER GIVE OUT REAL INFORMATION. The computer was always in an open room and we constantly checked up on his activities.

    We follow the rule where anything new he does on the computer he has to okay-it with his mom and I. A few months ago he got his first hotmail account and got on MSN. Again another talk on how not everyone on the internet is a *good* person and a rule is that he is NOT ALLOWED TO GIVE OUT PERSONAL INFORMATION AND THAT HE IS ONLY ALLOWED TO MSN PEOPLE THAT HE GOT THEIR MSN IDs FACE TO FACE. We test him again and again and when he does do something wrong he is then corrected. His computer usage is a privledge and he remains under our watchful eyes while he is learning this relativly new frontier.

    Remember that you will not always be ahead of your child and that you should teach him the proper methods and give them guidelines before you reach this point.

  • CARE (Score:2, Informative)

    by crapnutassneck ( 243159 ) *
    This group here in my home state of Oregon has a fantastic DARE type program focussed on computer use and ethics...

    http://www.cyberaware.org/about.html

  • Copyrights (Score:3, Funny)

    by Maskirovka ( 255712 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @12:18PM (#10319470)
    what should I tell the children about computers?

    Talk to them about how evil copyright infringement hurts poor starving artists.

    /ducks!

  • and everything else you say will make perfect sense.

  • When I was 10... (Score:5, Funny)

    by clambake ( 37702 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @12:27PM (#10319557) Homepage
    Wow, is that really how messed up I am? When I was 10 I ran a warez/hacking BBS that was so popular that I was answering calls as far away as Guam and so actvie that I was forced to perm-ban ANYONE who dared to upload because my poor 20 meg hard drive was too full to boot properly... The LAST thing I needed was somone telling me what a keyboard was.

    If I were you, I would start by asking for a show of hands, how many kids know what an openSSH timing attack is and anyone who understands what you just said should be sent outside and forced to play in the sun.
  • Talk to them about something kids care about, puppies for example. Let kids be kids... don't start banging on at them about IT, for Christ's sake.

  • Show them some basic computer theory. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Yaztromo ( 655250 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @01:25PM (#10320207) Homepage Journal

    You didn't really go into any sort of depth as to your audience other than their age, so it's diffficult to give any really good advice, as the best presentation you can do is always one tailored to the existing knowledge of your audience.

    However, being an after school science club, I'm going to assume that these kids are pretty smart, want to be there, and probably already know what the inside of a computer looks like, or how to surf the Internet, or how computers are used in society today.

    As such, I'd strongly consider teaching them something practical that they can use and build upon, and teach them some really elementary computer math and theory.

    Ten years old was the age I started programming at -- completely self-taught -- in BASIC on a Commodore 64 at school. But it wasn't until I was much older that I was even introduced to binary or hex number systems and math. And yet these things are the real underlying basis of how all digital computers are designed and programmed.

    Given you only have ten minutes, I'd give them an introduction to the binary number system and simple binary math, and how computers use binary information to do everything they do.

    Most kids like learning about how things work, and with a quick intro to binary number systems you can explain to them how computers add numbers, how CDs store music, and how networks inter-communicate (like explaining the basics of Quadrade Amplitude Modulation).

    Yaz.

  • What? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Chess_the_cat ( 653159 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @01:44PM (#10320412) Homepage
    The only thing they need to know is how to turn the computer on and off. My parents didn't know anything about computers but they bought me a C64. I taught myself everything from scratch. I'm sure your kids can do the same. The only thing you need to do is make sure you can see them playing on it so you can be sure they're not looking at porn or something. Better yet, don't give them their own net connection at all. If they don't want to figure it out themselves then they just aren't into computers; not everyone is and that's ok too.
  • Everything is easier to learn with basketball analogies!
  • Use the computer as an example for a more interesting lesson about engineering and life:
    • most of the structural elements of the everyday PC have their roots in, or are even copied wholesale from, older inventions.
    • The newer inventions are built upon the old. Sometimes traces remain.
    • People are built the same way.

    Some examples to talk about:

    • ICs (err, "microchips") are built of transistors, which used to be huge; they were originally used like tubes, which themselves were originally called "valves" by ana

  • compilers (Score:3, Funny)

    by smoon ( 16873 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @03:00PM (#10321428) Homepage
    Explain that a compiler tokenizes input from a high level programming language and produces a parse tree which eventually results in object code, which is then linked to static or dynamic libraries with a linker and loaded into RAM by a loader.

    I would then immediately jump into the finer points of data structures and algorithms, for example balanced trees, big O notation, efficiencies of various sort algorithms, red/black trees, etc.

    Don't forget to use lots of greek characters. In fact this might be a good time to clear up some abstract programming topics, such as lambda functions, macros (in the lisp sense), continuations, anonymous functions, etc.

    Suggest Intercal as a good beginners language.

    Whatever demo machine you use, make sure to put a block of dry ice in it and claim it is cooled by liquid nitrogen.

    I hope these suggestions have been helpful. :)

  • Slashkids (Score:3, Funny)

    by wikinerd ( 809585 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @03:05PM (#10321491) Journal
    Well, there is no need to tech them anything at all; just land them on Planet Slashdot and they will learn whatever they need to know to survive in the Net :)

  • Morse Code (Score:5, Interesting)

    by St. Arbirix ( 218306 ) <.moc.liamg. .ta. .dnesnwot.wehttam.> on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @05:20PM (#10323149) Homepage Journal
    Show them Morse Code.
    Show them how information can be sent using a whole bunch of yes's and no's, on's and off's.
    Show them that 1's don't really get caught going around the corners of cables,
    that they don't need to sink $30 into a "digital audio" cable when any RCA will do,
    that data can be sent using light, radio, or current without giving you cancer or cramps,
    that extremely simple adds up to extraordinarily complex, just like the rest of the universe.

    Show them that there's no magic involved.

  • IT moves too fast. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by sakusha ( 441986 ) on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @05:49PM (#10323527)
    There is very little you can tell a 10 year old that will have any relevance to the IT careers that will exist when they are 20 years old. In fact, the lead time for a 100% turnover in technology is more like 5 years.

    This reminds me of when I was in high school and a recruiter from MIT came by. He gave a long lecture on this very subject. He was retired, and said he knew almost nothing about modern technology, but he did have some particularly relevant advice.

    He said that the technologies that you will work on in your post-college life, the technology that will be your career path, will not even exist when you are in high school, so that anything you learned would be completely obsolete.. with ONE exception: math. Math is never obsolete, and is the fundamental basis of every technology sector. He gave his own example, he finished high school just as WWII broke out, but when he went to MIT, he worked on developing Radar, which did not even exist a when he was in high school. He spent the rest of his career working on Radar systems.

    I wasn't too sure if this was a realistic assessment of my future. A few months later (IIRC this was around ~1973) I visited MIT in person, for admissions interviews and to check out the campus. One of my hosts said I should come to his Comp Sci lecture to see something really important. The lecture was about the brand new Intel 8008 chip, the first time the chip had been shown on the MIT campus. I didn't realize the significance of what I was seeing until several years later when I built my own 8080 microcomputer.

    So yes indeed, the microprocessor technology I would work on for my entire career was invented just as I was graduating from high school.

    Moral of the story: study math. Forget the IT lecture, it will bore the kids and it will be obsolete before they even ENTER high school. Focus on the everchanging nature technology, that it will always be new tech, newer and more exciting than anything they can even imagine, and math will always be the key. Maybe you can use some elements of this story. Talk about what computers were like 10 years ago, and how things changed beyond even YOUR expectations in the last 10 years, and ask them to guess what it will be like in 10 years. Get them to use their imagination, get them excited about the future.

  • Keep them engaged (Score:5, Informative)

    by jd ( 1658 ) <imipak@yahoGINSBERGo.com minus poet> on Wednesday September 22, 2004 @11:10PM (#10325858) Homepage Journal
    I tought for the National Association of Gifted Children, at one point, so this is a summary based on my experiences with that.

    DON'T lecture - talk a bit, ask some, get them to ask a lot and do a lot.

    Active participation is the key to teaching. Nobody learns, when bored or asleep.

    Keep sentances short. Break ideas down into parcels. Kids will lose track of things quickly. It takes a little longer to get complex ideas across, but it improves the kids' chances of learning what those complex ideas are.

    Attention spans also tend to be short. Same-old same-old will bore them after a while. That's one reason adverts are 30 seconds or less and why the more successful adverts put the bulk of the important information in the first 5 seconds of that.

    In other words, with each topic, you've 5 seconds to get their full attention AND give them a rough idea of what the topic is. You've about 25 more seconds to convince them that it's worth finding out more, AND to cover the main reasons why it would be interesting to them.

    Vocally, be interesting. Vary your tone. Monotone "robots" are almost universally ridiculed by kids. You want to be taken seriously. Constant patterns in speech can put anyone to sleep. (That's why many lulabies follow that formula.) Avoid repeating yourself, overusing words, or using words that are barely in your average PhD's vocabulary, never mind your average 10-year-old's.

    Above all, pick topics that interest YOU. Kids can spot a fake a mile off. If you don't believe a word you're saying, you're going to have a hard time convincing them.

    Visuals help a lot. Kids of that age-range can understand visually far better than they can understand intellectually. (Not always, but it's a fairly good rule-of-thumb.) For example, if you decide to cover transistors/logic gates, then you might want to try the following:

    Have one volunteer act as the first input. Have a second volunteer act as the second input. Give them a colored sheet of paper. Say, red for 1, and white for 0. Have a third volunteer act as your "high reference voltage". They carry a red piece of paper. A fourth, final, volunteer is your "low reference voltage" and carries a white piece of paper.

    For an AND gate, the first two volunteers are positioned one after the other. The fourth volunteer is to one side. The third volunteer is told to walk past the first two people, but must stop if one of them is holding a white piece of paper. The fourth volunteer is told to wait, unless the third volunteer stops. Then they are to walk on.

    For an OR gate, the first two volunteers are side-by-side. Again, the third volunteer cannot walk past someone holding a white piece of paper, but CAN walk past someone holding a red piece of paper. Again, the fourth volunteer can only go if the third one can't go.

    Again, to keep people's interest up, you would only want to do two or three runs of this game. Any more, and they'll get bored and lose the idea. Only one run and they won't get the point at all. (The point being to show how something electrical can make "decisions", even though it doesn't "think".)

    Time constraints mean that two demonstrations of this kind are about the upper limit. One demonstration should either show what logic is (eg: as above) or show how semiconductors work. (eg: Have the kids act as silicon atoms, and use different color balls to represent electrons and holes into which the electrons can fall. Have the kids swap balls, to represent the flow of electricity through a semiconductor.)

    The second demonstration should be something the kids are more familiar with (eg: a games console, a mobile phone, etc). Have the kids play different components in the system. For example, to show how mobile phones work, have two kids playing phones and have two more kids playing phone towers. The kids playing phones wander around, until you call stop.

  • Science is Cool! (Score:3, Insightful)

    by smchris ( 464899 ) on Saturday September 25, 2004 @11:12AM (#10348454)

    They are pretty young. I think this is an opportunity for you to give the "science is cool" lecture -- that it is cool to be a scientist discovering new things and that scientists do good things for everybody.

    IT might be a little tougher to envison than some fields, "Kids can you imagine a world without relational databases!?!" But make them aware of all the digital devices around them: cell phones, DVD players, microwave and VCR timers, alarm clocks, portable music players. Let it sink in that somebody had to invent those replacements for earlier tools and if the robots in the movies are ever to exist, a lot of people are going to have to add together their discoveries over time to achieve those future wonders.

    Remembering that they are young, here's another angle. If you know they have been exposed to computers already, do you know anybody who has a working manual typewriter? Borrow it and bring it in with some paper and white-out. Let the kids somatically experience what the old days were like. After that, you could probably lead a meaningful discussion group as much as a lecture.

  • The right maths ? also Security. (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Sam Nitzberg ( 242911 ) on Sunday September 26, 2004 @08:18PM (#10357991)

    Numerical Analysis-

    Nothing fancy. Just a demonstration of how cumulative errors can lead to errors in calculation. Example : Two calculations that should each result in the value 3.0, but one results in 3.0 and the other in 2.9999999. An equality check will fail. Sometimes, these situations aren't handled well, even in real-world situations.

    Set Theory-

    Just some basics. Just enough to lead up to state-transition diagrams. Once some very basic set theory and state-transition diagrams are introduced, you have the basis for modeling many systems and automata, formal methods (which I would not introduce to kids - but the concept that development does not have to be flying-by-the-seat-of-your-pants is of value), and many other applicatons. Just the exposure could lead them to discover and think about a great deal more.

    Security - E-voting could be an excellent topic, with already many straighforward papers and analysis worth discussing and debating. Many important and approachable arguments lie here, as well as many important infosec principles.

    Anyway, these are just some ideas. There may be pros and cons that I am not considering, but I think that there should be some exposure in these areas.

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